I guess the confusing part is that we are at $60K speced w/ IFCS and Natures2. When i swap out Nature2 SOFT SWG and remove IFCS we are at $63K....can't understand the math...
Almost ready to pull the trigger!
- Thread starter trophft
- Start date
I guess the confusing part is that we are at $60K speced w/ IFCS and Natures2. When i swap out Nature2 SOFT SWG and remove IFCS we are at $63K....can't understand the math...
- Jul 21, 2013
- 66,331
- Pool Size
- 35000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
Frankly I would fire the Pool Builder who will not build the pool you want at a reasonable price.
You are going to accept a piece of complex equipment that has questionable value while forgoing the piece of equipment that will benefit you daily in making sanitation of the water simple.
- Jun 7, 2017
- 10,021
- Pool Size
- 29000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Jandy Aquapure 1400
I have 3 returns running along the length of my pool on the bottom. My builder referred to these as "deep heat returns". They are for quicker heating by returning heat to the bottom of the pool for convection heating. These 3 were in addition to the 2 wall returns I was already getting along with 2 water features. All in all I have 4 lines returning into the pool. The wall returns on 1 line, deep heat on another and 2 water features on a 3rd and 4th.
A SWG has significantly more installation steps than the simple Nature2. The Nature2 non-SWG is just plumbing. It's fancy puck feeder. The FusionSoft is plumbing, electrical, hooking in with automation, etc. If you were to buy a FusionSoft for an existing pool, $3k would be high, but not out of line. The unit is around $1500 with the power supply and cell/vessel. Did I read above though that you are not getting automation?
My experience with builders is they are good at installing a pool but not for much else. Certainly not chemical balancing and equipment selection. You should dictate to them what you want and just let them install it. Seems like the more years they have in the industry, the less they know about anything current.
Only $1,200 for the infloor cleaning system? That almost sounds too cheap, if that’s what they’re actually charging. I just finished my pool build, and my PB and another PB estimated around $5K for that system. That would include a standalone pump to drive only the cleaners.
It sounds to me like your PB is basically running additional piping from your main pump to drive the floor system. That’s a good cost cutting measure but I wonder if a single pump can effectively drive the floor system and the rest of the pool at the same time.
I skipped the floor cleaning system and the water pressure driven robot offered by my PB, so I’ll be going with an electric robot.
Unfortunately, this PB is the lesser of all the evils and the one we felt most comfortable with (had an itemized breakdown, best presentation, most thorough consultation, etc.)...my wife is getting ****** because she thinks i'm sabotaging this deal by nit picking.
- Jun 7, 2017
- 10,021
- Pool Size
- 29000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Jandy Aquapure 1400
The pool builder is not doing you a favor by installing a pool for you.
- Jul 17, 2019
- 4,085
- Pool Size
- 13000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
I would call him on that big time. Usually those systems are several thousand dollars and should be equal to or more than a SWG.
PoolGate thanks. We had cut the Automation when we were "trimming the fat" to get down to our budget of $60k. Now we are considering adding Auto back ($1200) and adding the Fusion Soft 1400SWG ($1600), so now we're approaching $63K. When I asked if we could remove the IFCS to offset that and stay at $60K he said there's no more wiggle room he's at actual cost for those new items. Don't want to sour the deal since he's our best bet for a PB, and he's starting another in our neighborhood monday so that build is absorbing the travel costs for us to get in on budget.
That’s really odd. PVC pipe is cheap but the heads and labor aren’t.
Another thing that gets discussed here at times is the builders that have a set minimum package. If you delete something from their minimum package they don’t bring the price down accordingly. This is sounding more like what you are experiencing now.
The mineral system is all kickback or future sales. It also comes with a much smaller ‘trial cartridge’ that expires in 1/3 the time just like a printer. So the cost for the system can easily be eaten by the PB. IFCS does not make any repeat money until it fails, which usually enough time has passed to have moved on to a different pool company or homeowner. Much less of a guarantee for him.
Another thing that gets discussed here at times is the builders that have a set minimum package. If you delete something from their minimum package they don’t bring the price down accordingly. This is sounding more like what you are experiencing now.
The mineral system is all kickback or future sales. It also comes with a much smaller ‘trial cartridge’ that expires in 1/3 the time just like a printer. So the cost for the system can easily be eaten by the PB. IFCS does not make any repeat money until it fails, which usually enough time has passed to have moved on to a different pool company or homeowner. Much less of a guarantee for him.
- Jun 7, 2017
- 10,021
- Pool Size
- 29000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Jandy Aquapure 1400
I just looked at your contract. You have 2 line items for the Fusion. 1 for "sanitation" and one for "chlorination". This makes one think you are getting 2 products. Is your builder intentionally being misleading? The mineral system is not considered "sanitation" but a SWG is. Ha - I guess you could argue that you should get both the Fusion and FusionSoft!
Above all else, add iAqualink into your plan! Make sure you get an Aqualink-RS and not a -PDA. The PDA is worthless once you have the RS.
Above all else, add iAqualink into your plan! Make sure you get an Aqualink-RS and not a -PDA. The PDA is worthless once you have the RS.
- Jun 7, 2017
- 10,021
- Pool Size
- 29000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Jandy Aquapure 1400
Oh also - You have a very small amount of decking @ 500 sq feet. Make sure you have a guaranteed per sq foot pricing for additional decking. Mine was $6.50 or something like that. Decking will increase your total in a hurry once you realize you want/need more!
- Jun 7, 2017
- 10,021
- Pool Size
- 29000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Jandy Aquapure 1400
Ha - 1 more - Your pool looks like a standard 18'x 36' pool. You don't need 3 lights for a pool that size. 2 is more than adequate. Those lights are like $800 each you should be able to save some money removing one of them.
Did you sign this contract yet?
Did you sign this contract yet?
I guess on the contract the FUSION mineral cartridge is considered the "sanitizer" and the FUSION tablet feeder is the chlorinator (even though they're both housed on the same device)...
We haven't signed yet, but wanted to sign this week so he can start the dig on Monday when he start the other pool in our neighborhood (helping us defray the travel costs)...i don't want to rush this, but then again he's the only PB we've felt comfortable with and liked his reputation and quality, etc.
- Jun 7, 2017
- 10,021
- Pool Size
- 29000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Jandy Aquapure 1400
Ha - Yes I am sure of this, but it is misleading, at best.
Also - Did the $3k for adding back in the SWG include also adding the automation? Those numbers add up to the $3k. SWG with a VSP need some sort of automation to ensure the pump doesn't stop when the SWG is still running. This is in the installation manual for the SWG. Remind this to your builder. A dumb timer IMO does not provide an adequate level of protection.
And I will caution you about that IFCS. If you get it, and it is plumbed through separate plumbing and its own pump, use it or not, you will have to activate it once in awhile so the water doesn't get stagnant. If it was me I would not get it. Or, have it installed in such a way that it is tied into the regular plumbing where you don't need to do anything special to have water flow through it. Then at least you have more returns!
is the 1.5 HP spa blower necessary? could the spa jets run just on the main pump (when water feature is turned off of course)?
yes the $3000 would get us the FUSION SOFT and Aqualink (not sure the model yet, waiting)...
Does this seem like a fair and reasonable negotiation to send to PB?
Removing the following should get us the SWG and automation while staying at $60K
Remove IFCS and all related plumbing
Remove 1 LED pool light
Remove the 1.5 HP Jandy Spa Blower
Remove the special spa jet heads to basic ones
Those should offset the SWG and Aqualink right?
Trying to trim the fat on things we don't want/need in order to get the things we do!
Removing the following should get us the SWG and automation while staying at $60K
Remove IFCS and all related plumbing
Remove 1 LED pool light
Remove the 1.5 HP Jandy Spa Blower
Remove the special spa jet heads to basic ones
Those should offset the SWG and Aqualink right?
Trying to trim the fat on things we don't want/need in order to get the things we do!
- Jun 7, 2017
- 10,021
- Pool Size
- 29000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Jandy Aquapure 1400
Oh well dang that is totally worth it then! Just make sure it is iAqualink-RS and has enough aux for all the automation you want to do. Here is the selection guide.
- Jun 7, 2017
- 10,021
- Pool Size
- 29000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Jandy Aquapure 1400
I can't speak to the spa items but everything else looks good. Can you post a pic of the pool design? I am fairly certain 2 lights for the pool and 1 for the spa is enough but would be nice to compare that against the pool diagram. My pool is larger and the 2 Jandy Watercolor lights I have are more than enough. You can check out my night shots in my pics in my sigline.
Make sure you know the exact Aqualink you are getting! You do not want the PDA system and you DO want the RS system with full web access/programming capabilities.
Don't forget to add in a set price for extra decking!