Newbie wants to be sure I'm on the right track

[Steve Bee]

Hi everyone,

First post.

I'm a complete newbie to pools and am working my way up to opening this weekend on my new pool.

I've read all my manuals, and want to be sure I'm doing the right sequence:

I pulled winter cover, filled, and done some "shocking" or "slamming", but to be honest, I haven't tested yet. Just dumped some bleach in and running the pump to start killing stuff. I have skimmed it and vacuumed it to a decent cleanliness level and done a backwash.

I am now ready to start getting levels up to snuff before firing up the SWG and heater.

Here are my questions:

1. The SWG manual says that I have to bring the pool up to appropriate levels before turning on the SWG. I assume I do this with traditional bleach/chlorine etc..

2. My father in law who owned a non-heated chlorine AG pool for many years, dumped the bleach into the skimmer. I have since read this was bad for my heater as the bleach water was pretty concentrated as it hit the heater pretty quickly in the cycle. I really hope he didn't mess it up!

3. The salt cell that was installed was either cracked by the installer (Hayward T CELL 5), or had a factory defect and sprung a leak. Pool company replaced with GLX (which is new model #). The GLX has a big red tag that says to start the control unit before plugging the cell into the control unit that the TC5 did not. Anyone know why this? I had plugged (but not started) the old TC5 in, so I am hoping this isn't an issue either.

Any other tips would be appreciated! I know I have to get a "proper" test kit for enduring value, but can I get the ball rolling with the cheap-o strips supplied by Aquatrol? I want to open asap.

Thanks!

 

[Steve Bee]

Sorry, two more questions for a newbie:

1. My Hayward TI pump switch has "Program, Run, Off".... but nowhere does my manual talk about how to "program" my pump. I don't see any control panel either... super confused on if my pump is programmable or not. I am working out through here how long I should be running it for.
2. While I wait for a good test kit, and am fumbling around with adding liquid chlorine, how long should I have the pool covered vs. uncovered? Is always covered best until pool is open and running?

Thanks everyone!

 

[mknauss]

Welcome to the forum!

The test strips are useless. You need a proper test kit, ASAP. Are you near the US border? The best test kit available is the TF100 from TFTestkits.net. But they cannot ship to Canada as Lowry and Assoc are the sole agent for Taylor test kits in Canada. You can have a TF100 shipped to a mail drop at the US border and drive over to pick it up. Get the Speedstir and XL option.

1. Correct.
2. Not a good practice. Whats done is done. You will know if there are issues.
3. I would follow the manufacturers suggestion. Not sure why. How is your SWCG hooked up? Do you have automation? Are the pump and SWCG on the same timer? I will have to look at a Hayward TI pump.

It will reduce your FC loss if you keep the pool covered.

With new water, I suggest adding 30 ppm CYA (place powder in a sock and hang in front of a return). Then add LC each day to maintain 3 ppm FC in the water.

Keep asking questions!

Take care.

 

[Steve Bee]

Thanks! I am about a 1 hr drive from Ogsdenberg NY, but short on time and don't have a day in the foreseeable future to make the trip and swim season is basically opening up now (especially with the heater). I will either order through an Amazon.ca importer or through Lowry and get the K-2006 (depending on what Lowry quotes me)

Do I also need a Taylor K-1766 Chloride Salt Water Drop Test Kit? I guess I should also order some reagents while I'm at it?

The SWG or pump are not on a timer, I've read through here that apparently the SWG and pump should be running at the same time? The SWG is automatic, so I don't think it is timer based.

Right now, I've run the pump for like 12-20 hrs per day.... probably way more than needed, but I figured filtering the water a lot would be a good start.

 

[mknauss]

It is a good idea to have a salt test. That way you can be sure you need salt as you should not rely on what the SWCG says.

Beware of the plain K2006. It is very limited in the number of tests you get. Best value is the TF100. If you must get a K2006 get a C version.

Your SWCG must be on a timer as it should never have power to it when the pump is not running. They can explode if activated without flow. The flow switch is a Secondary safety device.

Can you fill out a signature? Read Pool School - Read This BEFORE You Post

 

[Steve Bee]

I am ordering a 2006C + Salt kit unless I find out if I can ship a TF100 to a relative in the US and have them mail to me. Not sure that's any faster.

I totally created a signature, not sure what happened there. Here it is! (I'll write it out, in case I didn't save right again)

7600 gallon, AG vinyl, Hayward Pro Series S244T Filter (24in), Hayward Turbo Injection 2sp pump, Pentair Mastertemp125 NG heater, Hayward Aquatrol Low Salt SWG (GLX 5 cell)

 

[Steve Bee]

So I've ordered my 2006C and salt kit, now we wait!

Tested with an Aquacheck stick that came with my SWG last night. FC is at 0... no surprise as it's been a couple days since I dumped 2 gallons of bleach in. Otherwise, the pool looks good! Clear to the bottom and nothing looks funky. Can I assume with minimal risk that I don't have any big issues?

Maybe I will get lucky enough to open this weekend with "close enough" water balance.

I am guessing I should shock again? Or just go for target FC levels and then add my salt?

I am very confused as to when I add salt to the pool.

 

[kellyfair]

Don’t add anything except liquid chlorine until you get your test kit. Hopefully you won’t have any problems, since your water looks good.

Once you’ve tested, learned if you need to SLAM or not, and passed SLAM if one was needed, then you will add your salt.

 

[Steve Bee]

Hi Kelly

Marty suggested 30 PpM CYA

 

[kellyfair]

Hi Kelly

Marty suggested 30 PpM CYA

Brand new water, haven’t added anything but liquid chlorine? Yep, you want to do what Marty recommended and add the CYA. Can continue adding liquid Chlorine, as Marty said.

If you have used pucks in this water, or added anything else, please let us know!

 

[Steve Bee]

Nope, that's it! Just good old bleach. I added it to the pool properly this time, slowly in front of the return jet, and some around the perimeter. I put a little over a gallon of what I think is 8% bleach (concentrated store stuff, didn't have a percentage) after a vacuum last night.

I will get some CYA and add it tonight.

I am happy to report that my pool is at 74 without firing up the heater or covering it. So it is getting plenty of sun and it looks like I won't have to be running the heater a lot this season!

I am unhappy to report that birds love my pool. Lots of poop on the rails and I vacuumed up a decent amount. It was a popular bird bath this spring when the winter cover was on with some water on top.

Guess I need to find one of those scarecrow owls and should up the chlorine to be safe until the test kit arrives?

 

[Steve Bee]

Found out some stuff today too. My pump is automatic with a timer for 4 cycles between 2 speeds, not sure exactly what that means, but my vendor says you just switch it to "Program" and leave it. I have just been putting it in "Run" mode, which is high gear for 10-24 hours. My SWG is automatic too. So, I basically have no control over run times!

http://www.trevi.com/p-969-turbo-injection-pump-15-hp-2-speed.aspx

Of course when I started asking questions about when to add salt and turn on the SWG, all I got was "come in with a sample and we'll tell you what to do".... *sigh*

 

[Steve Bee]

My test kit isn't arriving for at least another week! Sad part is that I found out the day after I ordered my K-2006C through Amazon my sister-in-law was coming to visit from Nevada. There's probably a pool store every block in Nevada with TF100's.

I am anxious to get my pool open and SWG running! I am just blindly adding LC every couple of days and waiting patiently, but I want to swim darn it!

I have found that leaving the cover on is helping with the bird situation. It is less time consuming to pressure wash the solar cover than vacuum up the bird poop. The grackles should be moving on soon, I hope.

 

[mknauss]

TF100 is only sold online. It is rare to find any test kit that does all the required tests in a pool store.

You must be able to control schedule, SWCG %, etc. No way you can manage your chlorine needs without being able to control it.

Look for operating manuals etc. Technically, the pool builder should have left you all of them.

 

[Steve Bee]

Yes, of course, the SWG is controlled by percentage. The pump is a Hayward Turbo Injection pump. 1.5 HP 2 speed and should have 4 built in timer cycles:

Setting 1 - Pump runs 24 hours on Hi Speed ( single tone )
Setting 2 - Pump runs 18 hours on Hi, 6 hours on Low ( 2 tones )
Setting 3 - Pump runs 12 hours on Hi, 12 hours on Low ( 3 tones )
Setting 4 - Pump runs 6 hours on Hi, 18 hours on Low ( 4 tones )


http://www.trevi.com/p-969-turbo-injection-pump-15-hp-2-speed.aspx
https://www.hayward-pool.ca/shop/en/canada/15-hp--2-sp-turbo-injection-w--base-sp33152b
https://www.hayward-pool.ca/assets/documents/poolscanada/pdf/manuals/turbo-injection-bilingual.pdf

The manual I got doesn’t say how to initiate the timer cycles. I called Hayward and the guy on the phone was even surprised that info is missing from the manual when went and pulled it from Hayward's own site. I poked around other manuals and came across the information in manual for the Ultra Max (see pg. 3). The guy said at Hayward that they would be very similar pumps and to try that. Seems there are a lot of little product variations with these pumps.

https://hayward-pool-assets.com/ass...-IS-2900-HC-07-can-bilingual.pdf?fromCDN=true

So I tried this last night, and I can only seem to get to Setting 3 (3 tones) before it cycles back to Setting 1 (one tone). I took the cover off, put in some LC last night and put on Setting 3 at around 10pm. I went out this morning to put the cover on and I think it's running on low, so I guess I did not achieve "Setting 3".

I have read the article on pump run time, but to be honest, what I took away from it was that I will have to run to generate chlorine with my SWG. What is not really explained in the manual is the relationship between pump run time and percentage of chlorine generated. I figured from all of this I would just set my pump to 12hrs Hi, 12hrs low (if I can get to this magical Setting 4) and leave it once I find the right % setting on the SWG to generate the desired level of FC. Otherwise I am trying to figure out my pump's flow rate and all that jazz and set up a schedule where I am running the pump myself? What is better, to run your pump for a shorter time with a higher % setting on the SWG, or run the pump longer with a lower % setting on the SWG?

I could definitely use guidance in this area, but I gather a lot of this is fiddling with the settings and pump run times until your water is testing consistently?

 

[Steve Bee]

ok got some pool store testing

 

[Steve Bee]

So I put this all into Pool Math and their recommendations were pretty close. My pool is actually closer to 7400 gallons, guess I thought my water was deeper. I measured it tonight.

So I added the following,

900 g Stabilizer, in a sock in front of the return jet (too much for skimmer) that's the size container I bought before the test, they recommended 1.2 kg - I think this should get me pretty close to 30 ppm
10 cups of Alkalinity plus to raise total TA
38 kg of salt - will start the generator tomorrow morning

The guy tried to sell me Calcium Plus, but I declined saying I have a vinyl liner. He said something about protecting pool equipment, but remembered you all saying ignore CH in an AG vinyl lined pool.

I know I am being impatient, but erred on the side of caution. My pool has been clear and clean and I haven't done an official "SLAM" but kept the FC up "around" ideal levels testing with strips. I am anxious to swim!

 

[azide999]

Hey, are you sure you have the right pool volume? An S244T and a 1.5 hp pump are a lot of filter/pump for a 7600 gallon AGP. Salt generator and heater aside, you could probably run your filter for only 2 hours a day at high speed!

 

[Steve Bee]

That is right yes! I have a low salt generator that has a target of 1500 ppm, I also have glass media in my filter which account for the larger size? I did find it odd when people started commenting on how big the filter was. Now I am paranoid to turn on the SWG fearing I will hit crazy FC levels! I have a son with special needs, so our goal was always to have "lower chemical" input into the pool. Is over filtering bad?

I will start low and slow on the SWG, I don't mind supplementing with LC for the beginning while I get it tuned in.. I have to filter for 24 hrs since dumping all that stuff don't I?

Here is a pic of the water this morning

 

[azide999]

I don't have experience on the salt side of pools, so I don't know how to advise on the salt generator and pump running time. I think that the trick would be to determine how long your salt generator needs to be on to sufficiently chlorinate and then run the pump to mirror that.

My thought on filtering with the S244T is no problem on having a large filter - better efficiency, less maintenance. You may be able to run your pump on low all the time that it is scheduled to be on which will save a massive amount of electricity. You should only need to run the pump for an hour or two after liquid chlorine addition, but again, I know nothing about salt generators and how long it should run. Hopefully someone else will be able to help.