Wiring questions

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Bcmo

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May 13, 2017
11
Missouri
Hello,
I'm going to be installing a 16x32 vinyl liner pool soon. Getting the wiring ready to go for the electrician. I've got a 60 amp subpanel in the garage that will serve the pool. We will be installing a Hayward Ecostar VS pump, AquaRite SWG, OnCommand Automation and a Hayward natural gas heater. Total max amps should be ~21. Is there any reason all of these items can't be on 1 30 amp 220v. Circuit with a gfci breaker? We will need a separate disconnect at the equipment pad since the subpanel isn't technically in line of sight of the pump.
Could I just have him run one circuit to a 30amp disconnect at the pad, then to a junction box that splits off to each piece of equipment (all can run on 220v). This would shut down the entire pad with one disconnect and the automation should be able to shut individual items off, or I suppose I could put switches on individual items as well.
I would have a 110 circuit for the convenience outlet as well.
 
Bcmo said:
Hello,
I'm going to be installing a 16x32 vinyl liner pool soon. Getting the wiring ready to go for the electrician. I've got a 60 amp subpanel in the garage that will serve the pool. We will be installing a Hayward Ecostar VS pump, AquaRite SWG, OnCommand Automation and a Hayward natural gas heater. Total max amps should be ~21. Is there any reason all of these items can't be on 1 30 amp 220v. Circuit with a gfci breaker? We will need a separate disconnect at the equipment pad since the subpanel isn't technically in line of sight of the pump.
Could I just have him run one circuit to a 30amp disconnect at the pad, then to a junction box that splits off to each piece of equipment (all can run on 220v). This would shut down the entire pad with one disconnect and the automation should be able to shut individual items off, or I suppose I could put switches on individual items as well.
I would have a 110 circuit for the convenience outlet as well.
Click to expand...


Not a great idea on using only one circuit for everything.

If it were my install, I would put a weatherproof subpanel at the pool location with the proper breakers installed for each piece of equipment and the GFCI outlet.

Something like this

GE PowerMark Gold 100 Amp 12-Space 24-Circuit Outdoor Main Breaker Circuit Breaker Panel-TM1210RCU - The Home Depot

Mounting it close to the equipment will also serve as the required disconnect.

Have you licensed electrician do the work to insure work is to code and safe for you and your family.
 
For all the effort you are talking about going thru an outdoor subpanel costs about 25 bucks at home depot. You can run your 30amp supply to the subpanel at your pad and wire all your equipment off of that including your convenience outlet.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Eaton-Cu...or-Main-Lug-Load-Center-BR612L125RP/100164090

Using a junction box like you are describing will be cumbersome at best and you will have to run your 30amp wire to all your equipment which will be a pain.

It's best practice and will help troubleshoot problems to have the pump on its own GFCI device and not rely on a single GFCI breaker on the main feeder circuit.
 
Having a single gfci breaker upstream of all equipment will make it tough to troubleshoot if theres ever an issue. What the OP is describing sounds like a convoluted way to do something simple. 1 breaker at main panel > subpanel by pool > gfci breakers. I have my pump and heater on the same breaker.
 
Bcmo said:
Hello,
I'm going to be installing a 16x32 vinyl liner pool soon. Getting the wiring ready to go for the electrician. I've got a 60 amp subpanel in the garage that will serve the pool. We will be installing a Hayward Ecostar VS pump, AquaRite SWG, OnCommand Automation and a Hayward natural gas heater. Total max amps should be ~21. Is there any reason all of these items can't be on 1 30 amp 220v. Circuit with a gfci breaker? We will need a separate disconnect at the equipment pad since the subpanel isn't technically in line of sight of the pump.
Could I just have him run one circuit to a 30amp disconnect at the pad, then to a junction box that splits off to each piece of equipment (all can run on 220v). This would shut down the entire pad with one disconnect and the automation should be able to shut individual items off, or I suppose I could put switches on individual items as well.
I would have a 110 circuit for the convenience outlet as well.
Click to expand...
Have you checked the requirements of your city/town to see if one circuit is acceptable?
 
kevreh said:
Having a single gfci breaker upstream of all equipment will make it tough to troubleshoot if theres ever an issue. What the OP is describing sounds like a convoluted way to do something simple. 1 breaker at main panel > subpanel by pool > gfci breakers. I have my pump and heater on the same breaker.
Click to expand...

There is already a subpanel with several empty spaces in the garage ~30' from where the pool equipment will be and no space left in the main panel to add a second subpanel. I can run separate breakers for each piece of equipment. Just wasn't sure if it was necessary.

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domct203 said:
Have you checked the requirements of your city/town to see if one circuit is acceptable?
Click to expand...

Our town has 0 requirements for pools at all. 1 stop light town. Literally.
 
A single 30amp circuit with a J-box is really not the proper way to do things.

Its best practice and code minimum to have at least 2 circuits out there. One for the pump, and the other for everything else. If you are running circuits back to your garage panel. You can run multiple circuits off of the subpanel in the garage out to the pool there's nothing wrong with that. You still need the local disconnect near the pump.

Direct burial cable isn't acceptable per NEC code. Your wires need to be in conduit and have an insulated green ground wire to meet code. Your town might not have requirements but I bet your state does.

I still think by the time you go thru the trouble of getting all those things done it would be simpler and cleaner just to have an outdoor breaker box at the pool pad fed from your garage with one 30 amp circuit. You can then use individual breaks out at the pad to separate your equipment and power the convenience outlet.
 
Bcmo said:
There is already a subpanel with several empty spaces in the garage ~30' from where the pool equipment will be and no space left in the main panel to add a second subpanel. I can run separate breakers for each piece of equipment. Just wasn't sure if it was necessary.
Click to expand...

So I would still have a single breaker in the garage serving a pool subpanel. As mentioned the cost of the subpanel is minimal. You really want/need to control equipment power at the pool pad.
 
CJadamec said:
A single 30amp circuit with a J-box is really not the proper way to do things.

Its best practice and code minimum to have at least 2 circuits out there. One for the pump, and the other for everything else. If you are running circuits back to your garage panel. You can run multiple circuits off of the subpanel in the garage out to the pool there's nothing wrong with that. You still need the local disconnect near the pump.

Direct burial cable isn't acceptable per NEC code. Your wires need to be in conduit and have an insulated green ground wire to meet code. Your town might not have requirements but I bet your state does.

I still think by the time you go thru the trouble of getting all those things done it would be simpler and cleaner just to have an outdoor breaker box at the pool pad fed from your garage with one 30 amp circuit. You can then use individual breaks out at the pad to separate your equipment and power the convenience outlet.
Click to expand...

Thanks. Plan was to use 2 1" runs of conduit from garage to pool pad. So your recommendation would be a double pull 30 amp breaker out of my subpanel feeding a 60 amp? Subpanel with the appropriate breakers for everything?
 

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Sub panel amp rating are a maximum they can carry not what they have to be fed. Most subpanels are rated to handle around 100 amps. If you feed it with a dual pole 30 amp breaker it won't care. Looks a lil like this when you are done.
 

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CJadamec said:
Sub panel amp rating are a maximum they can carry not what they have to be fed. Most subpanels are rated to handle around 100 amps. If you feed it with a dual pole 30 amp breaker it won't care. Looks a lil like this when you are done.
Click to expand...
Awesome. Thank you!! Last question - Can we just use 1 30amp double pole GFCI breaker from the subpanel in the garage - or should each circuit at the pool have its own GFCI?
 
Its much better to give each circuit it's own GFCI device. As you can see I have 2 dual pole GFCI breakers 1 for the pump and 1 for my heat pump. The convenience outlet is supplied with a regular breaker and the outlet contains the GFCI device.

Another thing worth getting but is totally optional is a surge protector for your panel to protect the electronic drive in your VS pump. That's the box hanging off the bottom left of my panel.
 
Bcmo said:
There is already a subpanel with several empty spaces in the garage ~30' from where the pool equipment will be and no space left in the main panel to add a second subpanel. I can run separate breakers for each piece of equipment. Just wasn't sure if it was necessary.

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Our town has 0 requirements for pools at all. 1 stop light town. Literally.
Click to expand...


OK if town is small you may want to check county/state.... I will bet that there is some sort of code adopted

There should be no issue with running a sub-panel off a sub-panel....just watch your loads
 
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