Advice on Water Balance - post pool school

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Sacman11

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May 9, 2013
51
Winnipeg/Manitoba
I am fairly new to the pool ownership game (3rd) season and got rid of my weekly pool company telling me my water was good and decided to manage it myself this year. I have taken the TFP POOL School and have spent many hours reading.

I’m using two test kits (Taylor and ColorQ Pro 7)

My current pool chemistry is as follows:

Build Type: Saltwater Vinyl
Volume: 130000 liters (35,000gal)
------------------------------------------
Latest Test Result Summary:
FC: 2.9 (59 minutes ago)
CC: 2.9 (59 minutes ago)
pH: 7.3 (59 minutes ago)
TA: 157 (59 minutes ago)
CH: 328 (59 minutes ago)
CYA: 24 (59 minutes ago)
SALT: 3200 (59 minutes ago)
TEMPERATURE: 81° (59 minutes ago)
CSI: 0.61 (59 minutes ago)

So I started this process and my two concerns were high ALK (211) and PH (8.2) and low CYA 19

After about 1 week I was able to get it to what you see above.

I still have work to do but am curious about the recommended 60-80 total alk level that PoolMath and this forum recommend vs the standard 80-150 other sources spec. Ph seems straight forward. My CYA Is challangening low and I have had a hard time raising it using STABILZER I’m sick in skimmer method.

I am looking for advice to lower the TA to a good level while managing the PH. I can natural aerate with my pool slide and deck Jets when needed. Muric acid has been the chemical I am using to lower TA and PH, but am concerned my next app of acid will bring PH down below 7.2.

I am a little confused about the “ideal” levels for my pool as the pool school and pool math suggestions differ from the standard suggestions of other pool sources.

Anyone have any advice.

Oh ya my “fill” water chemistry has a PH of 7.7 and an ALK of 195
 
Which Taylor test kit?
We would trust it more than the ColorQ.

Lower TA will slow the pH rise. Industry recommendations are likely assuming the use of acidic trichlor tablets.

Generally, do not worry about the TA. Just focus on keeping the pH in the 7s and the TA will equalize itself. With high TA in your fill water, it will be difficult for you to lower the TA in the pool and keep it low.

Please add your location (City, State or City, Country) to your profile and pool details to your signature as described HERE as it will help us help you.
 
Thx I have updated my signature. My goal is to get TA to 100 then manage Ph a little better. I just added 8 more litres of Muratic Acid and am wondering if I should just let the pump run for 24 hours or if I should start aerating with the deck jets and waterslide to help maintain the PH while the TA drops from the acid?
 
If you had a pH of 7.3 and you added 8 LITERS of full strength (31.45%) muriatic acid, you’ve just crashed your pH into the 5s. Aerate to bring pH up NOW.
 
You have the right steps to lower TA, but you’re not doing them in the right order. The proper way to lower TA is:

1: Aerate to bring your pH to 7.8
2: Add muriatic acid as per PoolMath to a target of 7.2 pH
3: Repeat steps 1 and 2. TA will gradually fall with the acid additions to manage your pH. Make sure to keep the current TA level updated in the “now” section of Poolmath, as it affects the MA addition needed to affect pH.
 
I added a product called MAGIC ACID which isn’t full test MA. The directions called for 4 litres to drop 15ppm in a pool of my size (35k gallons). So I actually added 12 litres this aft with the hope to drop TA From 157 to around 110. Ph may fall to 6.8 (.05 ppm per 4 litres)

Should I start my aerators now or wait for acid to work on the TA.

Thx
 

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The acid does not "work on TA".

Again, you should only be adding acid to lower the pH and keep it in the 7s. Pay no attention to what it might do to the TA.
Unless you are trying to damage things ....

Are you using PoolMath?
 
Here is the latest update on the pool Chem... I just tested with these results.

Build Type: Vinyl
Volume: 130000 liters
------------------------------------------
Latest Test Result Summary:
FC: 1.8 (a minute ago)
CC: 1.9 (a minute ago)
pH: 6.9 (a minute ago)
TA: 108 (a minute ago)
CH: 337 (a minute ago)
CYA: 59 (a minute ago)
SALT: 3200 (a minute ago)
TEMPERATURE: 80° (a minute ago)
CSI: 0.02 (a minute ago)

I am not sure if I am accounting for the alkalinity properly. Using the ColorQ Pro this time as my tester. The LaMotte booklet says the following about TA.

“Cyanuir Acid contributes to the alkalinity test. The alkalinity reading should be adjusted to compensate for this. Do this by multiplying the cyanuric acid reading by 1/3 and subtracting this form the alkalinity reading.”

Ie. Alk-CYA*(1/3)=TA?? I think

So my above ALK of 108 is actually from the reading of 128-20=108

Which alk is the True carbonate alkalinity for water balance.
 
It’s my understanding that TA and PH are mutually related to each other, to help level or control Ph you need TA to be in range. To lower TA you will lower Ph.

I started with a ph of 8.2 and a TA of 220. My objective was to lower both into appropriate ranges. Get TA under control to better allow me to manage PH.

My last test that I took about 1/2 who my numbers are getting close. I haven’t crashed my pool chem or sunk my PH into the 5’s. I am aerating now with a PH of 6.9 and a TA of I think 108 (depending on how I calculate the alk-cya(1/3) or not so 108 or 128.

From all my reading if I mange my alk in the 60-100 level I should be able to hold Ph around 7.6 easier.
 
Stop focusing on TA. Any TA above 50 is ok. Add acid and lower your PH to 7.4 - 7.6 only when your PH gets to 8.

Every test does not have equal importance. FC/CYA are important and PH is important. They directly effect your water quality. CH and TA only matter in certain situations and right now for your pool they are fine.
 
If you used one of the Taylor kits that we recommend ... and all have ... then there is no need to worry about "correcting" the TA. PoolMath takes care of all that in the background and there is no need to apply a correction.

TFP recommendations are based on the "uncorrected" value which is what the test result should be.

- - - Updated - - -

I agree with Allen .... stop fussing over the TA. It is like the least important thing for you to worry about.

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You highest priority now is to get the pH up and stop damaging your heater.

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How did your CYA change from 24ppm to 59ppm ? Did you add any today?
 
I added stabilzer this morning in a sock in then skimmer.

I don’t think I have damaged anything yet. A ph of 6.9 is not great but it’s only been there for maybe an hour or so. I have read that ph as low as 6.8 temporarily isnt terrible as long as you are bring it back up right away which I think I am doing now with aeration.

I am using ColorQ Pro for testing recently. As much as I believe all the praise of the Taylor or TFP teat kits my eyes and color interpretation isn’t great.

Does the pool math app want me to input the ALK reading or the TA reading. Ie. does pool math auto calc the TA (Alk-cya(1/3). Cause I don’t see that anywhere
 
Yes, your fill water will help achieve the PH rise.
 

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