Is this how dual spa drains are supposed to be installed?

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david_

Bronze Supporter
May 22, 2022
88
DFW
Pool Size
29800
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Liquid Chlorine
All I have is plastic covers screwed onto a plastic ring embedded in plaster? Always thought there was supposed to be a plastic drain "bucket" underneath these.

PXL_20240824_134818156.MP (Large).jpg PXL_20240824_134822963.MP (Large).jpg PXL_20240824_134834057.MP (Large).jpg

Here's the part # I found on the cover: 640-231xv
 
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Looks like they are missing drain covers. Here are pics of my spa during construction. Two of the drains are connected to the spa jet pump and the other two are connected to the main pump, filter, and heater. I don't know why two have buckets and other two just pipes. I am sure the experts on this forum know. Hope this helps.
 

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You cannot just put a drain cover on like that, you have to install it on a matching sump.

Contact the manufacturer to confirm with them.

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"For a pool to comply with the Virginia Graeme Baker Pool and Spa Safety Act, it takes more than just connecting two drains to the pump and adding a VGB-approved drain cover. Here are other important steps to ensure that the drains are entrapment-proof and adhere to the federal law.

  • Ensure proper sump depth
Each drain cover has been tested to work with a sump of a certain depth, and the drain pipe sitting a minimum distance below the cover. If the pipe is too close to the cover, the drain becomes more susceptible to hair entrapment. In addition, the suction won’t be evenly distributed throughout the drain. Consult the drain-cover manufacturer’s instructions to find out that minimum distance.

If the manufacturer hasn’t provided instructions, the ASME A112.19.8 standard for drain covers says the minimum distance between the pipe and the drain cover’s underside should equal 1 1/2 times the diameter of that pipe.

To make things easier, use pre-manufactured sump/drain cover configurations when possible. Not only are they easier to install, but they already come with a properly sized sump. In retrofits, it may be difficult to do this, since it would require chipping out the floor to the right shape and completely smoothing out the surface.


www.c-m-p.com

VGBA 2017 - WHAT'S CHANGING IN 2021? - CMP

In 2008, the first version of the Virginia Graeme Baker Act went into effect. Now, in 2021, these safety standards are being upgraded again.
www.c-m-p.com www.c-m-p.com

www.aquamagazine.com

The Drain Cover Law Has Changed

A look at the important new rules surrounding VBGA.
www.aquamagazine.com www.aquamagazine.com

waterwayplastics.com

8" Anti-Vortex Drains - Waterway Plastics

Pool & Spa Products
waterwayplastics.com waterwayplastics.com


1724511618583.png

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Specifications:​

  • Total Open Area: 11.83 sq. in.
  • Frame Size: 9" Round
  • Floor Flow Rate: 100 GPM, 2" & 2.5" plumbing
  • Wall Flow Rate: 64 GPM, 2" & 2.5" plumbing
  • Flow Rate @ 1.5 ft/sec: 55 GPM

Features:​

  • Improves flow
  • Less turbulence
  • Optimizes performance
  • Meets Florida building code
  • 8" diameter x 7" deep (8') (plus sockets)

waterwayplastics.com

Contact - Waterway Plastics

Pool & Spa Products
waterwayplastics.com waterwayplastics.com

Waterway Plastics​

2200 East Sturgis Road
Oxnard, California 93030

Phone: 805-981-0262
Fax: 805-981-9403
Toll Free Fax: 888-SPA-JETS (888-772-5387)

[email protected]

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What is “sump depth” and why does it matter since it is under a certified drain cover anyway?

The word “sump” refers to the space between any cover and the suction piping supplying water to the pump.

As water passes through the cover, headed for the suction pipe opening, turbulence is created and when strong enough it will tangle and twist hair.

This has the potential to lock it in and around the drain cover.

Turbulence, and suction power, become more extreme as the flow increases and at some point, ALL drain covers will tangle hair.

This is one reason why drain covers have a flow rating that must never be exceeded.


These potential issues are fully address by the VGBA-2017 standard that requires manufacturers to test drain covers/SOFAs over all sumps for which the product is authorized to be used.

 

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A field fabricated sump can be allowed as long as it is designed by a Licensed Professional Engineer.

Yours is clearly not compliant with any standard for field fabricated sumps.

Custom Drain Covers
To certify field fabricated covers the PE should obtain the ANSI/APSP To certify field fabricated covers, the PE should obtain the ANSI/APSP-16 2011 standard and ensure that the fabricated covers meet all the performance requirements of the standard.

Covers must meet the standard, or be certified as meeting the standard by licensed party.

Field Fabricated Drain Covers.

Should be designed by a licensed professional engineer (PE) to meet all the requirements of the standard (flow rate, entrapment considerations, structural integrity, etc.) and then fabricated.

 
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David,

When I first saw the pics, I 'assumed' that the sumps were there, just filled with plaster... (Still wrong of course..)

Now it appears that you have no sump at all????

Do you have any pics of when the spa was being built, showing the plumbing?

Thanks,

Jim R.
 
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mktee said:
JamesW, Are mine plumbed in correctly with only one side of the drain system having a sump. See pics from my post above. Thank you!!
Click to expand...
Main drains.JPEG

This is incorrect.

Suction covers come as an assembly and they must be installed as per manufacturer's instructions.

Every suction cover has to have an approved matching suction sump fitting assembly.
 
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JamesW said:
View attachment 605968

This is incorrect.

Suction covers come as an assembly and they must be installed as per manufacturer's instructions.

Every suction cover has to have an approved matching suction sump fitting assembly.
Click to expand...
Thank you! I wonder why my builder did it incorrectly? It seems like it would pretty simple and inexpensive to have just done it the right way.
 
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Jimrahbe said:
David,

When I first saw the pics, I 'assumed' that the sumps were there, just filled with plaster... (Still wrong of course..)

Now it appears that you have no sump at all????

Do you have any pics of when the spa was being built, showing the plumbing?

Thanks,

Jim R.
Click to expand...
It was a renovation. I had them convert my single drain to dual for safety.

All I could find was these pictures after the gunnite/shotcrete truck came in; they did the bottom of the spa and the giant plaster crack I inherited.
PXL_20230511_141024103 (Large).jpg PXL_20230516_011327982 (Large).jpg PXL_20230511_141056501 (Large).jpg

This particular pool was very neglected before we bought in 2022.
 
It's frustrating. I spent $35k+ for crack repair, pebble, coping, tile, etc. to this particular contractor. Don't understand why they cheap out on this part. Seems they'd rather be building $100k+ new pools.

Regardless.. depending on what I find with my leak test we'll see where we go from here. This is all 1.5 years old so I'm not confident I'll get much support.
 
I doubt that 1 1/2 years removes them from the responsibility of installing them correctly. If they don't make it right then you should file a complaint with whomever licenses them since this appears to be a failure to follow the industry norms and likely code requirements.
 
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In my opinion, I do not see why a sump would make that much difference.

The drain cover still has the same flow either way.

In any case, the code is what it is and I would have to recommend going with a fully code compliant installation.

Contact the manufacturer to get their advice so that you have solid proof that it is not correct.

Contact the builder and ask them to make it right.
 
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