Fiberglass build in NoVa

chazas

LifeTime Supporter
Jun 4, 2007
89
Manassas, VA
BIG RED FLAG. I would never agree to this. By all meany pay for work done to that point (excavation, prep, pool, etc) but NEVER pay the complete amount until the job is completely finished.
I sent an email asking about this. Would never, never do it with a construction project of any size. I've already made a couple of appointments with local mom & pop gunite poolbuilders for this weekend, just in case.
 

Winger 03

Well-known member
Sep 7, 2009
231
Frederick County, MD
River Pools did our pool about 8 years ago. We LOVE, LOVE, LOVE them. They really stand behind their work even years after the warranty expires. Back when we were with them, they were an installer for Leisure Pools, now they make their own shells. Marcus,. Jason, Rebecca, all of them are really terrific.
 

chazas

LifeTime Supporter
Jun 4, 2007
89
Manassas, VA
River Pools did our pool about 8 years ago. We LOVE, LOVE, LOVE them. They really stand behind their work even years after the warranty expires. Back when we were with them, they were an installer for Leisure Pools, now they make their own shells. Marcus,. Jason, Rebecca, all of them are really terrific.
That's my impression, and I would love to work with them, but there is no contractor in the world who is good enough to risk getting too far ahead in progress payments, much less 100% payment before construction starts.
 

duraleigh

Admin
Mod Squad
TFP Expert
Platinum Supporter
LifeTime Supporter
In The Industry
Apr 1, 2007
32,864
Sebring, Florida
That's my impression, and I would love to work with them, but there is no contractor in the world who is good enough to risk getting too far ahead in progress payments, much less 100% payment before construction starts.
+1 to that! Additionally a good faith contractor should not expect that arrangement. I would RUN AWAY!
 

Winger 03

Well-known member
Sep 7, 2009
231
Frederick County, MD
They did not have that when we did our build - or at least I do not recall that was the case and I would have remembered something like that.

That's my impression, and I would love to work with them, but there is no contractor in the world who is good enough to risk getting too far ahead in progress payments, much less 100% payment before construction starts.
 

chazas

LifeTime Supporter
Jun 4, 2007
89
Manassas, VA
They did not have that when we did our build - or at least I do not recall that was the case and I would have remembered something like that.
Hopefully the experience of the poster above was just an aberration, I'm waiting to hear back the answer to my question. They're so proactive, I'd think they'd mention something like that up front.
 

Winger 03

Well-known member
Sep 7, 2009
231
Frederick County, MD
I just dug out some info from the build with River Pools...

Here was my payment schedule:
Due upon pool delivery and before the pool is unloaded
Due at excavation
Due when pool filled with water
Due 2 days before concrete pour
Due at electrical

I also had a small down payment. Roughly 50% of the cost was when they dropped off the pool, and the other 50% was split among the remaining steps.
 
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pool123*

Active member
Aug 28, 2019
40
Aldie, VA
I just dug out some info from the build with River Pools...

Here was my payment schedule:
Due upon pool delivery and before the pool is unloaded
Due at excavation
Due when pool filled with water
Due 2 days before concrete pour
Due at electrical

I also had a small down payment. Roughly 50% of the cost was when they dropped off the pool, and the other 50% was split among the remaining steps.
Wow, this is much more reasonable than what they told me. I am going to ask again. Chazas--I am working with Tony Orband. If you get a different answer from someone else, I'd be grateful if you shared the info.
 

pool123*

Active member
Aug 28, 2019
40
Aldie, VA
River Pools did our pool about 8 years ago. We LOVE, LOVE, LOVE them. They really stand behind their work even years after the warranty expires. Back when we were with them, they were an installer for Leisure Pools, now they make their own shells. Marcus,. Jason, Rebecca, all of them are really terrific.
That was also our impression. Until they shared their expected payment schedule we thought they were so great that we were ready to make a purchase without even getting other quotes because they seemed like a really good fit. Now we're going to consider all of our options. Happy to hear of your great experience though!!! If we can get them to backoff their unreasonable payment expectations we are still very interested in them.
 

Neemer

Gold Supporter
Oct 10, 2017
210
Mid-Atlantic
I did not use River Pools, but wish I had. I must say that payment schedule flies in the face of everything I know of that company. Doesn’t sound right.
 

Winger 03

Well-known member
Sep 7, 2009
231
Frederick County, MD
Now it should be noted my pool was done in Fall 2009 (it does not seem like that long ago). The payment schedules you are speaking of seem really onerous, to me it is strange that a company like theirs that seems to be in tune with good customer service has a policy that is slanted so much.
 

chazas

LifeTime Supporter
Jun 4, 2007
89
Manassas, VA
Unfortunately, I have confirmed this. The only exception is when there is extensive wall and patio work, and if so they will carve that out and ask for payment on THAT portion at the time they BEGIN that portion. They are off my list, unless I really can't find someone else I like (and even then my head tells me it would be better to go without a pool altogether). I find it kind of outrageous. This was my reply:

I'm really sorry, but that doesn't work for me. A reasonable draw schedule is fine but I would never allow myself to get too far ahead in a payment schedule, and there should always be a little bit at the back end to make sure all odds and ends are cleaned up. Customers should not be a substitute for working capital lines.​
I'm torn because I really want to work with you folks, but at this time I will look elsewhere. For now let's cancel our visit and I will let you know if I change my mind as I explore other alternatives.​
BTW, I really would have appreciated if if you had mentioned this up front. It's highly unusual for a reputable builder or contractor and would have saved both of us time and effort.​

Ugh.
 
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BMK

Bronze Supporter
Mar 29, 2016
359
SW PA
That's my impression, and I would love to work with them, but there is no contractor in the world who is good enough to risk getting too far ahead in progress payments, much less 100% payment before construction starts.
That would absolutly be a deal breaker for me. My interpretation is they want you to trust them completly and explicity, while not trusting you one bit. If its worth it to you, i would try to work out an escrow type arrangement (so they can see the money is there and available, if thats their concern) with milestone payouts. That would be fair to both parties. If they can't/won't accept that, then there very well may be something wrong somewhere and i'd stay away.
 

PoolGate

Gold Supporter
TFP Guide
Jun 7, 2017
3,921
Damascus, MD
I suspect this builder was burned once (or twice) on a job and there is enough pool business that he most likely still gets plenty of work with his contract conditions. My contract was keyed to major milestones like gunite, plaster, electrical, etc. This meant they did not get paid until those milestones were met. Keeps them wanting to make the milestones! With all pay upfront, you lose the incentive of profit for the entire job. From that point it is best effort. Good call on your part too bad more people don't take this approach.
 

pool123*

Active member
Aug 28, 2019
40
Aldie, VA
That would absolutly be a deal breaker for me. My interpretation is they want you to trust them completly and explicity, while not trusting you one bit. If its worth it to you, i would try to work out an escrow type arrangement (so they can see the money is there and available, if thats their concern) with milestone payouts. That would be fair to both parties. If they can't/won't accept that, then there very well may be something wrong somewhere and i'd stay away.
I actually proposed an escrow arrangement when I met with them on Monday and they said no, or at least that that is not a standard solution for them. Of course anything is an option if the customer can get the owner to agree to it but the salesman was unable to agree to an escrow arrangement on his own.
 

tabitha_599

Well-known member
Jun 18, 2019
53
Tennessee
This is basically how ours was done too. We are still waiting on for our coping and concrete to be poured and they fortunately have not been paid for that. I'm glad it worked that way just in case they end of not following through. They are saying the end of next week so crossing my fingers. It's been over 4 weeks since the pool went in.

I just dug out some info from the build with River Pools...

Here was my payment schedule:
Due upon pool delivery and before the pool is unloaded
Due at excavation
Due when pool filled with water
Due 2 days before concrete pour
Due at electrical

I also had a small down payment. Roughly 50% of the cost was when they dropped off the pool, and the other 50% was split among the remaining steps.
 

chazas

LifeTime Supporter
Jun 4, 2007
89
Manassas, VA
Still working with River Pools, they agreed to a better payment schedule with an escrow. Another fiberglass installer and a gunite contractor are also in the mix. I will probably choose very soon.

One option from the other fiberglass installer is a 12,200 gallon model. They use all Pentair equipment. I've asked a couple of times about upsizing the SWG from IC20 to IC40 and they've said they really don't advise it, since it's sized for up to 20,000 gallons and in their estimation will be already running minimally much of the time. Any thoughts, based on experience?
 

mknauss

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
Bronze Supporter
May 3, 2014
23,001
Laughlin, NV
We know that most pools use 3 ppm of FC per day during swim season. An IC20 run at 100% 24 hours per day in that volume pool will generate 6.9ppm FC. So you would need to run the IC20 at 100% for 12 hours per day.

The cost increase from an IC20 to IC40 should be less than $150.

If you look in my signature, I have an IC40 for a pool volume of 6000 gallons. Overkill? Yes. But it can put out some chlorine, fast.
 
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Winger 03

Well-known member
Sep 7, 2009
231
Frederick County, MD
Bigger is better - less run-time will make it last longer. As I understand it, a cell has only a certain number of hours it will last. If you can extend the number of years it will last by running a larger unit less, you will more than make up for the price difference between models.

I'm glad RPS is being a little more reasonable.



Still working with River Pools, they agreed to a better payment schedule with an escrow. Another fiberglass installer and a gunite contractor are also in the mix. I will probably choose very soon.

One option from the other fiberglass installer is a 12,200 gallon model. They use all Pentair equipment. I've asked a couple of times about upsizing the SWG from IC20 to IC40 and they've said they really don't advise it, since it's sized for up to 20,000 gallons and in their estimation will be already running minimally much of the time. Any thoughts, based on experience?
 
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