New pump and accesories

[OmaTacoma]

Hello everyone at TFP,

We recently purchased an older home in Temple, TX last summer. The pool has seen some better days as I am guessing it was built in the 70s. It doesn't appear the last couple of owners did much maintenance to the pool or the equipment.

Last summer we had a pool company service the pool and complete the routine maintenance/water checks as we settled in to the new home. Towards the end of the summer I learned about water chemicals/products and began servicing the pool myself. We also purchased a robotic cleaner to assist with the maintenance.

We plan to upgrade the pool in a series of steps to bring it back to its glory days and enjoy it for what it is.

The first order of business is to install a new pump, potentially a new filter and redo the existing electrical wiring and plumbing to get it ready for pool season. Since we are in Texas we normally have an extended summer versus the rest of the country and will plan around efficiency. The home also has single pane windows, coupled with a pool can make for a steep electrical bill.

The pool is a rectangular pool 16'x32' with shallow end at 3' and deep end at 7'. This works out to ~21k gallons.


The current equipment is:

-Hayward Max-Flow II Pump Model SP2707X101HP 3450RPM/1HP

-Pentair Tagelus Model 145241 60GPM with 325lbs of #20 Silica sand capacity

-2 mechanical timers. One timer for the pump and the other timer appears it went to a pump for a cleaner which the piping is capped off inside the pool. We are thinking the pump stopped functioning and was never replaced, or one of the previous owners took the pump/cleaner with them

-2 circuit breakers

-GFCI outlet with switch for pool light

-Plumbing system with many bends, thinking it is 1.5" PVC. Chlorinator, Jandy space saver valve and Jandy check valve

-One main drain at the deepest part of the pool

-One skimmer


Our plan is to:

-Install an energy efficient variable speed pump. Thinking Hayward or Pentair

-Replace filter (if it looks worn) or clean out current filter and apply 325lbs of new #20 Silica sand (Unaware of last time it was replaced)

-Remove both mechanical timers and install 1 new mechanical timer. If the pump has a timer then we can eliminate both timers

-Remove circuit breaker for secondary non-existent pump.

-Install smaller electrical box with 1 circuit breaker, GFCI outlet and light switch

-New PVC plumbing, new Jandy valve/check valve and remove chlorinator

-Build pad for pump/filter


Our questions are:

-What does everyone recommend for the pump given the size of the pool and wanting to achieve efficiency? Budget wise I think we would like to stay in the ~$500-800 range

-Size of PVC plumbing? Currently thinking 2"

-The home is 120v AC. Would it matter if the pump is set up to run at 115v/230v?

Thank you for any input/advice!

 

[Texas Splash]

Hello and welcome to TFP! Congrats on the new home and pool. Since your pool set-up is so simple, you really have the option of a VSP as you noted above, or even a 2-speed if you wanted. Either is fine a very cost efficient. Of course VSPs are becoming increasingly popular for their programmability, power, and efficiency (possible electric rebates), but they do come with a cost. 2-speeds generally handle the load of a pool easily while running on low all the time except when cleaning. Prices vary widely, and both Pentair & Hayward make great products, so it's a matter of shopping really. 2" plumbing is plenty for that pool, and I suspect even 1.5 would suffice just as well if you had to reduce it to accommodate some new equipment. That's something you'll have to watch for when shopping.

I suspect your home is actually has 220 power. Your water heater, stove, dryer, and perhaps 1 or 2 other items are generally 220, it's just that most your outlets are 110V. Not positive, but your pump may be 220v, then if you have something else outside it may be 110v. A simple voltmeter can confirm. Since most pumps are 220v, that would be an easy swap. My pump happens to be 110v.

If your filter housing looks solid, then you could save some money and just swap the sand. Sand however usually lasts a lifetime if not messed-up with nasty pool store products, so you could try a deep clean first before changing the sand. Your call though since you don't know the previous history.

Looks like a very nice set-up. Very simple and straight-forward much like mine. Since you don't have a lot of auxiliary features (fountains, waterfalls, spa, etc) you can make the upgrades as simple or complex as you like really. Oh, here's another thought ....... since you are upgrading, you might consider a salt water generator (SWG) to produce your chlorine for you. This way you don't have to add bleach manually each day - not a big deal anyways. But many folks love their SWG for convenience. They are installed in the plumbing and wired for electric. Both a 2-speed or VSP will support water flow through an SWG, but the programmable features (RPMs) of the VSP may be a slightly better match. You won't want to use that in-line chlorinator on a routine basis full of tablets. The tabs increase your stabilizer too much. In fact, when you do test your water (on your own), you may find your CYA level is already too high. So you might want to ensure you already have a TF-100 or Taylor K-2006C test kit in-hand to check.

I'm sure others will reply with some thoughts. Have a great day & weekend.

 

[CJadamec]

Welcome to TFP!

Glad you found us.

The first thing you should add to your equipment list is a good test kit like the TF-100. Being able to manage your own water testing and getting free of the pool store will save you hundreds in chemicals a year. You will have cleaner water than you ever knew was possible in a residential pool. There is a lot of good info in Pool School to get you going.

As for your equipment right off the bat if your sand filter isn't leaking or shooting sand back into the pool there is no reason at all to replace it. You may want to do a deep clean of the sand in your filter to take care of all the stuff backwashing leaves behind. We never recommend replacing sand in a filter that hasn't been used in a baqua pool. Sand simply doesn't wear out. By the looks of your photo who ever plumbed your filter didn't use any unions so getting the multiport valve off your filter will require cutting some pipes.

Jandy valves are rebuildable with a simple set of O-rings. Unless the valve bodies are leaking again there's no need to replace them.

Glad to see you are ditching the chlorinator. Are you thinking of going with an SWG?

Now for the pump, you could simply replace the pump motor you have right now with a 2-speed motor for about $300 and have a very efficient pump. You can get a new two speed mechanical timer and be done with it. Or if you want to ditch the timers altogether and go for a new pump a Pentair Superflo VS pump has its own built in timer and will use as little energy as possible. They cost around 650 if you shop online.

 

[OmaTacoma]

Good morning everyone,

Thank you so far for your feedback. I have never researched a SWG but I will today after work. I also purchased the TF-100 kit with speed stir and everything else that was recommended here on this forum. Will also look into a 2 speed pump vs a variable speed.

Thank you!

 

[OmaTacoma]

Good morning everyone,

After spending a good time reviewing recommendations on TFP, I went ahead and ordered the PentAir SuperFlo Variable Speed Pump #342001. The pump looks like it comes with 1.5" unions which I will be using 1.5" PVC for the plumbing.

I have learned it is best to use high pressure unions on the pump. Are they needed at the filter inlet/outlet? If so, would hardware store PVC Schedule 40 unions work? Trying to avoid shipping time or pay 200% markup over at Leslies in town if I can order them now while I wait for pump to ship. As mentioned by CJadamec, the last person cemented the PVC pipes to the filter's multiport valve, any tips on getting the PVC pipes off to attach unions? Thinking of using a hacksaw to cut flush with multiport valve and using a smaller hacksaw and cutting the inner portion of the PVC.

Thanks for everyone's help so far!

 

[Texas Splash]

Any schedule 40 products you can find locally should be fine for your connections. There are some who like the high-temp stuff at the pump just in case there's ever an overheating issue to help reduce the chance of meltdown and rupture, but that's always the case. As for that multiport ... Ugh ... I think the best Rx may be patience. Good luck, and by the way .... thank you for being a TFP Supporter!

 

[CJadamec]

PVC cuts easy with a circular saw if you have a battery powered one that will make quick clean cuts. Otherwise just about any hand saw will work. Debur the edges of the cut pipe before you glue them back together. Once you get the pipes going to the multiport cut everything will unthread from the multiport. None of the fittings going into the multiport should glued in place. Go slow and make your cuts in a place where you have plenty of room to put a new fitting on.

If you are can wait a day or two for shipping Supply house is a great place to get PVC fittings for a good price. They ship super fast on anything they have in stock. I get most of my orders from them next day.

Your pump does ship with unions they will fit 1.5 and 2 inch pipe.

 

[OmaTacoma]

Thanks for the advice everyone! Gold Supporter

Back in January the bushes, old wooden fence around pool equipment were removed and area cleaned up for plants. Left it alone since we were looking at having pool renovated and did not want to plant anything to have it damaged in the process. Well looks like spring/summer is here in Texas and time to clean up the area. Will post updates as we go along.

 

[Texas Splash]

Big change! I really like that stonework.

 

[OmaTacoma]

Big change! I really like that stonework.

Hehe thanks.

The progress today, its going to be a PITA to remove PVC from the filter's valve and Jandy valves. Think I will order new Jandy valves to make it easier. Also looks like the sand was replaced before as they dumped the old sand around the filter.

 

[Flying Tivo]

This might be a good time to check your spider gasket on the filter.
Good Job!

Felipe

 

[CJadamec]

I get the feeling there are bags of concrete in your future.

 

[OmaTacoma]

I get the feeling there are bags of concrete in your future.

Like this concrete pad that probably has been buried for over 30 years?

Had to run a few errands today which took up a good amount of time. Was able to dig some dirt out to find a concrete pad for the pool equipment. Not sure when that was built but I would guess back in the 70s with the pool. Found some other interesting things, never know what you might find.

- - - Updated - - -

This might be a good time to check your spider gasket on the filter.
Good Job!

Felipe

Thanks, the spider gasket on the filter looks like the newer design. More of a funnel shape than a flat gasket. I did find a spider gasket on the ground, along with 325lbs of sand someone dumped at one point. lol.

Will be out for work for a bit, wont be able to work on it or update any time soon.

 

[OmaTacoma]

Hello everyone,

It has been a while since we started this project and figured I should update it with the progress.

We had pool light replaced as it was a 500w incandecent bulb that had a bad gasket that allowed water in the housing. Instead of replacing the gasket we has a new Pentair 5G Intellibrite 55w cool white LED installed.

When we purchased the pool there wasnt a main drain cover. The drain cover is obsolete and couldnt find a universal replacement. Had to wait a few days before someone could install a new drain ring with cover.

I removed the concrete slab since it was low and added pavers instead for the pool equipment. The concrete slab was so low that the filter and pump were sitting on atleast 4 inches of dirt/sand. Electrician came around and installed new panels and cleaned everything up. I installed the PVC tubing using 1.5” Sched 40 PVC. It was my first time doing pool plumbing so hope it looks good. Still need to primer/cement the fittings and add pool sand to filter. The laterals look good. The multiport valve spider gasket and ring gasket where bad. The pressure gauge was also bad. Instead of replacing these parts we purchased a whole new multiport valve which came to be just a little bit more over buying individual parts.

I also still need to sift the dirt around pool equipment to get rid of rocks and lay clean dirt down to plant. Will build a cover around pool equipment in a few weeks.

Pool person that came out to install drain cover said not to fill the pool until Friday morning. Plan is to finish plumbing and add sand to filter tomorrow.

 

[CJadamec]

Very nice job. It looks very clean. You're gonna love that new pump. You just wait one day you are going to have a panicked moment thinking the pump stopped running only to go over there and see it working just fine and the only problem is it's so quiet you just can't here it run.

 

[OmaTacoma]

Side of the pool along fence was also cleaned up. Need to sift dirt as well to remove pea gravel/rocks the last owner installed.

Any recommendations for plants in this area?






- - - Updated - - -

Very nice job. It looks very clean. You're gonna love that new pump. You just wait one day you are going to have a panicked moment thinking the pump stopped running only to go over there and see it working just fine and the only problem is it's so quiet you just can't here it run.

Thank you for the pump recommendation. I am excited to see how this pump runs compared to the Hayward. I have been looking around and some say they average $20-$30 a month on electrical bills running the pump 12 hours a day. I plan to run pump on low RPM for extended hours as we have 3 pecan trees that shed notoriously. One of the pecan tree’s limb overlooks the pool. The $1200 quote to hack the limb off was very shocking.

 

[riley00dog]

It all looks very tidy! Will be great to put your own stamp on it.

 

[CJadamec]

I don't know what you are paying for electricity but 20-30 a month to run that pump sound pretty high even at 12 hours a day.

At 1200-1400 rpm which will give you pretty good skimming action that pump uses around 175 watts. For a 12 hour day that works out to 2.1 kWhr a day or 63 kWhr a month. If you are paying 15 cents per kWhr that works out to $10 a month to run the pump at low rpm.

 

[jejm2143]

It looks great. I am currently in the process of upgrading our equipment from the previous owner and this is great inspiration.

 

[OmaTacoma]

I don't know what you are paying for electricity but 20-30 a month to run that pump sound pretty high even at 12 hours a day.

At 1200-1400 rpm which will give you pretty good skimming action that pump uses around 175 watts. For a 12 hour day that works out to 2.1 kWhr a day or 63 kWhr a month. If you are paying 15 cents per kWhr that works out to $10 a month to run the pump at low rpm.

This is good news! Will look at electric billing statement and see how much pump is pulling and estimate monthly expense. Looking to start running pump tomorrow morning after pool is full with water.