Hello all, new to forum

[Tommy_G]

Just dropping in to say hi, and give a quick summary of my setup.


Fiberglass pool, approx 15 years old, been maintaining reasonably with "L" location close. Over all been fine experience, but last few years I have not been able to get crystal clear water. 3 Algae blooms this year has made me take to the internet for other options.


After reading "ALOT" on here and PoolForum, I had ordered my new test kit, and last night finally go to test my own water. At first the kit was a bit daunting, but I made it through it


My Readings were as follows:
1.4 FC
0.2 CC
7.6 PH
80 Alk
110 CalHard
90 CYA


Approx 18,500 gallons
4 cartridge hayward filter (just replaced all 4 cartridges last week, but others were years old)
Superpump (24/7)
inline cholorinator
Hayward Heater (only use if chilly and having a party)
Full Sun in Kentucky, from 11a-4p


Been using pucks for the past 15 years with L Shock as needed, still have some in cholorinator, have some in floating thing as well


In my frustration with L trying to sell me so many things, I ordered Chlorox Shock ( https://www.amazon.com/Clorox-Pool-Spa-33008CLX-Swimming/dp/B073XT7S5R ), and have already opened and use a bottle when I left last friday for the weekend. Didnt have my test kit yet, and at the end of fighting algae bloom, so figured I would shock it while gone. Pool is greyish now from dead algae, need to vaccum to waste when I get home from work today, also had to fill some yesterday to prepare for waste vaccum. So maybe after vaccum and fill, I will need to test again.


Or with my CYA so high, should I flush out a foot or two of pool water and refil with hose?


I am on information overload atm...


At any rate, appreciate all the helpful advice on the forums, its good to have a strong community of helpers !

 

[Texas Splash]

Hello Tommy and welcome! Yes, your CYA is a bit high. Here at TFP we use the [FC/CYA][/FC/CYA] to keep FC and CYA balanced properly. As you can see your FC was way too low for your elevated CYA which can easily result in algae. To remove algae we use a SLAM Process approach. Take a look at that page and let us know if you have any questions. I would recommend lowering the CYA a bit (water exchange) before starting to SLAM Process so you don't waste chemicals.

Testing your own water was a HUGE step in the right direction. At some point, please update your signature with all of that pool info (and test kit) so they show on each post. Save/review those Vital Links bleow in my sig and you'll begin to see much improvements in your water. Nice to have you with us.

 

[Derb22]

Welcome Tommy to thelast place you will ever have to stop for TFP pool upkeep!

Texas has you pointed you in the right direction. You couldn’t hardly help but have algae invade with the high CYA level. ( a typical pool store story so they can keep selling expensive stuff to you) I would follow the advice above.
First safely exchange about 50-60 % of the water being mindful of not damaging or floating your pool.
Then once that’s done and your CYA is around 30 lower PH to 7.2-7.4 and SLAM the pool to your CYA/FC AMOUNT. ( for thirty CYA it is a hold FC at or a little above 12 until you can pass the 3 SLAM test criteria.
1. Clear water
2. OCLT TEST
3. CC IS LESS RHAN .5 ppm.

After that, raise CYA to appropriate levels. Balance PH after FC COMES DOWN BELOW 10, and just maintaining FC to your CYA level and relying on your new found test skills to keep up with the pool.

Afgain welcome to TFP!!!

 

[Tommy_G]

Really didnt want to cycle water... with my fiberglass pool, i have always been leery of lowering it. However, it does have a daylight drain, and I have had it lowered about 2 feet before for a crack repair...

Guess I would have to do this a few times, and will take me probably a week or more to do it.

During that time, do I start adding liquid bleach to at least min levels (6ppm) to avoid another bloom, or just go ahead and shock it? As most have probably been through, feels odd just pouring that stuff into my pool...

The previous bloom looks "done", but as you said, the lower FC reading says it could be coming around again. I hate to pour bleach into a pool i am in process of draining, but on the other hand, would like to be able to use my pool

 

[mknauss]

You can exchange some water without draining.

If you place a low volume sub pump in the deep end and pull water from there while adding water in the shallow end (through a skimmer or into a bucket on a step so you lessen the water disturbance) you can do a fairly efficient exchange. That is assuming the water you are filling with is the same temperature or warmer than your pool water. If your fill water is much cooler than your pool water, then switch it. Add the water to the deep end (hose on bottom) and pull water from the top step.

The location of the pump and fill hose may change if you have salt water, high calcium, etc.
In my pool, with saltwater and high calcium when I drain, I put the pump in the deep end and hose in shallow end. The water in the pool weighs more per unit volume than the fill water from the hose.

Be sure to balance the water out and water in so the pool level stays the same. Also be sure your pool pump is disabled during this process. Once started do not stop until you have exchanged the amount of water you wish.

 

[DeanP66]

If you don't like bleach, you can use liquid chlorine. It's actually the same thing except liquid chlorine has a higher concentration of chlorine (usually either 10 or 12.5%). In case you don't know, all hard chlorine like tablets, powdered shock and granules contain either CYA or calcium in them and will raise your levels with every dosage. That's probably why your CYA is so high right now. Those pucks in your chlorininator are doing you no favors. You should stop using them altogether and stick to liquid chlorine only. It doesn't contain any CYA.

A 50% drain and refill one time would get your CYA in the 45-50 range which is just fine and will allow you to SLAM your pool to get it all cleared.

 

[YippeeSkippy]

ohhhhhhhh nooooooo! how much of this clorox brand shock have you added? It contains copper. No bueno. Bad for pools but when copper stains, it stains fiberglass especially hard.

So if you decide to do some water exchanges this would be a good thing to lower any copper in there.

I will say that in 7 years of pool ownership, I have had algae exactly....NEVER! That is because I have always followed the TFPC method. I think you will really appreciate it once you get used to it. I spend less than $100-$150 a year on the pool, and I see and read about folks spending hundreds each month and I'm gobsmacked!

Holler if you have questions.. we're all happy to help. Again, welcome to TFP!

Maddie

 

[Tommy_G]

Ok, so I came home tonight after work, and vacuumed out to waste some of the residual algae still hanging around in pool. When I came home it had a green tint again

But I went ahead and pumped out some water, I would guess maybe 18" or so. Refilling now...

Removed pucks and added one gal of 6% bleach during the refill...

Will retest in the morning to see what my new CYA is.

 

[Tommy_G]

Just for documentation

8/14/2018 730am
2.5 FC
0-0.5 CC (very light pink before drops)
7.8 PH
70 alk
70-80 Cya ? Kinda hard to tell

On CYA test I guess you have to do it quickly as it clears up if you pause for even 2 secs, or am I suppose to kinda wait? Might take sample to pool store just to see what it reads, if I get a chance this morning... and no worries, I won't buy anything.

Pool didn’t quite fill to skimmer level, but it appears another partial drain tonight will get me closer to my target of 50 CYA.

Since I will probably need to SLAM once I get CYA under control, I'm not sure what to do ATM. I am going to toss in another gallon of 6% to keep this bloom to a minimum, as I am hoping to swim in it this weekend.

I will wait an hour or two in case someone wants to correct me

Thanks all for the help.

Tonight's ToDo List:
Drive Kids around... then...
Partial Drain and Vacuum to waste, clean filters, Refill.

Question:
Since I can't be here every 2 hours to keep CH high during SLAM, do I over shoot a bit? I can probably start after sun is down (sun off pool by 6p, and put in 3 checks at 2 hours), then sleep Then check again in the morning. But then I have to go to work. So in the morning, can I overshoot the CH a bit to hold me over til I get home?

PS This is one of the reasons I was shooting for 50 CYA, best I can tell from reading, that helps offset if you can't be around all the time, but will require a bit more bleach to maintain.

 

[Tommy_G]

Just ran by L for water test, it was incredible to watch. I am not just saying this to be funny, or see I told you so, or to bash anyone. but...

I watched him perform the tests, when he tested my PH, one of the red drops actually fell outside of the container... When he did Chlorine, he sprayed a continuous stream from the reagent bottle.

I asked him to hit CYA, I am not sure what he did, I guess maybe they have a huge bottle of Reagent? It was in a pint sized L bottle, that he filled for the second half of the test. He dripped in much faster than I, and read it much faster. Since I am not sure yet on this test, I am unsure if this is right or not.

He got a result of 40, I got 70-80. Sample taken approx 10 mins after mine.

So, I guess now I am a bit stuck, if my CYA is really in the 40 range, I don't need to empty and refill, I can go straight to SLAM. I guess I will try my test again, and if I have time, I will take it back to L and get a different worker to test it for me.

Any other suggestions? The CYA readings are so far off right now, and after reading the thread about the guy trying to fix the campground pool, I know I need to know my CYA better than between 40-80.

Maybe I can youtube example CYA readings to see some other folks do it.

Anyway, rest of the numbers were good, and just for documentation, I did decide to add another gallon of 6%, figured if I have to empty I would only lose about 1/4 of it, and if I can SLAM it just gets me a tad higher to start

 

[Texas Splash]

I wouldn't bother going back to the pool store for their free test. You've had enough thrills for one day there. Stick with your own testing. Maybe this will help you:

CYA Testing:
Proper lighting is critical for the CYA test, so you want to test for CYA outside on a bright sunny day. Use the mixing bottle to gently mix the required amounts of pool water and R-0013 reagent, let sit for 30 seconds, then gently mix again. Recommend standing outside with your back to the sun and the view tube in the shade of your body at waist level. Then, begin squirting the mixed solution into the skinny tube. Watch the black dot until it completely disappears. Once it disappears, record the CYA reading. To help the eyes and prevent staring at the dot, some people find it better to pour & view in stages. Pour some solution into the viewing tube, look away, then look back again for the dot. Repeat as necessary until you feel the dot is gone. After the first CYA test, you can pour the mixed solution from the skinny view tube back to the mixing bottle, gently shake, and do the same test a second, third, or fourth time to instill consistency in your technique, become more comfortable with the testing, and validate your own CYA reading. Finally, if you still doubt your own reading, have a friend do the test with you and compare results.

By the way, there are TF-100 videos on YouTube.

But if you still confirm your CYA to be about 40, then make sure the pH is at about 7.2 and increase the FC to "16" which would be the correct SLAM/Shock level for that CYA as seen on the [FC/CYA][/FC/CYA]. Hope that helps.

 

[React]

I agree with TS... stick to your own readings and do not get tested at the pool store again. You have seen with your own eyes that they aren't testing correctly...

I would not waste your time slamming until you do a drain/refill to get your CYA levels where they need to be. You will be forced to up your shock level of your FC very high on your slam and it will get expensive quick (I previously made this mistake). I know you don't want to do it but you'll be glad you did once complete.

FYI - I could have used my pool pump to remove water but I bought a cheap sum pump from Harbor Freight (20% coupon online) for around $40-45. I found this to be a very easy way to drain (had to do a 1/3 of my pool).

 

[Tommy_G]

Thanks Texas, Now that you have quoted that I do recall reading that at some point. I will attempt this tonight when I get a chance.

7.2 PH is kinda low, I guess I need to hit Lowes for some Muriatic Acid today.

SLAM article says "Check and adjust the PH to between 7.2 and 7.5", is 7.2 an opinion, or it just works better that low. I would hate to lower it that far if I just have to raise it again.

Thanks for all your help, I am going to try redoing the test a few times, and have my son do it as well.

- - - Updated - - -

React,

I have always used my pump for this, it is so fast

Plus I use that time to vacuum waste out anyway. Any reason why you wouldn't use the pump?

 

[Texas Splash]

7.2 is safe. I would go for the lower end of the 7s (orange) since you never know how long your SLAM will last. Remember the pH will increase when the FC is elevated for the SLAM which is the reason it is lowered before starting. Once you complete the SLAM and let the FC fall, the pH might fall slightly, but more than likely it will be right back where you want it after the SLAM.

 

[JimMarshall]

Tommy, shoot for 7.2. One of the major reasons that we go for 7.2 is that your pH will drift up over the course of the SLAM Process, so we like to start at the bottom end of the "OK" range. The other reason is that when your FC is elevated > 10PPM, the pH reading isn't accurate, so we like to start with it low to avoid it getting too high since we won't be able to accurately test it again until after your SLAM is complete.

 

[React]

Thanks Texas, Now that you have quoted that I do recall reading that at some point. I will attempt this tonight when I get a chance.

7.2 PH is kinda low, I guess I need to hit Lowes for some Muriatic Acid today.

SLAM article says "Check and adjust the PH to between 7.2 and 7.5", is 7.2 an opinion, or it just works better that low. I would hate to lower it that far if I just have to raise it again.

Thanks for all your help, I am going to try redoing the test a few times, and have my son do it as well.

- - - Updated - - -

React,

I have always used my pump for this, it is so fast

Plus I use that time to vacuum waste out anyway. Any reason why you wouldn't use the pump?

No reason just wanted an excuse to buy one for other purposes Good luck!

 

[DeanP66]

When draining with your pool pump, you have to make sure to not drain the water below the skimmer because your pump will suck air and could burn out and die if left that way too long. You can avoid this, if you can shut off your skimmer at the equipment pad, but if not, a submersible pump is the way to go.

 

[Tommy_G]

8/14/18 8pm
drained about 1/4 pool or so, vacuumed to waste, cleaned filters, brushed

turned off jets during fill over night





8/15/18 430am (yawn)
Almost done filling
Jets on for 10 mins and brush
tests
1.0 FC
0 CC
7.8 PH
60-70 alk
55 CYA


Added 3-4 C of muriatic acid - deep end by jet
Swept
Waited 15 mins
Swept
Added 121 oz of 8.25 bleach - shallow end jet and down side (away from acid pour)
Swept

Waiting now for about an hour, then going to check PH

hooing to start slam this morning if PH is low enough. Pool really isn’t very green, cloudy though.

hoping for swim party sat... not sure if I should SLAM but I don’t want to wait another night to do the overnight test...

going to wait and see what pool looks like this morning when sun is coming out...

30min nap incoming

 

[JimMarshall]

Yes you are gonna need to SLAM. No need for an overnight test for that

 

[Tommy_G]

So when I retested at 6am, PH dropped but only to about 7.5ish, so I added more acid (maybe 2C?) and let it circulate about an hour. I didn't add all the acid that pool calc said before, so I figured I needed to add more, plus its kinda hard to tell how much you are putting in without measuring it first.

8/15/18 8am
FC 6.0
PH 7.2-7.3
CYA 55

Using pool calculator, it had said to use 3 gals of 8.25 bleach, but only had 2 on hand, so put those in and went to work. Weather is overcast and looks like possible rain, so should be a good SLAM day

I can't retest until about 6p tonight, so just gonna have to be what it is til I can get more bleach and get home.

I have a few questions:
When testing TC, many say to use the 10ml test and only 1 scoop of reagent. Is this ok, and it will still get accurate readings?

I am not really sure I have algae, pool is cloudy (can barely see brush in bottom of deep end), I feel like it is dead from prior bloom, but perhaps not. SLAM says keep shock levels until crystal clear, but this seems wasteful, isnt the process of removing dead algae needed to make it clear? Keeping FC at 20 doesnt help clear the pool does it?

If I am looking to have people over this weekend, is FLOC still useful to help get the debris congealed and sunk to bottom of pool? In order to FLOC you need to turn off jets, and SLAM mentions not to turn of jets, so curious how people get the debris from dead algae out of pool.

Thanks all again for the help, pool looks better already. Sorry no picture this morning