Completed New Construction - Start-up over, now what?

[mjrin2it]

Hi,
It's been one week since pools was filled and PB had her guy doing start up for the week (chemicals and brushing). Now it's up to me.

Issue: My TA cannot be this low, can it?

FC= 3
PH = 6.8
CYA = 50
TA = 0 - Swear to god, using the TF-100 kit, when I added the 5 drops of R-0008 The solution turned RED immediately. I didn't even add the R-0009.

This seems really odd and I even did it twice. I didn't do any other tests. Pool guy added about 6 tablets into inline chlorinator and turned the knob to 4 (full open) position.

I don't want my plaster to be ruined. Any suggestions?
Thanks,

 

[Texas Splash]

Your TA is probably zero or close to it, and the pH may be even lower than you think. Very acidic water conditions. I would recommend adding some baking soda to increase the TA by 20. Best to go slow and in small stages. Let it mix for about an hour and retest. If that TA is still lower than 50 (which we suspect it will be), add another bit of baking soda to increase TA by another 20 ppm. Make sure to use the PoolMath tool for all calculations. Once you get the TA to at least 50 and the pH to about 7-2-7.4 you should be in much better shape.

Also remember those tabs are acidic and can lower the pH and TA while increasing your CYA (which you probably don't need right now). I'd pull those tabs and stick to just regular bleach (not scented or splashless stuff).

 

[mjrin2it]

Your TA is probably zero or close to it, and the pH may be even lower than you think. Very acidic water conditions. I would recommend adding some baking soda to increase the TA by 20. Best to go slow and in small stages. Let it mix for about an hour and retest. If that TA is still lower than 50 (which we suspect it will be), add another bit of baking soda to increase TA by another 20 ppm. Make sure to use the PoolMath tool for all calculations. Once you get the TA to at least 50 and the pH to about 7-2-7.4 you should be in much better shape.

Also remember those tabs are acidic and can lower the pH and TA while increasing your CYA (which you probably don't need right now). I'd pull those tabs and stick to just regular bleach (not scented or splashless stuff).

Thank you Pat! I put my numbers into poolmath and it says to add 704oz of baking soda. That's alot of 12 pound bags is that the correct amount.
I feel like my PB dropped the ball. Why the heck did I put an inline chlorinator in if I'm just going to use liquid bleach? ha ha

 

[mknauss]

Replace the inline chlorinator with a SWCG. You will be thankful next summer.

 

[Texas Splash]

Yes, and even though your ideal TA goal may be quite a bit of baking soda, I would still go in stages. Let the chemical change acclimate a bit rather than dumping all at once. Yeah, I have an in-line as well. I haven't opened it in a couple years.

 

[mjrin2it]

Yes, and even though your ideal TA goal may be quite a bit of baking soda, I would still go in stages. Let the chemical change acclimate a bit rather than dumping all at once. Yeah, I have an in-line as well. I haven't opened it in a couple years.

Ok...I'll add about 3lbs and go from there.
Thanks.
Mike

 

[duraleigh]

3 lbs will have little effect. Please use the calculator (PoolMath) and add per Texas Splash's suggestions.

 

[mjrin2it]

3 lbs will have little effect. Please use the calculator (PoolMath) and add per Texas Splash's suggestions.

this pool is a new build. Today is the beginning of second week being plastered. Isn’t my alkalinity and ph supposed to be lower during this phase while I’m brushing? I thought the plaster, while curing would increase alkalinity and ph levels. Is that incorrect? And should I use soda ash instead of baking soda?

 

[duraleigh]

Your pH is wa-a-ay below normal. You must get pH up in the 7's. To do so, you first need measurable TA and you get that by adding baking soda (not soda ash.....it leaves a residual).

Follow Texas Splash's advice in post #2 and get TA measurable to around 50 and THEN adjust your pH into the mid 7's using 20 mule team borax.

Forget your chlorinator and your PB for now. You are the only one who will correct your pool and get back on track. I would focus on nothing except pH and TA

 

[Leebo]

Is the pool builder handling the startup or was it spelled out somewhere it was your responsibility to handle the startup of the new plaster? I saw they handled the first week, just making sure they weren’t going to do even more.

 

[mjrin2it]

Is the pool builder handling the startup or was it spelled out somewhere it was your responsibility to handle the startup of the new plaster? I saw they handled the first week, just making sure they weren’t going to do even more.

she said they were doing start-up but spelled out 5-7 days or until pool chemistry balanced. I was just thinking that since pool wasn’t balanced and her pool guy told me he “was done and I left you in good shape for a week” - apparently not. I will push back on PB a little. It’s not right in my mind. I don’t even know if it’s ok to stop the pumps running 24/7 at 2,500 rpms or if they need to keep running that much.

 

[mknauss]

Time is of the essence on your pH. I assume you are circulating this acidic water through your heater. It is being destroyed. Get the TA up now followed by the pH.

 

[mjrin2it]

Is the pool builder handling the startup or was it spelled out somewhere it was your responsibility to handle the startup of the new plaster? I saw they handled the first week, just making sure they weren’t going to do even more.

actually I just looked at the contract and it states PB is responsible to perform initiation of water chemistry balancing and startup for water that is swim ready.

 

[Jcvader99]

Take it from someone who just finished a new build and startup over the summer... just do what these guys tell you to. My builder had a 3 month process for startup, but I spent those 3 months watching them do nothing more than the normal weekly things they do for all pools. I waited those 3 months and the chemistry was never right. On the final day, I started "fixing" their mistakes using only what I found on this site. I got the TF-100 and it has been perfect ever since.

BTW... they did do "some" things correctly... they added massive amounts of baking soda for the first few weeks to get the TA up. They also put 2-3 gallons of acid in every week until the Ph was able to get below 8. Other than that, they didn't scrub the walls (i did that myself) and they didn't put in CYA (I did that also).

Bottom line is that I followed every bit of advice given here, and I had ZERO issues going into my 7th month now. Water is crystal clear, all my numbers are on par, and no issues with plaster/pebbles, etc...

"Just do it".

 

[wilkj1]

Replace the inline chlorinator with a SWCG. You will be thankful next summer.

i agree 100 % i did and man is my pool trouble free i have spent less than 30 mins a week mainly just looking at my pool

btw i cant think TFP enough thats why i do a monthly donation through paypal and that is still not near enough.

 

[Leebo]

she said they were doing start-up but spelled out 5-7 days or until pool chemistry balanced. I was just thinking that since pool wasn’t balanced and her pool guy told me he “was done and I left you in good shape for a week” - apparently not. I will push back on PB a little. It’s not right in my mind. I don’t even know if it’s ok to stop the pumps running 24/7 at 2,500 rpms or if they need to keep running that much.

Push back HARD. As Marty said the equipment has very corrosive water flowing in it. Get the Ta and pH up ASAP but inform the builder of the issue in case any damage has already been done.

 

[mjrin2it]

Push back HARD. As Marty said the equipment has very corrosive water flowing in it. Get the Ta and pH up ASAP but inform the builder of the issue in case any damage has already been done.

I am on it. Baking soda going in 12lb bags at a time thank you. PB still saying I’m fine and that alkalinity low so plaster can cure. I now need to find borax and cya and muiaric acid here in Dallas.
thank you.

- - - Updated - - -

 

[Texas Splash]

Baking soda going in 12lb bags at a time

I would still be a bit cautious and go in stages. Don't try to hit a specific (higher) TA number all at once. Even just 30 min to an hour is enough to let the first batch mix and retest. Part of that process involves watching how your pH will react with the sudden introduction of baking soda. Also something to consider, what is your CH? I don't believe you ever posted that. Most of us in this region have relatively hard water, so I suspect your local water, coupled with new plaster curing, will contribute to a growing CH in the coming weeks.

Once you get the TA to show something (let's say 50 for example) and a pH of 7.2 - 7.4, post back and also let us know what your CH level is. Then we'll use PoolMath to see what your overall water conditions are (still corrosive or scale potential). Then we can show you how to fine-tune those results.

 

[mjrin2it]

I would still be a bit cautious and go in stages. Don't try to hit a specific (higher) TA number all at once. Even just 30 min to an hour is enough to let the first batch mix and retest. Part of that process involves watching how your pH will react with the sudden introduction of baking soda. Also something to consider, what is your CH? I don't believe you ever posted that. Most of us in this region have relatively hard water, so I suspect your local water, coupled with new plaster curing, will contribute to a growing CH in the coming weeks.

Once you get the TA to show something (let's say 50 for example) and a pH of 7.2 - 7.4, post back and also let us know what your CH level is. Then we'll use PoolMath to see what your overall water conditions are (still corrosive or scale potential). Then we can show you how to fine-tune those results.

yep! I added one 12 lb bag - I am doing it in hour stages if that’s ok. I will test CH also. Pump still running at 2500 rpm/49 gpm Thanks

 

[setsailsoon]

Thank you Pat! I put my numbers into poolmath and it says to add 704oz of baking soda. That's alot of 12 pound bags is that the correct amount.
I feel like my PB dropped the ball. Why the heck did I put an inline chlorinator in if I'm just going to use liquid bleach? ha ha

Mike,

I will ditto the ph message. Get it up quickly, this is a must do your water is corrosive which means it's not good for equipment or your finish. On the chlorinator, you'll find it convenient to use when you're out of town so long as you keep your CYA on the low end of the range until you add your SWG.

I hope this helps.

Chris