Also, if you could share your experience regarding the touch screen. Readability in the sun, touch sensitivity etc. I'm sitting on the edge of my seat in anticipation.
Pentair IntelliCenter
- Thread starter bdavis466
- Start date
- Nov 12, 2017
- 11,903
- Pool Size
- 12300
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
So I was wondering before, when there was talk of placing that light transformer in the way of the GFI, about just what was filling up the rest of that cavernous area. Seems to be plenty of other places inside the box for that transformer other than that corner. No? Nice how they placed the breakers, way over to the left like that. Seems to leave a lot of room down the middle.
Hi Dirk,
I don't want to speak for sanspeur, but looking at the photo, he has the knockout going through the block wall on the bottom that would interfere with the placement of the light transformer. Also, the neutral and ground bus bars make for a tight fit it appears around the middle of the area. Maybe above the ground bus bar.
But he could always mount an external GFCI using a nice looking J-box. Just to the upper/right of the system transformer. Just tap out a knockout for the wiring and a couple of mounting holes.
Even better yet I think. He could mount that J-box containing the GFCI, below the load center utilizing one of the knockouts on the bottom using a threaded offset nipple.
That would be pretty clean and professional looking I think and I believe that is what I would do presented with the same situation.
- Nov 12, 2017
- 11,903
- Pool Size
- 12300
- Surface
- Plaster
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
I see at least two other spots that transformer could fit, at least based on looking at an internet image. Just clean up and reroute some of those wires coming through the middle and make room.
I had a box hanging off my ET like that for a while. It was too ugly for me, I found another solution (by stuffing its contents into the ET box). Was it James that suggested: you just bolt on an extension box where the GFI knock out is, and it would mount just to the outside of the power center box. No conduit necessary. No less ugly though (to my eye). Something like this:
Of course, the cleanest look is to run any GFI devices off GFI breakers, and leave the outlet off altogether. I have plenty of other ways to get power to my pad, so I've never actually used my ET's outlet. Half the time I'm working on the pad, I have the ET's breakers off anyway, so that outlet wouldn't be active.
That too LOL. Lot's of possibilities based on personal preference. The nice thing about TFP is you tend to get many different perspectives and you can pick and choose the one that suits your liking the best. Guess he can worry about this issue a little bit in the future (close those barn doors after you get the horses in). My guess is he is a busy boy today getting those two low voltage wires from the heaters high temp limit switch (fireman switch) wired up to J2 on the circuit board and wiring up the valve actuators to the Return and Intake sockets on the board. Then power-up, configurations etc. Can't wait to see how it went.
Sure, there were other places it could "fit", however having it in hand and actually placing the transformer in different spots even before the wiring was in place, the location where I finally put it seemed to me to be the best place for it. Perhaps if it were smaller another location would have been more ideal. IN any case, that is where it is staying lol.
I am having an issue with the pool lights tho.... I am now not able to get any voltage on the low voltage side if the transformer. 0 volts out. I had it initially connected to a relay. Programmed/turned on lights, heard the relay activate, and nothing. No output voltage. Checked voltage on Line/Load side of relay both good. Then just connected the high voltage side of the trans to breaker, still no output.... Thought maybe bad transformer (tho I had just removed it working yesterday from the other LC). Had a new intermatic trans (same model - 300W) and connected it, still no go....what am I missing???
I am having an issue with the pool lights tho.... I am now not able to get any voltage on the low voltage side if the transformer. 0 volts out. I had it initially connected to a relay. Programmed/turned on lights, heard the relay activate, and nothing. No output voltage. Checked voltage on Line/Load side of relay both good. Then just connected the high voltage side of the trans to breaker, still no output.... Thought maybe bad transformer (tho I had just removed it working yesterday from the other LC). Had a new intermatic trans (same model - 300W) and connected it, still no go....what am I missing???
Okay, just thinking out loud here. If you are getting voltage on the load side of the relay. But no 12v output from the transformer, that has to be it I would assume, but you say you tried another transformer and same result? Good Neutral and ground connection? 120v going into the transformer and no 12V out? That has to be it. What's the chance both transformers are bad? Double check all of your connections. You know those pesky wire nuts can sometimes be the issue. Yea, double check all of your connections.
Post a picture. You sure the neutral is hooked up correctly?
What about at the relay? The load is the slot right next to the line slot
What about at the relay? The load is the slot right next to the line slot
He tried bypassing the relay altogether and wired directly to hot at the breaker. I agree, check neutral.
Neutral (white wire on load side) connected to the neutral bus in the LC. Black wire on Line side connected to 120VAC. Getting no output VAC measured with multimeter on AC setting. No voltage measure also when load side wiring not connected to light wiring. This is for both transformers. Does an intermatic trans require an earth ground as well?..
Your Load Center should be bonded to the pool like your pump, heater etc. I'm guessing that transformer is grounded to the chassis of the Load Center when you mounted it in there? You didn't "isolate" the mounting did you?
No, but I don't yet have an earth ground wire connected to the chassis. FWIW the old LC didn't have one either and the transformer worked installed in it...I am going to get a grounding wire/connector now, regardless if that is the issue or not (should be grounded anyway). Back in a few.
AGREED! I don't think grounding and bonding for any type of pool equipment that requires it can be OVER-STATED. There are bonding lugs there on the R side of the load center. I would certainly bond the L.C. but hey, I'm a little OCD when it comes to things that might bite.
Low voltage systems are often ungrounded, which is normal, but non-current-carrying metal parts of equipment associated with low voltage systems are generally required to be grounded if the supply system is grounded.
But, I still don't know if the chassis of this transformer not being grounded to the LC chassis would cause the transformer to NOT deliver the 12V output. I know it's a safety issue however.
Wait a minute. Can this particular light transformer be powered by a 120V leg only or can it be wired to either 120V or 220V. Many of these pool equipment type low voltage transformers can be powered by EITHER 120V or 220V. If so, two of the (correct) wires must be pigtailed together if you are powering by 120V only. Just like the system and SWCG transformers in the load center. Check the manual if not sure. If it's the Intermatic PX300 transformer (I think it might be), then that is 120V only and the above should be disregarded.
Here is something else - A grounded shield between the primary and secondary windings of the Intermatic Pool light transformer assures safe operation and the built-in circuit protection will disconnect power to the transformer in case of defect or overload. I'm thinking this might be the ticket.
Here is something else - A grounded shield between the primary and secondary windings of the Intermatic Pool light transformer assures safe operation and the built-in circuit protection will disconnect power to the transformer in case of defect or overload. I'm thinking this might be the ticket.
Looking at the diagram for the PX300, the 120V hot lead from the breaker (eventually the light relay 
) should be connected to either the blue (for xformer output of 14v, grey (for xformer output of 12v or yellow wire (for xformer output of 13v). I know that's a little screwy but that is the way it is shown. Also, the transformer has a neutral wire (located on the output secondary side) of the transformer. That should be connected to the neutral bus bar of course.
I'm sure you have wired it up correctly (not wanting to insult your tech savvy), but I'm just exploring all troubleshooting steps that might cause the transformer to not output.
) should be connected to either the blue (for xformer output of 14v, grey (for xformer output of 12v or yellow wire (for xformer output of 13v). I know that's a little screwy but that is the way it is shown. Also, the transformer has a neutral wire (located on the output secondary side) of the transformer. That should be connected to the neutral bus bar of course.I'm sure you have wired it up correctly (not wanting to insult your tech savvy), but I'm just exploring all troubleshooting steps that might cause the transformer to not output.
I connected the hot lead (120v lead) directly from the breaker and also from the relay to each of the "hot" input leads (black for 12v, yellow for 13v, blue for 14v) and got no output on either of the black low voltage output wires (on the old trans, didn't try this on the new). Anyway just back from HD with ground wire and stuff to make the wiring job pretty but now I've lost light so it and additional troubleshooting will have to wait until tomorrow.
A few notes on the interface and going thru the menu. Screen is bright enough in my application (the box is always in the shade), probably ok in direct sunlight but can't be sure. Not ever having a pool automation system before I can't speak on how it may compare to others that are out there. If you follow the manual for set-up (and the set-up wizard) you will get 90% completed. Connecting to my wireless was another matter all together. It was not clear in the installation manual hot to set-up the wireless via the menu (unless I missed it). Instead I downloaded those instructions from Pentair website (Remote Access Set-up). Once the LC finally recognized the wireless equip (I spent more than 30 mins trying to get it to connect to the equip). You must wait almost 10mins before the equip - antenna and network card - initializes and is able to search for a network. Once they intialize, then you can search for a network.
I have a pretty strong network signal, even outside, but the Intellicenter barely registered a wireless signal for it. I wound up moving one of my wifi relays (I have an ORBI wireless set-up) closer to the back of the house before it registered a faint signal. After multiple times trying to connect to it (each time you attempt to connect to a wireless network the wifi equip will reboot - taking about 3-4 mins each time). FINALLY it connected to my network (after about 7 tries). Then came the time to get it set-up for remote management. That also took me a few tries (I fat fingered my email address in the LC set-up so I could not connect remotely until I realized and corrected that lol). The remote interface looks just like the pics MyAZPool posted. I will play with that more tomorrow and post my impressions of that then.
A few notes on the interface and going thru the menu. Screen is bright enough in my application (the box is always in the shade), probably ok in direct sunlight but can't be sure. Not ever having a pool automation system before I can't speak on how it may compare to others that are out there. If you follow the manual for set-up (and the set-up wizard) you will get 90% completed. Connecting to my wireless was another matter all together. It was not clear in the installation manual hot to set-up the wireless via the menu (unless I missed it). Instead I downloaded those instructions from Pentair website (Remote Access Set-up). Once the LC finally recognized the wireless equip (I spent more than 30 mins trying to get it to connect to the equip). You must wait almost 10mins before the equip - antenna and network card - initializes and is able to search for a network. Once they intialize, then you can search for a network.
I have a pretty strong network signal, even outside, but the Intellicenter barely registered a wireless signal for it. I wound up moving one of my wifi relays (I have an ORBI wireless set-up) closer to the back of the house before it registered a faint signal. After multiple times trying to connect to it (each time you attempt to connect to a wireless network the wifi equip will reboot - taking about 3-4 mins each time). FINALLY it connected to my network (after about 7 tries). Then came the time to get it set-up for remote management. That also took me a few tries (I fat fingered my email address in the LC set-up so I could not connect remotely until I realized and corrected that lol). The remote interface looks just like the pics MyAZPool posted. I will play with that more tomorrow and post my impressions of that then.
Yep, starting to get late there in the east.
Thanks much for the IC update. Making wireless connections work and connecting unsuccessfully and fat fingering email addresses etc. are something all of us do I think. I never get my wifi password correct first time when bringing on a new piece of wireless gear.
I had the same wireless issues you had when I first connected my Hunter Hydrawise Smart Irrigation Controller. Ended up having to wire up another wireless router on that side of the house to get a good signal to the outer east side of my house. I thought about the wireless issue long and hard before I installed the load center and fortunately I laid in a low voltage conduit that runs from the load center to the house and up and into the attic, so when I connect IntelliCenter, I'll be able to hard wire to the router (dodged a bullet on that one I think).
Great to hear that many of the steps you had to deal with today went as well as could be expected. You rocked, getting all of that done in a weekend. Did you get the heater and/or any of the valve actuators connected and working with IC today? Just curious.
Now we just have to figure out that darn Intermatic LV light transformer. For another day. Not critical and it will still be there tomorrow. Hopefully, some of the high speed wiring gurus will weigh in and think of something above our collected heads that we have missed. Just makes no sense but watch, it will turn out to be something simple.
Talk to you later...
r...
Yep, got the heater working (got it to come on at least, did not heat it to temp for the spa), and have the valve actuators "working" but not necessarily to my liking so will fiddle with those tomorrow. I should have had most of this done yesterday but had to wait for help in mounting it to the wall. I wasted several hours on that (the waiting part lol). The transformer thing really vexes me at this point. I don't really think it is a grounding issue (tho that will be done tomorrow anyway)....and if some "safety feature" did trip, there is no way for me to fix it (that I can see on the trans).
As long as it came on, you should be good. Once the water temp probe sends signals to IC and IC determines that the water temp is in fact what you selected it to be, it will continue to cycle the heater Off/On to maintain that temp.
No doubt there will be "tinkering" and fine-tuning, but it sounds like you are well on your way (passing angels 7 for angels 10). I'm jealous
. I'm ready to install IC and "tinker" too, but the retrofit kit for my ET load center won't be out until March. So guess I will have to live vicariously through you, until early next year LOL...I'm still thinking about that transformer issue. It's bugging the **** out of me.
Take care brother and talk to you later...
r...
bdavis, here is a pic (https://i.postimg.cc/13ZKZB2v/Intellicenter_light_transformer_wiring.jpg). The color coded circles are: red - line (input) left, load (output) right; green - breaker connected to light switch inside home; light blu (top) connection of return from light switch to line1 side of relay; light blu (bottom) - connection of other (load1) side of relay to line side of transformer input (for 12v out); orange (right side) - transformer load side output (12v out leads) connections to wiring going to pool lights, orange (left side) - neutral wire from load (low voltage) side of transformer connected to neutral bus bar. Basically that circuit was breaker > light switch > relay > transformer input > transformer output > light wiring. I also removed the light switch from the equation (breaker > relay > transformer in > transformer out) and still no output AC voltage on the low voltage output leads. Did this for a brand new transformer too (I bought one as I thought I'd have to wire a box outside the load center but was able to mount my old transformer into the new LC) that I removed from the original case. Really don't know what to do after that.... transformer is basically input > output, right? What protections would it also have to prevent any output?