Failed on my own... help...

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dulrey

0
Dec 11, 2016
10
Tampa, FL
My pool was neglected for several years. I've finally decided to start cleaning it up. After about a month of struggling on my own, I decided to quit skulking around the website. I feel like 30gal of 8.25% bleach was quite a bit, especially since PoolMath says 2 gal of 8.25% should boost to 10ppm. I'm curious to see what the recommended course of action is. Should I just start over with the SLAM process? Any advice is greatly appreciated.

Current pool state:
Cloudy blue water, visibility is about 8-12 inches. Note: Floc was applied 24h ago, still cloudy.

Current test results:
FC - 0.8 ppm
TC - 1.4 ppm
PH - Acidic (12 drops to get to 7.4)
TA - 30
CH - 450-500 (450 may have had slight purple to it, 500 was notably blue)
CYA - ~50

Here's a description of what's happened so far:
  • Skimmed bottom with a net to no success. It seems that I've had bad blooms, but few leaves/sticks due to our screen enclosure.
  • Began hitting it hard (with rough timeframe estimates)
    • Day 1
      • Pool state - Deep green color, couldn't see bottom
      • Start running filter 24/7
      • Vacuum to waste
      • Chlorine dump (9 gal of 8.25%)
    • Day 2
      • Pool store - CYA = 0... Chlorine dumps (9 gal of 8.25% [3 gal every 12h])
      • Brushing
    • Day 7
      • Pool state - Blue/Green color, couldn't see bottom
      • Vacuum to waste
      • Chlorine dumps (9 gal of 8.25% [3 gal every 12h])
    • Day 10
      • Pool state - Notably blue, yet extremely cloudy
      • PH is acidic
    • Day 12
      • Pool store
        • 'Cloudiness is dead algae! Clarifier is what you need!'
        • PH is low, base is what you need!
        • Phosphates are high. - I ignored this due to knowledge I've gathered from the Forum
        • CYA = 30
      • Added PH up
    • Day 13
      • Still acidic, added more PH up
    • Day 14
      • Pool state - Notably blue, yet extremely cloudy
      • PH good (~7.3?)
      • Added Clairifer
    • Day 17
      • Pool state - Notably blue, yet extremely cloudy
        • Slight noticable difference after first Clarifier treatment
      • Added more Clarifier
    • Day 23
      • Pool state - Still blue, still cloudy
      • Give in and hope to god the cloudiness is algae
    • Day 25
      • Apply Floc
        • Ran filter for 2h and now stopped
    • Day 26 - Today
      • Awaiting (and hoping) Floc to settle (24hr passed now)
 
Welcome to TFP!

I guess the first thing I should ask is if you plan on following our methods or the pool store? Right now you are trying to listen to both and this is nothing more than a recipe for failure.

What test kit are you using?
 
Welcome to the forum. :wave:

Tim5055 has asked the important question and you have answered it in a way that will help you get your pool crystal clear.

So, just to emphasize....stay out of the Pool Store.

Next, you must reread and understand two articles. The "ABC's of Pool Water Chemistry" and "SLAM" Once you feel you have a good grasp of the SLAM process, you can use it to effectively clear your pool.

Please do not add one thing to the process and please don't leave anything out. Following the SLAM article precisely will insure success.

Please post a complete set of current test results before you start.

Please be sure you have enough testing reagents (mainly, R-0870 and R-0871) to complete the SLAM

Make sure you can readily get more bleach once you start. You will probably need more than you think.

I know I sound preachy but the way to get your pool clear involves precision and NO variation from the process. We'll help you every step of the way if you are willing to follow what we suggest.
 
So I re-affirmed my knowledge of the SLAM process and ABCs. I've been lurking around here for the past month, but I think my lack of full commitment to the SLAM is what did me in. After having the pump running 24/7 for 3+ weeks and still having cloudy water, I just felt so helpless.

Here are some images of what it started out as (this was probably after the first 15 gal of bleach...) and where I'm currently at.
Deep:
Deep - Before and Now.jpg

Shallow:
Shallow - Before and Now.jpg

Where to go:
I won't be able to commit the time and energy during the work week, but I'd like to see if there's anything I need to go and get (aside from Chlorine) before I begin next weekend. Here's the test results that I got myself this morning (copied from above) using the Taylor K-2006 test kit:

FC - 0.8 ppm
TC - 1.4 ppm
PH - Acidic (12 drops to get to 7.4)
TA - 30
CH - 450-500 (450 may have had slight purple to it, 500 was notably blue)
CYA - ~50

To confirm my next steps:
- Vacuum pool
- Brush pool
- Get Chlorine (Bleach/Liquid)
- Apply enough to get it to Shock level (20 ppm @ 50 CYA)
- Test every hour and then re-apply enough to get it to Shock level
- Brush every day (and Vacuum, if possible) after that
- Repeat maintaining shock level and cleaning pool until it's clear
- After it's clear, perform an OCLT to confirm I won.

My questions:
- Chlorine
- I've already put in over 30 gal of Bleach (@ 8.25%)... that seems a bit excessive. Is that normal?
- When I was dumping Bleach before, I guess it was getting consumed at an astronmical rate.
- IIRC, one of the times I dumped 3 gal at night and it was still < 2ppm FC (didn't test TC at the time) a few hours later.
- Any way to forecast what a good starting amount of Bleach would be? 9 gal is what I've been doing.
- Vacuuming
- Should I only vacuum before I start and then only when I can see debris on the bottom?
- Backwashing
- How can you tell it needs to be backwashed?
- Do I re-apply DE powder every time after backwashing?


Thanks!

Devin
 
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Hello to another FL person! Love your area of the state!!!

Okay here goes:

The most important part of the SLAM is M as in Maintain the FC at SLAM level for your CYA level. Do NOT allow it to go below SLAM level or you will back slide.

Work days=at least 4 times a day of testing and adding chlorine:

-Morning after first cup of coffee

-As soon as home after taking off good clothes (don't want those to have polka dots on them from the chlorine)

-After dinner

-Right before bed

There is no way to tell how much chlorine you will go through. I can tell you that the more you keep the FC at SLAM level the faster your SLAM will go. How fast? Until it is done (sorry :slidehalo:)

You have made good progress. Dial in your SLAM and it will get done.

Don't just add bleach. Test, use Pool Math to get FC to SLAM level, add chlorine as suggested by Pool Math.

We are here to help you clear your pool and to help you make sure you never have to do another other :hug:

Kim:kim:

Brush, brush, brush! That gets all of the stuff up for the FC to kill.

Run the filter 24/7!
 
From your post, it appears you have not yet used Poolmath. That is part of the SLAM process and you must be familiar with it to complete the SLAM. Ask questions.

13 gallons of bleach doesn't matter.....it is the ineffective way in which you applied it. Poolmath will tell you what to add to keep your FC at 20 ppm. Post back and let us know you understand that. In your "next steps", you have already overlooked the first step in the SLAM process.....remember don't add anything and don't leave anything out.

Sorry to be harsh but let us help you get it right this time and you will learn to take care of your pool.

Step #1 is to bring your pH to about 7.4.....
  • Check and adjust the PH to between 7.2 and 7.5. The PH test isn't reliable during SLAMing so make sure to take care of this before you start.
Click to expand...

My next step would be to purchase PLENTY of bleach.....maybe 30 gallons. You will not waste it and it won't go bad. Make sure you have time to do the SLAM. Test and dose as often as you can....life will get in the way but give it a good effort.
 
Hi and welcome. Its great to see you have a good test kit!! I believe you can save reagents by using a 10ml sample and every drop then counts as 0.5. That level of accuracy is perfectly fine for a slam. Full instructions are here for that: https://www.troublefreepool.com/content/215-FAS-DPD-Chlorine-Test You may still need more reagents as duraleigh suggested so keep an eye on how much you have and order more with plenty of delivery time available

I've already put in over 30 gal of Bleach (@ 8.25%)... that seems a bit excessive. Is that normal?
Click to expand...
It is a large amount, however you put too much in at once and then let the level drop. You can think of the slam level we suggest as the optimum kill ratio for algae. Less than slam level and the algae will grow faster than being killed. Too much more than slam level and the chlorine is just wasted. When you have to leave your pool for many hours (like work) you may want to go 2ppm or so above your slam level but not much more, just so you can stay at slam level for longer. This gets easier as time goes by and you have less and less algae in the pool and time between testing and dosing to stay at slam level increases.

Also you have virtually no chlorine left now (0.8FC is below normal maintenance levels), its all been used up and become water and salt in the pool. Thats why we like bleach because it doesnt leave behind residuals of other chemicals that build up in the pool

So I re-affirmed my knowledge of the SLAM process
Click to expand...
There is a lot of information in that post. I suggest printing it out and keeping with your test kit for easy reference while you go through the process

Here are some images of what it started out as
Click to expand...
I have to say, considering the ad hoc way you have tackled this, I think you have done ok. Once you get started with our slam process I am sure you will see a lot of progress quickly

Any way to forecast what a good starting amount of Bleach would be? 9 gal is what I've been doing
Click to expand...

Not really, and it does depend on the strength you buy too. The more often you test and dose the faster it will go and the less you need, however you can then use it for ongoing maintenance of chlorine levels. Just make sure to keep it in a cool dark place to maintain its strength over time. I would suggest trying out pool math to calculate how much you will need for you initial dose and get a feel for how it works. I would feel happy with 20 gallons on hand but I have a shop 5mins away from me that is 24hrs and with good bleach prices..... Generally you also use a lot at the beginning and towards the end the demand drops off and you use less and less

Should I only vacuum before I start and then only when I can see debris on the bottom
Click to expand...
Any debris you can get out of the pool means there is less for the chlorine to work on, cos it will try to oxidise that leaf, bug or stick and we want it to focus on the algae. So try to vacuum whenever you think there is something to vacuum up. But like Kim said brushing your pool is better to agitate the algae so that the chlorine can get to it

Please dont think you have failed. Basically you gained a lot of knowledge from the pool store about a method that doesnt work to clear your pool. From that you found us, who have a process that works repeatedly time and time again. It is after all the lesson that many of us have also had, which is why we ended up here
 

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Whoa. Sorry for the lack of response, I guess I didn't log in when I read Kimkat's comment so it didn't notify me of more responses. Sorry for the bad formatting on questions, it looks like the site trimmed the spaces I put when adding notes to my own questions...

It looks like there's a quite a bit of stuff to vacuum, so I'm going to handle that and then address the PH. After that, I'll post my results, and assuming they match the SLAM criteria, I'll begin the SLAM process.


Responses:
@Kimkats, thanks for the suggestion on how to maintain with the work schedule!

@pabeader, thanks for the info on backflushing.

@duraleigh, I did realize it was low and planned to correct it, but good catch. I seemed to have skipped writing that step out.

@Caco, thanks for the tip on saving regs and other info!
 
Oh... there was stuff to vacuum alright :mad: (see below).

It looked like the Floc did do something, because when I was vacuuming in the Shallow end, I was able to see the Vacuum (3-4 ft vision !!!). I vacuumed for a while until hit a point where the skimmer was having trouble keeping water.

While adding more water into the pool and recharging the DE... I happened to look up to see a rather peculiar white cloud coming out of one of the returns (DE POWDER?!?!?!?!?!?!!? :mad:)... I took the filter apart and found two things wrong with it.

1) The grids floated to the top of the filter (whilst still attached to their Base)
2) The base somehow busted :(
View attachment 56033

Now I'm questioning if a major part of my cloudiness was actually DE Powder... Oh well, I still have work to do and I especially need to pass the OTLC test anyways
 
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I want to let you know that you can have algae even when you pass a OCLT. We have seen it before so don't back off on trying to clear your pool if you do pass it.

Bad news about your filter. I do wonder if that is a part of your problem in getting it clear. Will your try to fix it or just buy a new one? If you want to try to get parts try this place Swimming Pool Supplies, Pool Safety Cover, Swimming Pool Covers, Swimming Pool Pumps, Pool Pump Parts - INYOPools.com
 They have awesome Cust. Service. Tell them TFP sent you for the white glove treatment.

Kim:kim:
 
Thanks for the recommendation, Kim. Typically I end up going through Amazon if anything I need is available.

Just a quick status update...

The manifold was $30-60, I wasn't eager to jump at the purchase just yet. I had a project that required a fiberglass repair so I decided to give the Manifold a shot while I was at it. I cleaned the filter grids and reinstalled everything. A day later it looked like things were slightly clearing up. I then added a 5lb bag of baking soda to increase TA (was about 30-40) [PoolMath recommended 7.5-10 lb) and PH. The next morning, I was blessed with the ability to see the bottom of my pool again!

image1 (1).JPGimage3.JPG

The amount of sediment on the bottom is downright shameful, but I couldn't help but share this.
 
WOW! What a difference! I bet that filter was causing you the cloudy problem! NICE job on the fix!

Now do a slow vac. I would put a t-shirt in the skimmer basket to help your filter even more.

Good luck and keep an eye on the filter gauge and clean as needed.

Kim:kim:
 
I suspect that it's just gunite showing where the plaster has completely worn away. I think that the pool has probably been acid washed at least a few times.

Is this pool new to you?

What is the history of the pool?
 

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