Finally a heater

[Plmbst]

My first post here was on the Introductory Forum this morning and I hope I’m not being obnoxious by posting a repeat in this forum, but I’m seeking some advice on how to proceed with installing a new heat pump heater.

Good morning. Here are our pool specs.
Installed in 2000
24,000 gallons
17’x37’ Mountain Lake by Cardinal Systems
Hayward 2 hp single speed Super Pump
Hayward 60 sq. ft. DE filter
Hayward in-line tab chlorinator
Polaris 380 cleaner
All 2” PVC piping (unfortunately flex underground)

After 23 seasons we want to install a heat pump heater to extend our pool enjoyment. Gas is not an option. When the pool was installed 24 years ago I had the installer leave valves so that I could install a heat exchanger that would be powered by my oil-fired boiler. Well, that never happened and now I don’t want to use my 100,00 Btu boiler for that purpose. ( I am a retired master plumber.)
The pumps are located about 45 feet from the pool and approximately 2 1/2 ft. above the pool surface.
We’re looking at a Hayward Heat Pro 140k heat pump and wonder :
-if the the pump elevation will be an issue
-the manual calls for a 1/3 check valve, what is that?
-would a variable speed pump be better suited to this new addition?
Thanks for any input you might have.
Peter

 

[ajw22]

-if the the pump elevation will be an issue

No.

Put a check valve between the pool and the pump inlet.

-the manual calls for a 1/3 check valve, what is that?

I do not see a "1/3" specified in the Installation Manual.

They do want a Jandy type check valve between the heater output and any chlorinator.

-would a variable speed pump be better suited to this new addition?

No. The HP does not need it.

Do you have any automation on your pool?

 

[Plmbst]

ajw22, thanks for your help. Page 8 of the Heat Pro owners manual mentions a “1/3 lb” check valve. I have never seen any valve referenced as a 1/3lb . Is that the force necessary to open or close the check, just curious.
Do I take it that I should have two check valves, one on the pump inlet and one between the chlorinator and the HP?
Also, how can I find the GPM of the pool water in my system?
And no, I have no automation other than an Intermatic Timing Control Center consisting of two mechanical time clocks. Do you have any suggestions?
Thank you.
Peter

 

[ajw22]

Page 8 of the Heat Pro owners manual mentions a “1/3 lb” check valve. I have never seen any valve referenced as a 1/3lb . Is that the force necessary to open or close the check, just curious.

Maybe my old eyes are not working today but I don't see it on page 8.

Standard Jandy style check valves are used.

Do I take it that I should have two check valves, one on the pump inlet and one between the chlorinator and the HP?

Yes.

Also, how can I find the GPM of the pool water in my system?

Some of the newer VS pumps will give you GPM.

You can install a FlowVis on one of the check valves.

Your 2HP SS pump through your DE filter will give you at least 30GPM and if it does not the HP will error with a low or no flow message and you can't get to 75GPM with your plumbing setup.

And no, I have no automation other than an Intermatic Timing Control Center consisting of two mechanical time clocks. Do you have any suggestions?

If it works for you then it is fine.

What is your daily pump runtime now?

Depending how much you want to run the HP you may find your pump running much longer and running up your electrical bill. That is where a VS pump and automation can save on electricity.

 

[Plmbst]

My pump routine has been based on keeping the water clean, 5 or so hours per day along with the cleaner going 3 hours or so. I realize that pump run time will increase, most likely, dramatically and that makes me wonder how run times can be made more economical through lower electric usage.
I’m not knowledgeable of any energy saving methods re: pumps and/or controls, my system is the same as it was 23 years ago.
Your information is much appreciated.
Peter

 

[ajw22]

Your 2HP SS pump will use 2,000 watts or 2KWs for every hour it runs. It does not take 2KWs to push 30-50GPM that your HP and pull need.

Here is some data from my system from my 3HP Pentair VSF pump and IntelliCenter...

• 1400 RPM 1 PSI 36 GPM 205 WATTS
• 1800 RPM 4 PSI 47 GPM 407 WATTS
• 2400 RPM 10 PSI 61 GPM 913 WATTS
• 2800 RPM 68 GPM 1406 WATTS
• 3400 RPM 80 GPM 2435 WATTS

One big caveat is that data is with my gas heater bypassed.

When my heater begins running my automatic bypass valve opens and pump speed is increased to 60 GPM with 2800 RPM using 1342 watts. My heater has a minimum 40 GPM but I like at least 50 GPM and the flow will slow as the DE filter loads up.

Every system is different and I would guess that you can probably run a Pentair Intelliflo3 pump at around 2000 RPM with about 1,000 watts and get around 40 GPM that your HP will need. That is half the electrical usage your current pump uses.

You can use your electrical cost to calculate how the KWs translate into dollars.

The 140K HeatPro may heat your 24,000 gallon pool 3/4 degree an hour or less.

Do you have a pool cover? A pool cover will make a big difference in heat loss.

I don't have a pool cover and my pool loses 3 to 4 degrees overnight that I then need to run the heater to recover.

 

[Plmbst]

Yeah, no cover here either and the free form/kidney she of our pool does not lend itself to a neat solution.
And it’s probably not your old eyes failing because I’m referring to the Hayward owners manual from 2009 that is linked to the site I’m getting Heat Pro information. I see you are referencing the installation manual. I’ll have to look that up.
Again, thanks for your comments, you have given me much to work with.
Peter