Hello James and thanks for the help. It is a Pentair 150 paper filter. I replaced the element once thinking it might be a problem. It didn't seem to make any difference.
Pool eats CYA
- Thread starter TomHunt
- Start date
TomHunt,
I know your original question is about CYA. So where do YOU think it is going? We have determined that it does not deteriorate nearly at the rate you describe. You seem to eliminate all other possibilities so what are we left with? There is no "magic" CYA or "magic" pool or "magic" anything in what we teach......this is ALL hard science and, most importantly, proven by thousands of anecdotal experiences over the last 10 years.. I am at a loss to explain a condition that where there are some new variables we don't know about.
Secondly, your FC levels (I can't read your data...too small) and your reoccuring algae blooms don't match up. Time and time again we demonstrate that adequate chlorine and following the TFP maintenance methods results in NO algae whatsoever in pools.
Somewhere, somehow you are not following the TFP principles that are practiced throughout this forum. When you re-read the pool school articles about the SLAM and pool chemistry, do you see anything you are NOT doing? Like your CYA loss, I am confounded by your continual cloudy, algae laden water. Algae and other bacteria simply do not exist in a properly maintained TFP pool so what is being overlooked? I don't know.
I know your original question is about CYA. So where do YOU think it is going? We have determined that it does not deteriorate nearly at the rate you describe. You seem to eliminate all other possibilities so what are we left with? There is no "magic" CYA or "magic" pool or "magic" anything in what we teach......this is ALL hard science and, most importantly, proven by thousands of anecdotal experiences over the last 10 years.. I am at a loss to explain a condition that where there are some new variables we don't know about.
Secondly, your FC levels (I can't read your data...too small) and your reoccuring algae blooms don't match up. Time and time again we demonstrate that adequate chlorine and following the TFP maintenance methods results in NO algae whatsoever in pools.
Somewhere, somehow you are not following the TFP principles that are practiced throughout this forum. When you re-read the pool school articles about the SLAM and pool chemistry, do you see anything you are NOT doing? Like your CYA loss, I am confounded by your continual cloudy, algae laden water. Algae and other bacteria simply do not exist in a properly maintained TFP pool so what is being overlooked? I don't know.
Where do I think I'm going? I do follow procedures exactly. I use a check-sheet every time (habit from flying helicopters). My hope was that someone with more experience with chemistry could suggest something I am missing. I have not lost enough water out of this pool (couple inches at most) over the summer and fall to cause this CYA loss. The pool hasn't seen 0 FC since spring and then it was .05 for a day until I could get enough bleach on hand to SLAM. I have purchased a lot of CYA from Leslies. It is going somewhere. Testing CYA is pretty easy especially with the standard available to compare. To simply say it is all hard science is not helpful, sorry. I was <20 again last week and am at 40 - 50 today. bet it goes down again to <20 if left alone within a month.
You might be missing my point....my point being (considering all the other possibilities you have eliminated) there is NO explanation for the test results you are reporting.....CYA doesn't behave like that.
My question actually was where do you think it (CYA) is going?....not ,"Where do you think you are going"
I was hoping you had some suspicion as to why this is happening. I don't think these SAME circumstances have been reported in the 10 years or more of TFP's existence.
I agree that the reported results are unusual with no easy answer.
CYA is pretty stable. It doesn't degrade rapidly under normal circumstances.
The ways that I can think of include:
1) Dilution.
2) Testing error.
3) Bacteria.
4) Melamine being added to the water and precipitating out the cya.
5) Reverse osmosis.
None of the reasons above seem to fit from what is being reported. Maybe there is something else going on but at least there are some things to consider.
In my opinion, the periodic cloudiness is an important clue.
CYA is pretty stable. It doesn't degrade rapidly under normal circumstances.
The ways that I can think of include:
1) Dilution.
2) Testing error.
3) Bacteria.
4) Melamine being added to the water and precipitating out the cya.
5) Reverse osmosis.
None of the reasons above seem to fit from what is being reported. Maybe there is something else going on but at least there are some things to consider.
In my opinion, the periodic cloudiness is an important clue.
borjis
LifeTime Supporter
If adequate FC is truly being maintained based on the known current CYA levels
(aka if it really is getting dosed proper)
The only other explanation for cloudyness that I can think of is that his
pool is painted. I had cloudy water whenever brushing, but it was the paint
coming off the pool.
Probably not what is causing his cloudy issue but thought I'd throw it out there.
(aka if it really is getting dosed proper)
The only other explanation for cloudyness that I can think of is that his
pool is painted. I had cloudy water whenever brushing, but it was the paint
coming off the pool.
Probably not what is causing his cloudy issue but thought I'd throw it out there.
- May 23, 2015
- 24,450
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
I know you said that you used hose few times to top of the pool by just an inch or so.
Does your pool have autofill?
If it's new pool, it most likely has one.
Check for it and if you find it, shut it off for few days.
See if water level goes down without autofill turned on.
Does your pool have autofill?
If it's new pool, it most likely has one.
Check for it and if you find it, shut it off for few days.
See if water level goes down without autofill turned on.
I also live in SW Florida (Cape Coral) and have had the exact same issues, losing CYA at similar rates. And I'm still trying to figure it out. We have had some significant rain events, including 12" over a few days in August 2017.
So far I've done the following:
1. Started off by performing a SLAM
2. Set target CYA to 90 but never seem to get there
3. Test CYA and FC weekly, more if there is a rain event
4. Adjusted autofill set point lower so that a rain event is less likely to overflow the pool
5. Raised overflow pipe so that a rain event is less likely to overflow the pool
6. Definitely no leaks in my pool
7. Use well water, after softening, to fill pool
8. Set target FC to 6-7
9. Only use the pool 1 day/week, just my finance and I.
10. Temp between 85-88
So far I've done the following:
1. Started off by performing a SLAM
2. Set target CYA to 90 but never seem to get there
3. Test CYA and FC weekly, more if there is a rain event
4. Adjusted autofill set point lower so that a rain event is less likely to overflow the pool
5. Raised overflow pipe so that a rain event is less likely to overflow the pool
6. Definitely no leaks in my pool
7. Use well water, after softening, to fill pool
8. Set target FC to 6-7
9. Only use the pool 1 day/week, just my finance and I.
10. Temp between 85-88
It looks like your problems started on Oct 30 when you added the solar cover, there was a drastic drop in FC and you needed to SLAM. There must have been something on the cover that started this issue. I would either make sure the cover is used during the SLAM to get rid of the organics on it or get a new cover.
I have noticed large drops in CYA when my pool goes through the SLAM process. I have a feeling this is all connected to the solar cover.
I have noticed large drops in CYA when my pool goes through the SLAM process. I have a feeling this is all connected to the solar cover.
Can you post a link to Google drive or Dropbox with the file?
I can't read the data.
I can't read the data.
Mstgkillr, we luckily missed your big rains across the bay over here in Rotonda West. You got nicked with a lot of rain even before Houston! We don't have autofill and our drain out elbow is already located higher than the top of the skimmer. Good luck to you on figuring it all out!
- May 23, 2015
- 24,450
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
You say your pool isn’t losing water but, from the screen shots I see that you have decreases in both calcium hardness and salt. If your pool were not losing any water at all, then those parameters should never decrease.
Can you confirm that you are adding salt and CH to your pool? If so, how regularly? How are you testing salt levels?
Can you confirm that you are adding salt and CH to your pool? If so, how regularly? How are you testing salt levels?
7/29 CH = 250
8/15 CH = 250
8/25 CH = 200 added 110 oz C Chloride
8/31 CH = 250 Salt 3000. added 7# CC
9/2 CH = 275 so added 6# CC
9/14 CH = 300 Salt at 2800 (target 3000) added 40# salt
10/2 CH = 300
10/16 CH = 300 Salt at 2800 so added 7# CC
10/19 CH = 350 (target) Salt at 3400 (too high but okay)
10/23 3-4" of rain, but pool was pretty low so I doubt we lost much
10/29 CH = 350 Salt at 3200
11/3 CH = 350
11/18 CH at 375 Salt 3400
No decreases in CH, but did have an effort to get it up to my goal in this period.
All tested with TF100 kit (salt is the Taylor K1766 drop kit that comes with the TF100 kit)
8/15 CH = 250
8/25 CH = 200 added 110 oz C Chloride
8/31 CH = 250 Salt 3000. added 7# CC
9/2 CH = 275 so added 6# CC
9/14 CH = 300 Salt at 2800 (target 3000) added 40# salt
10/2 CH = 300
10/16 CH = 300 Salt at 2800 so added 7# CC
10/19 CH = 350 (target) Salt at 3400 (too high but okay)
10/23 3-4" of rain, but pool was pretty low so I doubt we lost much
10/29 CH = 350 Salt at 3200
11/3 CH = 350
11/18 CH at 375 Salt 3400
No decreases in CH, but did have an effort to get it up to my goal in this period.
All tested with TF100 kit (salt is the Taylor K1766 drop kit that comes with the TF100 kit)
Well, I have watched my CYA once again disappear to <20, down from 40-50 less than a three weeks ago on my solar blanket covered pool. I was gone for 5 days so didn't test for 5 days, but left the pool with high FC and the SWG set at 80% and the pool covered. We had about 1/2" of rain with none going out the overflow. I have once again started adding CYA.
- May 23, 2015
- 24,450
- Pool Size
- 16000
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
I'm confused on this statement. "Standard available to compare" reminds me of the pH shades of red scale test NOT the disappearing dot for CYA test???