Best Way To Maintain Chlorine Levels During Times of Travel?

[MSDalton]

My pool was recently refurbished with a PebbleTec (PTI) PebbleFina finish. While I want to maintain the chemistry within the PTI recommendations as much as possible, I travel a bit and am trying to figure out how to manage chlorine levels while I'm gone. I use Pool Math 100% of the time (I love that I can click on the CSI "tab" and play with the numbers and see what effect any/all changes will have on CSI before I do them!). I use a Taylor K-2006C FAS-DPD test kit. I use liquid chlorine.

1. My pool uses around 2-ppm/day Cl. Do high FC concentrations have a deleterious effect on plaster? I'm considering jacking up my chlorine to, say, 15-ppm when I go out of town to last me a week. Unintended consequences?
2. I'm also considering restarting my SWG. I'd have to elevate my CYA to around 50-ppm. Would there be any problems with going back and forth between SWG and liquid chlorine?
3. If I run the SWG and the chlorine levels are not within TFP range, is there any problem with augmenting with liquid chlorine while the SWG is running?

Background

Chemistry	pH	TA	CH	CYA	CSI	FC
My Pool	7.7	60	400	40	-0.06	4
PebbleTec (PTI) Rec.	7.2 - 7.6	70 - 100	150 - 300	20 - 30	-0.3 - 0.3	1 - 3

My goal is to honor the PTI recommendations as much as possible (warranty). I'm just trying to figure out the best way to maintain sanitizer levels during times of travel. I sure appreciate any/all input.

Mark

 

[jesper]

I've in the past added a floater with a tablet or two to ensure some chlorine is added while I'm away. It will add CYA, but if you only use it for a few weeks every now and then, I don't see it as a real issue - just be aware.

 

[cowboycasey]

Hey neighbor...

Are they coming by and doing spot checks on your pool without your knowledge? if it were my pool I would jack the CYA to 80, bring FC to 7 and fire the SWG up and call it a day.. I leave for up to a month at a time (not lately) and have no issues as I know it will be fine on its own.. With closing in a month or so maybe wait till next year...

Did you have higher CH before when there was scaling? was it shutting down the SWG cell?

 

[HermanTX]

Hi Mark. I do not have a SWG so I cannot answer your specific questions on that but my knowledge gained from this forum is that many people SLAM with liquid chlorine (LC) and still maintain the SWG - so short term it would seem OK.

I use primarily LC but if I go out of town like recently for 5 days. I add extra LC on day of departure, plus I add 4 pucks (some new some used as I just keep them in a bag) to my floating duck. When I returned my CL level was still in target for my CYA and no issues with algae. There is minimum increase to CYA for this time period as no puck totally dissolves. I remove the floating duck and go back to daily LC doses.

Just curious - you mention scaling concerns due to your SWG - or that is how I interpret your signature info. What happened?.

 

[Chasarms]

Increasing LC to 15 ppm will not hold a week. When the FC is above appropriate FC/CYA ratio, it depletes very quickly.

You will need to either float a few pucks, restart the SWCG, or install an automatic injection pump for the LC.

 

[MSDalton]

Hey neighbor...

Are they coming by and doing spot checks on your pool without your knowledge? if it were my pool I would jack the CYA to 80, bring FC to 7 and fire the SWG up and call it a day.. I leave for up to a month at a time (not lately) and have no issues as I know it will be fine on its own.. With closing in a month or so maybe wait till next year...

Did you have higher CH before when there was scaling? was it shutting down the SWG cell?

No idea on the CH before scaling. I was using a pool service and trusting that they knew what ther were doing... Bad mistake! I actually used 3 services over the 6-year period. That they did not know what they were doing ultimately manifested itself in me having repeated algae problems (screaming high CYA). This is what drove me to TFP. I fired the service, began managing my own pool, and have never looked back! Doing research on calcium nodules has been an adventure; still no clear definitive answer on their cause, but chemistry is at least a contributor.

During that time period the SWG cell was not shutting down. Now that I've become at least a bit more knowledgable, I may very well go back to the SWG but an concerned that I'd be trading frequent LC additions for frequent HCL additions. I'm also looking at adding borates as a potential pH stabilizer. Thanks for the reply!

 

[MSDalton]

Increasing LC to 15 ppm will not hold a week. When the FC is above appropriate FC/CYA ratio, it depletes very quickly.

You will need to either float a few pucks, restart the SWCG, or install an automatic injection pump for the LC.

Thanks so much for schooling me on rapid Cl depletion if the Cl/CYA ratio is out of whack!

 

[mknauss]

Acid additions using liquid chlorine or SWCG will essentially be the same. Big deal on acid additions is from those that go from trichlor to SWCG. They blame it on the SWCG, but the trichlor is so acidic they were just adding the acid that way.

 

[cowboycasey]

I add HCL 2 or 3 times a year, I see you doing once a week for another year and then going to 2 times a month or so but every pool is different...

Now getting back to your question and what you just said... I would 100% recommend going back to SWG and take your pool to TFP recommended levels and test your pool like you have been doing since you took over

I would wait on borates till you get a great handle on your pool and it is exactly where you want it then do borates... I am at 5 years and I have still not done it, mine is crazzy stable, i can go 1.5 to 2 months at 7.5 to 7.6 ph

You can leave any time and just not worry about it, I do all the time...

 

[MSDalton]

Hi Mark. I do not have a SWG so I cannot answer your specific questions on that but my knowledge gained from this forum is that many people SLAM with liquid chlorine (LC) and still maintain the SWG - so short term it would seem OK.

I use primarily LC but if I go out of town like recently for 5 days. I add extra LC on day of departure, plus I add 4 pucks (some new some used as I just keep them in a bag) to my floating duck. When I returned my CL level was still in target for my CYA and no issues with algae. There is minimum increase to CYA for this time period as no puck totally dissolves. I remove the floating duck and go back to daily LC doses.

Just curious - you mention scaling concerns due to your SWG - or that is how I interpret your signature info. What happened?.

Thanks much for your thoughts and experience RE: limited use of pucks! I DO NOT ATTRIBUTE MY SCALING PROBLEM TO THE SWG. I abandoned the SWG once I took over chemical management in order to remove a variable and the unknowns that come with it. I was using a pool service and having algae problems with the SWG running. Once I took over, I found that the CYA level was very high and determined that my SWG couldn't keep up. I also discovered TFP and decided to get back to the basics before adding more complexity. I'm now ready to consider going back to the SWG but want to understand the trade-offs before doing so (e.g. frequent addition of LC vs. frequent additions of HCl). To counter this, I'm considering adding borates to the system.

 

[MSDalton]

Acid additions using liquid chlorine or SWCG will essentially be the same. Big deal on acid additions is from those that go from trichlor to SWCG. They blame it on the SWCG, but the trichlor is so acidic they were just adding the acid that way.

Interesting! Thanks for broadening my perspective!

 

[newdude]

I'm now ready to consider going back to the SWG but want to understand the trade-offs before doing so (e.g. frequent addition of LC vs. frequent additions of HCl)

Hey MS !! So the biggest issue with the SWG raising the PH is mostly on the pool owner being overly worried. Once the TA finds its happy place the PH will hover in the high end of the accepted range more often than not. People tend to try to fix it by putting it at the low end of the scale expecting it to rise again. It has the backwards effect of making it rise that much quicker than it would have if it was just left alone. It’s the same principle how hot water will freeze before cold water will when they are side by side. Once the hot water starts to swing, it blows right by the cold water on its way to freezing. The cold water takes more energy/time to make it colder because it wasn’t evaporating on its own in the first place. Anything between 7 and 8 is fine for PH. When people target the 7.8 that it wants to be they only have to add acid weekly or every other week. And if they target it back to 7.8, it much less acid than targeting 7.2.

 

[MSDalton]

I add HCL 2 or 3 times a year, I see you doing once a week for another year and then going to 2 times a month or so but every pool is different...

Now getting back to your question and what you just said... I would 100% recommend going back to SWG and take your pool to TFP recommended levels and test your pool like you have been doing since you took over

I would wait on borates till you get a great handle on your pool and it is exactly where you want it then do borates... I am at 5 years and I have still not done it, mine is crazzy stable, i can go 1.5 to 2 months at 7.5 to 7.6 ph

You can leave any time and just not worry about it, I do all the time...

OK friend, I'm very jealous of your stable chemistry. I want my pool to be like your pool when it grows up! My pool has a small spill-over water fall from the spa that cannot be isolated (turned on/off). Hence, if I'm not mistaken, this in and of itself will tend to raise pH (aeration). But, I'm close to a stable pH at 7.6 with TA at 60 (I previously rode the pH-TA yoyo for a while...). Other than adding complexity to the system, what is the downside of adding borates? Actually I started a separate thread on the borate issue...

 

[mknauss]

My pool has a small spill-over water fall from the spa that cannot be isolated (turned on/off).

Your signature shows an EasyTouch. You can program a Spillover function and only run the spa spillover a bit each day to keep the spa chlorinated.

 

[cowboycasey]

ahh, yep, that is adding PH by the second... looks great though so really your doing great... ^^^^^^ that would work

 

[MSDalton]

Hey MS !! So the biggest issue with the SWG raising the PH is mostly on the pool owner being overly worried. Once the TA finds its happy place the PH will hover in the high end of the accepted range more often than not. People tend to try to fix it by putting it at the low end of the scale expecting it to rise again. It has the backwards effect of making it rise that much quicker than it would have if it was just left alone. It’s the same principle how hot water will freeze before cold water will when they are side by side. Once the hot water starts to swing, it blows right by the cold water on its way to freezing. The cold water takes more energy/time to make it colder because it wasn’t evaporating on its own in the first place. Anything between 7 and 8 is fine for PH. When people target the 7.8 that it wants to be they only have to add acid weekly or every other week. And if they target it back to 7.8, it much less acid than targeting 7.2.

Very interesting! BTW, I intend to win bets this winter with the water freezing phenomenon! What's your cut? Given my past bad chemistry experience, I'm more nervous than a double-shot espresso in a double-shot espresso! Thanks much for the encouragement to chill a bit.

 

[MSDalton]

Your signature shows an EasyTouch. You can program a Spillover function and only run the spa spillover a bit each day to keep the spa chlorinated.

It's an issue of plumbing... I'd have to redo the way it's plumber in order to be able to isolate the spa. I may look into doing that.

 

[mknauss]

If you can isolate the spa to run you can set up a Spillover or Spillway function.

 

[Dirk]

Hey MS !! So the biggest issue with the SWG raising the PH is mostly on the pool owner being overly worried. Once the TA finds its happy place the PH will hover in the high end of the accepted range more often than not. People tend to try to fix it by putting it at the low end of the scale expecting it to rise again. It has the backwards effect of making it rise that much quicker than it would have if it was just left alone. It’s the same principle how hot water will freeze before cold water will when they are side by side. Once the hot water starts to swing, it blows right by the cold water on its way to freezing. The cold water takes more energy/time to make it colder because it wasn’t evaporating on its own in the first place. Anything between 7 and 8 is fine for PH. When people target the 7.8 that it wants to be they only have to add acid weekly or every other week. And if they target it back to 7.8, it much less acid than targeting 7.2.

This was my exact real-world experience.

Let's back up. You wrote "recently refurbished." Less than 30 days ago? Did you already bring your salt level up to the level required for your SWG? If so, what are we talking about here? No pucks. No borates. Your pH and TA will stabilize if they haven't already. Get the SWG back online and monitor your CSI. Once you dial in the SWG you can leave for a week, maybe two. If your finish is so new that it's still curing, and gobbling acid, then that will be the bigger challenge (and independent of SWG or no SWG). If you have a Pentair IntelliChlor, then you could add a Pentair IntelllipH and solve your acid dosing that way, and once dialed in, ignore both FC and pH for a week or two no problem, as I do. Whether home or away, that Pentair IC/IpH combo is a very nice luxury.

Ya lost me on FC and scaling. Those two are not related, and maybe you've already come to grips with that.

Now this was based on your seemingly complete contradiction of your desire to adhere to the warranty standards vs your report of your testing results. Adding CYA for the SWG won't compromise the warranty standards any more than they are already compromised (you're already out of range on 5 of the 6 recommendations). If you want to get everything back in range, that's a different discussion.

 

[MSDalton]

This was my exact real-world experience.

Let's back up. You wrote "recently refurbished." Less than 30 days ago? Did you already bring your salt level up to the level required for your SWG? If so, what are we talking about here? No pucks. No borates. Your pH and TA will stabilize if they haven't already. Get the SWG back online and monitor your CSI. Once you dial in the SWG you can leave for a week, maybe two. If your finish is so new that it's still curing, and gobbling acid, then that will be the bigger challenge (and independent of SWG or no SWG). If you have a Pentair IntelliChlor, then you could add a Pentair IntelllipH and solve your acid dosing that way, and once dialed in, ignore both FC and pH for a week or two no problem, as I do. Whether home or away, that Pentair IC/IpH combo is a very nice luxury.

Ya lost me on FC and scaling. Those two are not related, and maybe you've already come to grips with that.

Now this was based on your seemingly complete contradiction of your desire to adhere to the warranty standards vs your report of your testing results. Adding CYA for the SWG won't compromise the warranty standards any more than they are already compromised (you're already out of range on 5 of the 6 recommendations). If you want to get everything back in range, that's a different discussion.

My pool was refinished to a PebbleTec PebbleFina finish 3.5-months ago. I am currently running it as a liquid chlorine system, but an thinking about switching to an SWG system. I am trying to maintain chems within the PTI values and am continuing to make small additions to try and nudge the chemistry into the PTI ranges while simultaneously reaching stability requiring only infrequent chemical additions. Thanks for your thoughts.