Damp Soil Near Pool Equipment

[lasvegas1976]

There is damp soil near my pool equipment, on the left side of my large gas pool heater (damp soil on the left of the heater, pool pump and filters on the right side of the heater).

The soil is not what I would call wet, but certainly call damp. You can't grab a handfull and squeeze any water. Whatever the case, the soil is certainly not dry.

However, that area of soil never receives any sun. It's always being shaded off by a nearby wall. It doesn't rain often in Las Vegas, but that area almost never seems dry. It's been like this for at least 1-2 years. Could even be longer and I haven't noticed.

I believe the pool lines are running under that area, or near it. Not 100% on that.

The water meter is not active late at night (when everyone is sleeping) and neither is the pool's auto-fill.

My water bill this month is barely 3 dollars higher than last year during the same time period (and that's with the higher Nevada water rates).

Whatever the problem is, it's not really costing me anything on the water bill.

Both the pool cleaning company and my landscapers told me it's even close to being worth it to start digging up that entire area.

But, I keep getting fixated to find out what the problem actually is (maybe there is no problem).

Could is be rain water that never drains anywhere and it just stays damp for weeks or months? Could it somehow be condensation from the lines running below?

Has anyone seen this in their backyard before?

 

[PoolStored]

Can you take some pictures of the pad and the moist area and the relationship between the two? That would help us troubleshoot.

LV is pretty arid, no? Are there other areas in the shade that are "dry?" Is it an isolated area that is wet (i.e. a 2x2' patch)? How much rain did you get and how long before you saw the dampness?

I don't know LV weather well enough to comment, but @mknauss is out there and can weigh in.

 

[Mdragger88]

Also- do you have any kind of sprinkler system that may be the culprit instead of the pool?
You can do the bucket test with the autofill off to try & rule out the pool.

Leak Detection

A number of things can cause leaks in your pool. You can learn tricks for leak detection and how to pinpoint where your pool is losing water.

www.troublefreepool.com

 

[lasvegas1976]

Also- do you have any kind of sprinkler system that may be the culprit instead of the pool?
You can do the bucket test with the autofill off to try & rule out the pool.

Leak Detection

A number of things can cause leaks in your pool. You can learn tricks for leak detection and how to pinpoint where your pool is losing water.

www.troublefreepool.com

Here's the thing. If it was leaking enough to take any noticeable amount of water from the pool, then the auto-fill would have to keep up and in turn the water bill would boost up. The water meter, when nobody else is home or late night, does not move at all - and I usually clock it for 2-3 minutes to see if it's moving.

It's also not the irrigation system. Unless there are older irragtion lines running under there.

 

[lasvegas1976]

Can you take some pictures of the pad and the moist area and the relationship between the two? That would help us troubleshoot.

LV is pretty arid, no? Are there other areas in the shade that are "dry?" Is it an isolated area that is wet (i.e. a 2x2' patch)? How much rain did you get and how long before you saw the dampness?

I don't know LV weather well enough to comment, but @mknauss is out there and can weigh in.

I'll take some pics when it's lighter out in the backyard.

It's an isolated area. It seems damp all the time, but it's been like this for a very long time. I would have to check if anywhere else is shaded off in the same manner.

 

[mknauss]

Could only be leaking when the pump is running.

 

[Mdragger88]

Here's the thing. If it was leaking enough to take any noticeable amount of water from the pool, then the auto-fill would have to keep up and in turn the water bill would boost up. The water meter, when nobody else is home or late night, does not move at all - and I usually clock it for 2-3 minutes to see if it's moving.

It's also not the irrigation system. Unless there are older irragtion lines running under there.

A very slow small leak might not increase the water bill in a significant way nor be noticeable on the meter. Trying the bucket test for a week is a cheap & simple way of detection.
You mentioned a gas heater- does it have a condensate line/or perhaps just a drain hole?

 

[lasvegas1976]

A very slow small leak might not increase the water bill in a significant way nor be noticeable on the meter. Trying the bucket test for a week is a cheap & simple way of detection.
You mentioned a gas heater- does it have a condensate line/or perhaps just a drain hole?

To be quite honest I don't know. I don't know anything about pool gas heaters. But I don't have it often - it runs up a crazy gas bill just for single day's use.

 

[lasvegas1976]

Could only be leaking when the pump is running.

I actually had a similar thought in my head.

 

[lasvegas1976]

A very slow small leak might not increase the water bill in a significant way nor be noticeable on the meter. Trying the bucket test for a week is a cheap & simple way of detection.
You mentioned a gas heater- does it have a condensate line/or perhaps just a drain hole?

Here are two photos of the area.

20221214-210016

Image 20221214-210016 hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

20221214-210023

Image 20221214-210023 hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

It's a bit more damp than usual, but it just rained all day a few days back. There has been no real sun in general and it's cold by Vegas standards, so a few areas in the backyard are currently damp.

In case you are wondering, my backyard has a decorative top soil called "chat soil"... I think it's called that - which gets harder and darker over time with any moisture.

 

[lasvegas1976]

Can you take some pictures of the pad and the moist area and the relationship between the two? That would help us troubleshoot.

LV is pretty arid, no? Are there other areas in the shade that are "dry?" Is it an isolated area that is wet (i.e. a 2x2' patch)? How much rain did you get and how long before you saw the dampness?

I don't know LV weather well enough to comment, but @mknauss is out there and can weigh in.

Here are two photos of the area.

20221214-210016

Image 20221214-210016 hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

20221214-210023

Image 20221214-210023 hosted in ImgBB

ibb.co

It's a bit more damp than usual, but it just rained all day a few days back. There has been no real sun in general and it's cold by Vegas standards, so a few areas in the backyard are currently damp.

In case you are wondering, my backyard has a decorative top soil called "chat soil"... I think it's called that - which gets harder and darker over time with any moisture.

 

[mknauss]

Please upload the photos to the forum.

 

[lasvegas1976]

Please upload the photos to the forum.

 

[mknauss]

I believe you have a leak.

Turn off the auto fill and do a bucket test with the pump running.

 

[lasvegas1976]

I believe you have a leak.

Turn off the auto fill and do a bucket test with the pump running.

I did that very recently when I suspected my auto-fill was not working and I was losing the same amount of water, no more than a quarter of an inch per day (much hotter temps at that time).

My pool guy is not convinced the lines are running in that area (outside of possibly auto-fill line, which has the green/black bucket over the on/off handle). I wanted to hire a leak detection guy to see if there was a leak with the auto-fill line, but he claimed if the meter is not even moving then his equipment won't be able to detect a leak that minimal.

 

[mknauss]

If not pool lines, some thing else. Nothing stays damp like that in our climate.

 

[lasvegas1976]

If not pool lines, some thing else. Nothing stays damp like that in our climate.

Is there a possibility of something leaking only when the pump is running?

I've been pressing the issue on that area, but my pool guy and landscapers keep telling me to leave it alone until I see a real problem (water bill or actual water I can feel/see).

Same advice I got from the leak detection company. They found a pool related leak in the autofill a few years back, but the water meter was spinning slowly 24/7.

They are thinking more of the expense in digging everything out over there.

My home is around 5,000 sq feet, over half an acre and a ton of landscaping. Water bill was only 80 bucks (wife and 2 small kids too). A year ago, with lower water rates, the bill was around 77 bucks.

Adams is re-doing my entire pool, starting in late January (project ends in mid-March). New quartz plaster, deck, lights, skimmer, tile, etc. If that area continues to stay damp with everything shut down, it would rule out anything pool related? I'm hoping it's an old irrigation line that runs when the irrigation runs.

 

[mknauss]

Pressure test the return lines during your construction.

Why just that area is damp? You know our climate. Was this area damp in August?

 

[lasvegas1976]

Pressure test the return lines during your construction.

Why just that area is damp? You know our climate. Was this area damp in August?

Yes. It's been damp on and off for at least 2-3 years.

I don't believe it is damp during the hottest seasons (or doesn't look it).

I've been fixed on the area for a while, but my pool guy and landscapers keep persuading me to avoid the expense of tearing up the area until it actually becomes what they consider to be a problem.

Out of curiosity, if there is a cracked pipe or whatnot, how are these things fixed (like if a small or big piece needs to be cut out)? When the pipes are off, aren't these pipes full of water (I don;t know). The only pipe I ever had fixed was my autofill line, which had a bad crack. I remember they shut that line off, cut out the bad piece and replaced.

 

[JamesW]

What is under the thing with a red X?

What is the line with a red dot?