First timer build, pool + more

[detlion1643]

I had a previous thread pertaining to questions before I started ordering things. Well, now that all items have been ordered, this now begins my official build thread!

So, to start with, a list of items:
- 21' x 52" steel wall pool
- 25 gauge j-hook liner
- dual speed pump (1.5 hp high, not sure of low)
- 120 sq ft cartridge filter
- A frame ladder which can fold up to lock

Electrical:
- weatherproof outside 2 gang (4 outlet) box + cover + 2 20 amp outlets
- 12 gauge grounded 12/2 wire
- waterproof conduit and waterproof connection fittings to box above
- 20 amp circuit breaker

I am going to install a new 20 amp circuit just for the pool stuff. Starting with only a pump currently. Also, on that front, I looked at remote control on/off plugs, and ordered a 15amp remote control outlet (1 plug). The pump should not draw more than 15 amps max, so we should be ok. Once it gets here and I can manually check the max rating, I'll know if I can use the remote control or not. The plan is to use the remote control outlet for the pump, so I can turn the pump on/off via remote. Although, it being dual speed, not sure if this is actually time saving, since I might have to go over and manually adjust speeds at some point, but the hope is to maybe keep it at lower speeds...

I don't plan to have a heater or SWG, at least not during this first year of ownership. But I will have the outlets installed to accommodate in the future if needed.

And now, with everything ordered and coming in, we start prepping!

First day, started digging.

New item by Peter Yeaney

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Second day, more digging. Plus used some extra cement blocks from our patio/fire pit build last summer and buried them to a level surface. I am planning on using some boards of plywood or something on top for the area for the filters/pumps.

New item by Peter Yeaney

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New item by Peter Yeaney

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So far, I think we did a good chunk of prep considering combined time has only been about 4-5 hours of work so far, trying to keep things as level as I can as we go. I talked to a few landscapers and most of them mentioned that the job would be "too small" to be worthwhile, ugh... One landscaper mentioned he'd be around the area today, so waiting to hear from him. Another guy came and checked and quoted $500 minimum. It seems like I might be doing this myself!

 

[kimkats]

Bet you have thought this a few times.................WHAT have you gotten your self into!!! LOL

ummmmm the blocks are raising some red flags as I really don't understand what you did and why............more details and your thoughts please.

When you go to plump the equipment make sure to use solid sch 40 pipe. Use valves under the return and skimmer so you can close them when you work on the equipment. Also make sure to use unions on all equipment so you can remove as needed.

 

[detlion1643]

The spread out blocks were for layout, to see how far to dig. The buried blocks are for a flat platform for the pump and filter.


Yes, I'm currently wondering how long I'll be at this, not even halfway through the dig yet. The hauling dirt is the most time consuming process though. At least the weather is nice!

 

[kimkats]

Okay so now you get the green flag!! Full speed ahead!!!

 

[detlion1643]

Day 3 dig efforts - Had a half day of work, weather was nice, boss is packing for a camping trip with his wife, so had a few extra hours to do some work. I didn't expand as much as I thought I would have, but there is a reason. Apparently I found out pretty quick that there was lots of huge cement pieces (not blocks) under the ground. Enough that I couldn't get level ground unless I dug them out.

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I received a call back from a landscaper as well finally, they will have someone out Tuesday to check it out and give me an estimate on finishing. My hands are all blistered and I'm completely sore, so I am not doing any more digging until after that estimation. I do have a buddy that said he wouldn't mind doing some manual labor for some extra money, so I might take him up on that offer depending on how Tuesday goes.

On a good note, all the materials for electric came in, so I will take some time and do that work, running the wire and installing the weatherproof box + conduit, 20 amp gfci + 20 amp normal outlets, and cover outside. This allows for 4 outlets outside so I won't have to rewire in the future if 2 outlets are not enough. I might as well do the work once!

 

[kimkats]

Working with your wallet is MUCH easier on your body that is for sure!!!

UGGGGGGGggg on the cement..........who and why ???????

Make sure to put a light by the equipment. You will thank me the first time you have to go out there at dark time.

Kim

 

[detlion1643]

We've had a couple days of sprinkling/light rain. I've held off all digging until after making a decision on Tuesday.

Good news: Ran wiring, installed the box, 1 gfci outlet, 1 normal outlet, cover, and sealed it all up. I did not hook up the wiring to the circuit breaker box yet though. That will come with time.

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New item by Peter Yeaney

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Bad news: Had a guy come out for an estimate yesterday. He mentioned that he used to take care of this property landscaping wise (mowing, etc) like 10ish years back, and the back garage wall was once rebuilt because of it being a "retaining wall". He mentioned that adding as much weight as a pool will be could be disastrous. Told us he'd prefer to move it back at the very least a couple of feet, but we don't know how far down that drain piping is.

I am not sure what to do at this point...

Edit: I decided to actually dig down in the stones to see how if I can find any piping down there. I removed a bunch of stones, was able to look down to about a foot and a half, and no piping has been found yet... I think this guy might be correct that we should move it back some from the garage wall, can never be too safe. There is no undisturbed soil over top of the piping though, it's all stones. Would the weight of the pool be too much for normal rock on top of pvc pipe to hold? I would hate to move my design and that area sink lower because of having no undisturbed soil...

 

[detlion1643]

So, I finally had the last guy out to look at the area for ground digging/leveling. The guy mentioned he doesn't have the equipment to do it /shrug...

In that regards, I called the guy back from Saturday evening, gave him the information about the piping not found yet and we should be safe to move the area backwards away from the garage, and he mentioned it'll be a "couple of hundred bucks" and 2-3 weeks time frame (he is booked solid this short week and all next week), so the weekend after that or the 3rd week. The actual work would be "a few hours". I agreed to that.

The whole ordeal, there were 3 people in total in about 15 I called that actually came to look. One bid was $500 at the lowest, could grow higher, and be about a month out. The other bid, much lower "a couple hundred", and brought about safety concerns with the garage wall and the weight applied directly behind it, suggestions to move the area, and a good time turn around. In the meantime, the 2nd guy also provided proof of their company rebuilding that garage wall, just so I can be aware of the "safety aspect" of why he brought it up. Stand up guy, stood behind his company, provided proof and reasoning, put our safety first, and overall got the job. Sometimes it's not just the lowest bid (it helps), but dang that service!

So, we are now 2-3 weeks out from the ground work. The pool is set to ship out about the 2nd week of June. We are making progress, albeit slow...

The things to do now:
- hook up gfci outlet box to circuit box and test it (hoping that I did it correctly)
- get 12 4 inch thick pavers
- get 6 sheets of 1/2" xps insulation boards
- various tubing/pvc, valves, etc

Do I level the pavers to the ground or the insulation boards? I've read it done both ways, but is one preferred over the other?

Is foam cove necessary? I would need to get those as well. Does this go on top the insulation boards against the walls?

I can at least rest easy, because the time invested in the groundwork I already did, I don't think I could have done the rest myself (or it would've taken months to finish in this heat).

 

[stringer77]

im pretty sure you'll need at least 11 of those foam boards. i would def get the foam cove. might look into exchanging those outlets with weather resistant ones.

 

[kimkats]

foam cove=YES! and yet it will sit on top of the boards.

Good move on listening the the guy! He DOES sound like a stand up guy that knows his stuff!

Tape-make sure to get GOOD tape. Enough to TRIPLE tape it.

 

[detlion1643]

Foam cove ordered! XPS boards almost ordered, might have to go to the store to get them (lowes website has internal server errors when applying gift cards), will be picking up 10 boards! Already had gorilla tape!

Having trouble finding 4" thick stones/pavers to use, all the ones I find are brick-like, so narrow width... I will check out lowes myself when I go get the boards.

I've been looking at pvc valves and pipes and couplers/adapters, and everything plumbing today - that's fun! I won't get that stuff until the pump gets here so I can see exactly what I am working with!

EDIT:
Pavers have been acquired - 3.5" thickness from lowes!
(10) 1/2" thick xps boards acquired.

Area moved back 7' from original plans (away from the garage) as to maintain safety of the garage being a "retaining wall" and being rebuilt some 10ish years ago. Area has been marked, and now we just await a couple of weeks for the ground work!

I have plans in the following years to add decking around, and the backside of the garage will have enough room to add decking, following around the side of the house, while still leaving plenty of room to get to equipment and a/c unit. I like the way it looks in my head!

 

[detlion1643]

Picture of cartridge filter, skimmer kit, and pool shock. If you have an Ollie's nearby, check them out and see how their prices are. My wife got these with her work discount for a great deal compared to the walmart liquid chlorine. If I remember correctly, they are 10% as well.

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The filter came with adapters/fittings for it, so 1 1/2" pvc pipe should just fit right over the non threaded side! I already have thread tape around to help seal it up nicely! The other 2 little adapters/fittings were in the skimmer kit, and they thread onto the skimmer and return. Should I use them, or should I get other adapters/fittings from the store? I am using schedule 40 pvc piping from pump to filter at the very least, and wasn't sure if flexible pvc hosing would be better suited for the skimmer/return lines?

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[detlion1643]

Well well well, sad news today... The company I ordered the pool from sent me an email today stating they can't get it from the manufacturer, it's been discontinued and the manufacturer is shut down currently. It's been a few weeks of emails stating shipping date changes, and then bam... If I knew before, I could've looked around. It's almost impossible now.

I found 1 website that lists some 21x52 above ground hard walls and they state they are backordered until June 15. So, if I order from them I can probably still get one. However, there listings state "With a skimmer and liner", in which I already have from piecing together my own build. I called the place, and they can't give me a straight answer if I can get a pool for lower price without the skimmer and liner. Said they will "reach out" with someone to ask. I'm afraid of waiting, so I might just purchase it anyways to "get in line of getting one".

To say I'm frustrated is an understatement.

 

[stringer77]

Try ebay

 

[detlion1643]

It's been a while, so time to update this thread. The original company I ordered from (that could not acquire the 21' anymore) reached out to me and provided the same manufacturer, but slightly different model (24' version). They mentioned they were still able to acquire this 24' model, so I said yes right away, put the order in. In the meantime though, I placed another order with a second company on conditions that guarantee me a pool if need be, depending on what happens with the first company (new 24' model). So, the first company has not updated that they cannot acquire it yet, so I'm still hoping the first company can provide.

For references:
First company - 24' pool + 24' j-hook liner + dual speed pump = 1600ish
Second company - 24' pool + 24' j-hook liner = 1900ish

I am still getting the pump from the first company no matter what. Pretty crazy price difference, but as far as I know, I'm going to get a pool either way!

So, after a few weeks of back and forth with that, during the same time, I have been in contact with 1 guy for the landscaping work. This is the same guy who has worked on our property 10+ years before we bought it, and brought the back garage wall to our attention (as it's a retaining wall). He's also the guy that quoted us "a couple of hundred bucks and a couple of hours".

Well, today he came and did the dig. First off, holy Crud what a lot of dirt. When eyeing it up before the dig, it never seemed like a lot of work, maybe a foot or so on the high side. After the dig, the high side measures in 2 to 2 1/2 feet deep. I couldn't believe the amount of dirt that was dug out. There was no way to do that by hand, I'd be here for years doing just that work. The landscaper also spread the dirt out for us instead of leaving the huge piles for us to move. It's not perfect, but I can rake loose dirt around to make everything even. The final cost, $265. He sold himself way short, and I sort of feel bad. The wife agreed, considering how much work it actually was, so we paid him $300 with a note to "Have a relaxing beer on us!".

Pictures:

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New item by Peter Yeaney

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New item by Peter Yeaney

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New item by Peter Yeaney

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[kimkats]

Great price and that WAS a lot of work done!!! Bet your hands and body was singing with happieness!

Kim

 

[detlion1643]

Honestly, what a summer. No pool yet, but I finally have a delivery date set for Friday (9/11) with a freight company. I had to order from a 3rd company that once I placed the order, the deliver Friday will be exactly 2 weeks from the day of order. NOT BAD!!!

So, Previously:
First, the company AppliancesConnection had a pool in stock, which I ordered, a 21' x 52". Within 3 days they told me the pool was discontinued, stock at the manufacturer ran out, and they weren't getting anymore this year (at least this year). They did tell me that the manufacturer would let them order a 24' x 52", so I did with an estimated shipping date of 3 weeks, time to wait. On that estimated 3rd week, they told me they can't procure the pool because the manufacturer won't send them any until late September...

In the meantime, I placed an order with a second company with an estimated shipping time of mid-August. Once I got notice of the first company not getting it, I immediately told the second company to do things asap. So, they charged the card and said sometime in August, but couldn't pin down even an estimated week as the manufacturers are way behind. Well, 4 days before Augusts ends, I had to spend all day getting a hold of someone at their company and they told me I can't get one next year, but they can hold the money and I'll get one first thing come March... No thanks, your NOT keeping my money like that. At this time, I spent a lot of time looking into their company and it turns out not so well, basically everyone is having the same experience as me. So, they know I want my money back asap, and I am telling everyone to avoid them at all costs. Their communication is nothing, literally nothing. The only time they talked to me was after multiple emails/support messages, and the responses were non professional emails. No capitalization, no puncuation, I mean c'mon, you're a business, be professional.

^^^ That company was FamilyPoolFun ^^^

So, after that experience I was ultimately done for this year. I didn't want to look anymore, and every reputable site that people mention from here are all still sold out. I happened to glance at a tab on FireFox on my phone that was still open (as I was going through and closing every tab from pool companies), from a company I looked at previously that I checked out for pools. I checked each tab before closing them and all were out of stock (as mentioned above). Although, this company had 1 brand at least in stock (it didn't say backordered and I could add it to my cart and checkout). I did an online chat with someone and they assured me if they were not backordered and could be checked out, there was a very very good possibility of getting one delivered within 2-3 weeks. What the heck, what's another 3 weeks to wait after trying for 3.5 months already. And, they assured me that after 3 weeks if I don't have it, I can very well cancel/chargeback and get the full amount back (no runarounds of maybe we can maybe we can't get it)...

I put the order in on Friday, and exactly 2 weeks from that date I have a scheduled delivery date, this coming Friday (9/11)!!! And, the pool and liner were just under $1700 shipped.

The company is called NamcoPool. I am very impressed so far! So, officially, I have every single item needed, hole dug, and with the pool and liner coming in Friday, that's everything! I know it's late in the season though, but at least I have one... I am still undecided if I will hold until Spring or not...

 

[kimkats]

What a pool, no pool, pool, no pool ride you have been on! Here is hoping this last one does come through!