Mixed Instructions - VS Pump & SWG

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ol_whistle_britches said:
One thing I should add: If you have the ability to hard wire it to ethernet instead of using the included wifi adapter, I would do that. The wifi adapter actually gets surprisingly decent range, but honestly I feel like the wifi functionality is still somewhat buggy and hardwiring the unit simply involves unplugging the wifi adapter from the PCB and plugging in another ethernet cable.

That being said, I haven’t jumped off my rear to do it yet. I didn’t even mount the wifi adapter. I just wedged it behind the control unit. Until the last 48 hours I’d never had any connectivity issues, and they’ve resolved just now.

And no - I don’t see it as an Alexa device. That doesn’t mean it isn’t. I’m not fully invested in Alexa and I still need to finish setting up my home network.
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If you are in thunderstorm country having the WiFi air gap protects your home network from picking up outdoor EMP.

Thunderstorms blowing up outdoor electronics are expensive enough without it propagating through the Ethernet cable to blow out indoor network equipment.
 
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ol_whistle, thank you! this has been very helpful. How do people in general feel about the pump running 24/7 versus giving it a break. i was planning on running it for the 18 hours...but if wear and tear isn't an issue and just leaving it on full time is better then i'm open to that as well. I also want to be electricity bill conscious here...
 
ol_whistle_britches said:
Here’s what you’re gonna do (I’m speaking from my [very low] throne now):
A) Wire the core control into power. I chose to wire it to my pump circuit, so that it would fail if the pump circuit breaker blew, but that’s personal preference. This thing draws minimal power. Run it on 110V or 240V. It doesn’t care.
B) Program the schedule on your new VS pump to run 24/7, and then run the pump in schedule mode. You have to do this. From the factory, it comes set to run 18 hours/day. I run 3 speeds - Hi (4 hrs IFCS) / Med-Lo (10 hrs 1500rpm Skim) / Lo (10 hrs 1100rpm SWG).
C) Start the SWG at 50%. Given your pool size and latitude, I suspect you’ll end up 40-50%.

By scheduling the pump to run 24/7, you’re always flushing any gas buildup away by default. That’s primary safety #1 here. If the pump goes bust for some reason, then the flow switch kicks in as safety #2. When you backwash, stop the pool pump with the VS controller instead of just killing the power to the circuit so that the controller stays powered up and you can check that the red “low flow” alarm come on and verify its still working.

It’s that simple.
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What's IFCS mean? and in your experience the 1100rpm is enough to turn the SWG on? if salt gen is on 24/7 as is the pump...is it okay to produce the chlorine from the salt gen when it's running higher speeds?

what's the point of running the pump ever at a high speed except for initial startup to create the vacuum....DSP recommended high rpms for 2 or 3 hours to create vacuum then maybe 8 hours lower speed like 1500 rpm and then 8 more hours even less. Give the pump a 4 or 6 hour break then it turns back on and repeats itself.

i still need to learn more about the circuit sensing relay that was described above, it would be nice to have that as a failsafe option for the SWG.
 
I can touch briefly on the questions above. IFCS is in floor cleaning system. They usually require additional RPM to function properly. All pools are different so there's no definitive RPM at which the SWG flow switch will open. You'll need to experiment to find the RPM at which the flow switch will open.

There really is no need for a VS pump to be run at full speed other than initial priming. Mine doesn't even require this. As mentioned above, you'll need to experiment with different speeds to evaluate skimming action and suction cleaner performance. You'll find the right settings.

Most experts will say that running a pump 24/7 creates no additional strain on the pump. Some will argue that it creates less wear and tear on the pump because there are less start and stop cycles.
 
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Enzodast said:
... I also want to be electricity bill conscious here...
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Me too. I don't run my pump 24/7 because of the time of use plan that I'm on with my solar power. During peak hours my rates are exceedingly high. For most people with regular baseline plans, running 24/7 makes more sense. At low rpms, your pump may use as little as 100 watts. That's about as much as some old style light bulbs.

Take a look at the screenshots of my pump. Note that doubling RPMs results in 7 to 8 times more energy use. It demonstrates why you want to run your pump at low speeds.

1000007813.jpg
 
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Enzodast said:
in your experience the 1100rpm is enough to turn the SWG on? if salt gen is on 24/7 as is the pump...is it okay to produce the chlorine from the salt gen when it's running higher speeds?
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Yup. Works in my system. You want to have enough RPMs so that the flow going through the cell (which is transparent) is all water and no gas pockets are holding at the top. The electrolysis reaction itself doesn't care what the water velocity is.

Enzodast said:
what's the point of running the pump ever at a high speed
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Lots of reasons... I have a paramount IFCS (in floor cleaning sys, as Mr. Rancho pointed out) which supposedly "requires" for 18-25 psi of pressure at the distribution valve to function correctly. I need RPMs to make that much pressure. Other reasons: water effects, hot tub jets, vacuuming, chemical mixing, etc.

The calimar/circupool/b&d pump has a "quick cleaning" button on it where you can set a temporary cycle that reverts to the scheduled program afterwards. I programmed it to 3000 rpm for 30 minutes so that when I want to vacuum the floor manually or circulate the pool heavily after dumping in a bucket of acid (diluted), all I have to do is go punch that button and then go on about my business.

Enzodast said:
I also want to be electricity bill conscious here
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Low speed, low energy use. See Mr. Rancho's comment above. I use something stupid low like 230 watts at 1100 rpm. That's right at 1 amp.

Rancho Cost-a-Lotta said:
Most experts will say that running a pump 24/7 creates no additional strain on the pump. Some will argue that it creates less wear and tear on the pump because there are less start and stop cycles.
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I follow this school of thought. object in motion remains in motion and all....
 
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Running a pump really doesn't cause stress. Starting and stopping of electric motors, including pool pumps, can cause thermal and mechanical stress due to inrush currents and torque surges during startup.
 
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Enzodast said:
What's IFCS mean? and in your experience the 1100rpm is enough to turn the SWG on? if salt gen is on 24/7 as is the pump...is it okay to produce the chlorine from the salt gen when it's running higher speeds?

what's the point of running the pump ever at a high speed except for initial startup to create the vacuum....DSP recommended high rpms for 2 or 3 hours to create vacuum then maybe 8 hours lower speed like 1500 rpm and then 8 more hours even less. Give the pump a 4 or 6 hour break then it turns back on and repeats itself.

i still need to learn more about the circuit sensing relay that was described above, it would be nice to have that as a failsafe option for the SWG.
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I believe it is thermal cycles and start stop that causes the wear on pumps and many other devices.

Thus running a VS pump at low speeds 24/7 puts the least wear on the pump.
 
you guys are all literally incredible, i can't thank you all enough. So i do not have ANY water features... i have 3 return jets....1 split main drain and one skimmer (double roman pool). i do not have an IFCS...i have a plug in daulphin nautilus robot so i dont need extra power for that.

So going with the 24/7 theory....how do i set it up so that the pump turns on the first time after shut down (backwash of DE filter etc) and have it run at higher rpms for 30 minutes to prime the system and then just drop way down to just enough for the salt system to run. i dont think there's a setting for that in the pump.

or do i just set it to say start up or first cycle for 30 minutes or 1 hour is high rpm....then it just drops down. and every day when that 30 minute cycle hits it just ramps up for 30 minutes and then just goes back down? you see what i'm trying to say....if i follow advice above i want it to prime at a higher speed just at startup and then say for the next 6 days stay at 1100 rpms without going back to higher speed. of course ill monitor this and report back...i need to see how well the system is turning over water, maintaining chemistry and skimming the top. thankfully i dont get much debris (except for these next few weeks with pollen, but that's it. i honestly might even shut off my skimmer during pollen season...never tried that before...but now that i'm saying it or typing it it kind of makes sense. i'd rather use the net and get it off every day than let it clog my de filter.

i still need to figure out now when the electrician comes in the morning how i want this pump wired. as of now the pump i have has a big crazy looking plug...so i believe he'll just be taking the existing plug/wiring off of my existing hayward tristar and installing it on the new pump. that outlet has a manual timer attached to it which i guess i just remove the tabs and it'll just be an on/off switch. not sure how he can wire the SWG into that same outlet....as of now he was planning on just plugging it into the gfci outlet that my lights plug into.
 

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Depending on the type of timer, he may be able to wire the pump to the line-in side of the timer so it has 24/7 power. Then you can use the switched side of the timer for the SWG. Advise him this is your preference.
 
here's a photo of my little oasis in CT....i use a normal tarp in the winter....so it collects debris which sadly gets dumped into the pool in the spring when i open it. doesnt take much to clean it but that's what you're seeing in there now. ill upload photos later.

also including a photo of my electrical area where everything will be going.
 

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Rancho Cost-a-Lotta said:
Depending on the type of timer, he may be able to wire the pump to the line-in side of the timer so it has 24/7 power. Then you can use the switched side of the timer for the SWG. Advise him this is your preference.
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wow! so basically make the pump have full power always which is what i want since it has an onboard pc...and then put the SWG on the timer. if i want the swg running 24/7 i just remove tabs...if i want it to be only 12 hours a day that's simple enough too....

WOW did i recap that right!?
 
Sounds like you got it. You should be able to adjust the pump manually while it's running. I'm not sure how to do that. Start at a higher speed (1500 rpm ish) with the SWG running. Keep dropping down 100 RPM at a time until the red light indicating no flow on the SWG comes on. Add 100 RPM to that number and this will be your minimum run speed. Makes sense?
 
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Rancho Cost-a-Lotta said:
Depending on the type of timer, he may be able to wire the pump to the line-in side of the timer so it has 24/7 power. Then you can use the switched side of the timer for the SWG. Advise him this is your preference.
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it's an tork timer i'm pretty sure...it's not an amazon purchase, bought from the local electrical wholesaler shop where i live. pretty sure link below is what i have...but bought locally and not online.

 
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Enzodast said:
do i just set it to say start up or first cycle for 30 minutes or 1 hour is high rpm....then it just drops down. and every day when that 30 minute cycle hits it just ramps up for 30 minutes and then just goes back down?
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Enzodast said:
So going with the 24/7 theory....how do i set it up so that the pump turns on the first time after shut down (backwash of DE filter etc) and have it run at higher rpms for 30 minutes to prime the system and then just drop way down to just enough for the salt system to run. i dont think there's a setting for that in the pump.
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You can do this either way. Suggest you download the manual for the pump and read it. Some will set a high speed run into Speed 1 schedule programming. Others will just turn on the pumps priming feature, which adds a 100% run for a brief period (1-4 minutes, IIRC) any time you start the pump up. Either works.

Enzodast said:
so i believe he'll just be taking the existing plug/wiring off of my existing hayward tristar and installing it on the new pump.
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Yup.
Enzodast said:
not sure how he can wire the SWG into that same outlet....as of now he was planning on just plugging it into the gfci outlet that my lights plug into.
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Either way works fine. I wired to the line out side so I can turn everything off using the manual switch.

Rancho Cost-a-Lotta said:
Hopefully it's the 240 volt version. If so, the timer can be wired as I posted earlier.
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Core Control and the VS pump being discussed both will run 120v/240V. Prefer 240V personally.
 
Enzodast said:
wow! so basically make the pump have full power always which is what i want since it has an onboard pc...and then put the SWG on the timer. if i want the swg running 24/7 i just remove tabs...if i want it to be only 12 hours a day that's simple enough too....

WOW did i recap that right!?
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Electrician is saying he can't do this... It's the 1109a timer. Says the salt unit won't be GFI protected if he does it like you say.

It's capable of it but then it's not GFI.
 

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