Main drain, and skimmers Oh! My.

[mcleod]

In a conversation with my friend @Dirk, I asked his take on keeping the main drains functioning alongside the skimmers or (in his case) going with skimmers only and plugging up the mains. Dirk carefully weighs such things, and in part because he has only skimmers, he leans toward skimmers only. What might be the collective forum wisdom in this matter?

McLeod

 

[Jimrahbe]

Mc,

Main drains are just not need to have a well working pool.

If you have a main drain, you should only open it about 10% and have most all of your suction going to your skimmers.

If someone snuck in, and shut off your main drain, you would never know...

What is it that you think main drains do that is so important??

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[jtpipkin]

I leave my main open just a bit in case winds blow a bunch of debris in the pool that ends up in the skimmer - for safety sake. I also use it wide open primarily to mix the water when transitioning from spring to summer - ain't nothing fun about dipping your toes into warmish water only to find all that cold stuff hiding a foot or two below the surface

 

[mcleod]

Mc,

Main drains are just not need to have a well working pool.

If you have a main drain, you should only open it about 10% and have most all of your suction going to your skimmers.

If someone snuck in, and shut off your main drain, you would never know...

What is it that you think main drains do that is so important??

Thanks,

Jim R.

Jim
My reply is biased—a brief back story. Shortly upon opening up the pool, we had a leak. After doing my own bucket test et al., I engaged 2 leak detection companies. One found nothing; one found leaks in the vinyl. The leaking persisted (yes, the vinyl should be replaced). The third company was a pool contractor who deduced that the leak was in one of the skimmer's plumbing. They replaced the connections at the skimmer and laid the pipe to the pump. This did not fix anything. The water level returned to just below the skimmer faceplate. Without the main drain, I would not have been able to filter the pool. Thoughts?

Mc

 

[mcleod]

I leave my main open just a bit in case winds blow a bunch of debris in the pool that ends up in the skimmer - for safety sake. I also use it wide open primarily to mix the water when transitioning from spring to summer - ain't nothing fun about dipping your toes into warmish water only to find all that cold stuff hiding a foot or two below the surface

Hadn't thought about that mixing stuff.

 

[FLOMOPOOL]

Before we delve into their importance, let's briefly understand the roles of the skimmer and main drain in your pool's circulation system. The skimmer is a shallow, rectangular opening located at the waterline of the pool. It is designed to draw in surface debris, such as leaves, bugs, and other floating particles, before they have a chance to sink to the bottom. On the other hand, the main drain is typically located at the deepest point of the pool and serves to draw water from the lower levels, ensuring proper circulation and mixing of pool chemicals.

While both the skimmer and main drain are essential for proper pool circulation, the skimmer takes the lead in the battle against bugs and debris. A recommended suction ratio of 70% to the skimmer and 30% to the main drain is widely accepted by pool experts and technicians. This ratio ensures that the skimmer gets the majority of the water flow, enhancing its efficiency in capturing floating debris.

Why the Skimmer is the First Line of Defense?

Surface Debris Removal: As mentioned earlier, the skimmer is positioned at the waterline to trap leaves, bugs, and other debris before they sink to the bottom. By focusing the majority of the suction on the skimmer, you can effectively prevent debris from clogging your pool's filters and reaching the bottom, where it becomes more challenging to clean.

Bug Prevention: Bugs are notorious for finding their way into pools, especially during warm weather. In addition, every time it rains, bugs typically end up on the surface of the water. The skimmer's position allows it to act as a barrier against these pesky intruders. Proper suction allocation ensures that the skimmer swiftly removes bugs from the water's surface, preventing them from becoming a nuisance during swimming.

Efficient Filtration: By maintaining the recommended 70/30 suction ratio, you optimize the skimmer's filtration capacity. This, in turn, reduces the workload on the pool's filtration system, extending its life and reducing maintenance costs.

Maintaining the Recommended Suction Ratio

To ensure the recommended 70/30 skimmer to main drain suction ratio, you need to adjust your pool's valves on the circulation system. Most modern pool pumps allow you to adjust the valve settings to allocate the appropriate amount of suction to the skimmer and main drain. Consult with your pool technician or refer to your pool's manual for guidance on making these adjustments.

In the eternal battle against bugs and debris, the skimmer emerges as the champion, acting as the first line of defense in your pool's circulation system. By maintaining a recommended 70/30 skimmer to main drain suction ratio, you empower the skimmer to efficiently remove surface debris and keep your pool water crystal clear. Embrace the skimmer's essential role in pool maintenance, and you'll enjoy a cleaner, safer, and more inviting swimming experience for you and your loved ones. Remember, a well-balanced and properly functioning skimmer ensures that your pool remains an oasis of enjoyment and relaxation throughout the swim season.

 

[Newdude]

I'm currently grateful for mine. The farm has been blowing all kinds of dust/pollen in for a couple of weeks. Without drains I'd be reliant on the vac (or robot if applicable) for the floor. I've been sweeping daily and keeping the need to vac to a minimum. It takes a half hour or so for the drains to suck up the cloud, but they get it eventually.

Under normal circumstances, I agree. I wouldn't miss them. But when they come in handy like now, or draining to close in the fall, they're a big plus.

 

[mcleod]

Before we delve into their importance, let's briefly understand the roles of the skimmer and main drain in your pool's circulation system. The skimmer is a shallow, rectangular opening located at the waterline of the pool. It is designed to draw in surface debris, such as leaves, bugs, and other floating particles, before they have a chance to sink to the bottom. On the other hand, the main drain is typically located at the deepest point of the pool and serves to draw water from the lower levels, ensuring proper circulation and mixing of pool chemicals.

While both the skimmer and main drain are essential for proper pool circulation, the skimmer takes the lead in the battle against bugs and debris. A recommended suction ratio of 70% to the skimmer and 30% to the main drain is widely accepted by pool experts and technicians. This ratio ensures that the skimmer gets the majority of the water flow, enhancing its efficiency in capturing floating debris.

Why the Skimmer is the First Line of Defense?

Surface Debris Removal: As mentioned earlier, the skimmer is positioned at the waterline to trap leaves, bugs, and other debris before they sink to the bottom. By focusing the majority of the suction on the skimmer, you can effectively prevent debris from clogging your pool's filters and reaching the bottom, where it becomes more challenging to clean.

Bug Prevention: Bugs are notorious for finding their way into pools, especially during warm weather. In addition, every time it rains, bugs typically end up on the surface of the water. The skimmer's position allows it to act as a barrier against these pesky intruders. Proper suction allocation ensures that the skimmer swiftly removes bugs from the water's surface, preventing them from becoming a nuisance during swimming.

Efficient Filtration: By maintaining the recommended 70/30 suction ratio, you optimize the skimmer's filtration capacity. This, in turn, reduces the workload on the pool's filtration system, extending its life and reducing maintenance costs.

Maintaining the Recommended Suction Ratio

To ensure the recommended 70/30 skimmer to main drain suction ratio, you need to adjust your pool's valves on the circulation system. Most modern pool pumps allow you to adjust the valve settings to allocate the appropriate amount of suction to the skimmer and main drain. Consult with your pool technician or refer to your pool's manual for guidance on making these adjustments.

In the eternal battle against bugs and debris, the skimmer emerges as the champion, acting as the first line of defense in your pool's circulation system. By maintaining a recommended 70/30 skimmer to main drain suction ratio, you empower the skimmer to efficiently remove surface debris and keep your pool water crystal clear. Embrace the skimmer's essential role in pool maintenance, and you'll enjoy a cleaner, safer, and more inviting swimming experience for you and your loved ones. Remember, a well-balanced and properly functioning skimmer ensures that your pool remains an oasis of enjoyment and relaxation throughout the swim season.

thank you for the thoughtful and insightful reply

 

[FLOMOPOOL]

thank you for the thoughtful and insightful reply

I know some folks here don't think much of a main drain, but if a pool has no floor suction, you can get chemical hot spots. Chlorine and acid are far heavier than water and go straight to the bottom. There they stay, damaging the pool floor without a main drain. In addition, pools without a functioning main drain can have a 15 degree temperature difference between shallow and deep water.

 

[reggiehammond]

I know some folks here don't think much of a main drain, but if a pool has no floor suction, you can get chemical hot spots. Chlorine and acid are far heavier than water and go straight to the bottom. There they stay, damaging the pool floor without a main drain. Most states (now all ?) require a main drain in every real pool for this and safety reasons. In addition, pools without a functioning main drain can have a 15 degree temperature difference between shallow and deep water.

Before we delve into their importance, let's briefly understand the roles of the skimmer and main drain in your pool's circulation system. The skimmer is a shallow, rectangular opening located at the waterline of the pool. It is designed to draw in surface debris, such as leaves, bugs, and other floating particles, before they have a chance to sink to the bottom. On the other hand, the main drain is typically located at the deepest point of the pool and serves to draw water from the lower levels, ensuring proper circulation and mixing of pool chemicals.

While both the skimmer and main drain are essential for proper pool circulation, the skimmer takes the lead in the battle against bugs and debris. A recommended suction ratio of 70% to the skimmer and 30% to the main drain is widely accepted by pool experts and technicians. This ratio ensures that the skimmer gets the majority of the water flow, enhancing its efficiency in capturing floating debris.

Why the Skimmer is the First Line of Defense?

Surface Debris Removal: As mentioned earlier, the skimmer is positioned at the waterline to trap leaves, bugs, and other debris before they sink to the bottom. By focusing the majority of the suction on the skimmer, you can effectively prevent debris from clogging your pool's filters and reaching the bottom, where it becomes more challenging to clean.

Bug Prevention: Bugs are notorious for finding their way into pools, especially during warm weather. In addition, every time it rains, bugs typically end up on the surface of the water. The skimmer's position allows it to act as a barrier against these pesky intruders. Proper suction allocation ensures that the skimmer swiftly removes bugs from the water's surface, preventing them from becoming a nuisance during swimming.

Efficient Filtration: By maintaining the recommended 70/30 suction ratio, you optimize the skimmer's filtration capacity. This, in turn, reduces the workload on the pool's filtration system, extending its life and reducing maintenance costs.

Maintaining the Recommended Suction Ratio

To ensure the recommended 70/30 skimmer to main drain suction ratio, you need to adjust your pool's valves on the circulation system. Most modern pool pumps allow you to adjust the valve settings to allocate the appropriate amount of suction to the skimmer and main drain. Consult with your pool technician or refer to your pool's manual for guidance on making these adjustments.

In the eternal battle against bugs and debris, the skimmer emerges as the champion, acting as the first line of defense in your pool's circulation system. By maintaining a recommended 70/30 skimmer to main drain suction ratio, you empower the skimmer to efficiently remove surface debris and keep your pool water crystal clear. Embrace the skimmer's essential role in pool maintenance, and you'll enjoy a cleaner, safer, and more inviting swimming experience for you and your loved ones. Remember, a well-balanced and properly functioning skimmer ensures that your pool remains an oasis of enjoyment and relaxation throughout the swim season.

Is this ChatGPT?

 

[Dirk]

It was my understanding (and personal experience) that suction ports do virtually nothing for circulation. They're capable of pulling water in from only a very short distance away. It is the returns, with directable eyeball fixtures, that govern a pool's circulation.

My pool had hotspots. When I remodeled it, I removed the drains and added eyeball returns. Once I got the direction of the eyeballs optimized, no more hot spots.

I completely disagree that a main drain, or main drain and skimmer combo and their "ratios," do anything for circulation or curing hot spots or distributing chemicals. The returns do all of that.

And while I appreciate their use as described by those using drains to deal with debris in the pool or skimmers, does that outweigh the potential for plumbing failures in decades-old underground plumbing? @mcleod is in the throws of a leak nightmare, and he's going to replace his liner as part of the solution. I felt abandoning the main drain plumbing circuit would give him one less thing to worry about in the future (actually, multiple things: two drains and all the pipes that connect them to the pump).

He has two skimmers, the chances of both of them getting clogged up is slim. And he knows how to circulate his pool with a sump pump in emergencies (exactly as he's been doing for weeks).

I feel it's a fair trade off. Future piece of mind and reliability vs a drain system of questionable value.

 

[Dirk]

Most states (now all ?) require a main drain in every real pool for this and safety reasons.

What is a "real" pool? Do you mean commercial pools? Main drains are not usually required by code in residential pools. Further, main drains are by no means safer. The exact opposite is true. They have been the cause of multiple drownings. Federal legislation was enacted to make them somewhat safer. Pools are safer without active drains, and that's indisputable.

 

[Dirk]

I'm currently grateful for mine. The farm has been blowing all kinds of dust/pollen in for a couple of weeks. Without drains I'd be reliant on the vac (or robot if applicable) for the floor. I've been sweeping daily and keeping the need to vac to a minimum. It takes a half hour or so for the drains to suck up the cloud, but they get it eventually.

Under normal circumstances, I agree. I wouldn't miss them. But when they come in handy like now, or draining to close in the fall, they're a big plus.

I appreciate those use-cases, but I don't think he's ever needed his drains to clean the bottom, and he doesn't winterize, so he doesn't need to drain his pool.

And his skimmers are not the kind that would close themselves off in the event of the water level getting below the skimmers, so his drains wouldn't save him in that case either.

 

[Jimrahbe]

if a pool has no floor suction, you can get chemical hot spots. Chlorine and acid are far heavier than water and go straight to the bottom. There they stay, damaging the pool floor without a main drain. Most states (now all ?) require a main drain in every real pool for this and safety reasons

Flo,

Tell us where you found this load of Bull Feathers.???

Tell me just one state that requires main drains in a residential pool.

If the pump is off, when you add chemicals to your pool, the main drain will not be working.. If you add chemicals, like you should with the pump on and in front of a return, there will be no hot spots.. main drain or not..

The real question is... will the average pool owner notice any difference in pool operation with and without a main drain.. The answer is no, they will not.. My pull it out of my rear guess is that most pool owners, that have older pools, where the main drain is connected to the skimmer, don't have operating main drains, and never even know it.

I have no problem with pool owners that want to use their main drains.. I just disagree with the idea that a main drain is needed to have a well operating pool.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[mcleod]

Seeking the collective wisdom this Sunday morning. The ongoing pool leak problem. We need to make a decision; the question is when we make the decision.
1) The pool liner is going to be replaced.
2) The pool continues to leak, about an inch overnight, and last night the pump was off. The pool is not level so the returns at one end are now showing (about 25%) out of the water. The other end returns are still under water about 1.5 inches.
3) Will run the pump for the same amount of time today (12 hours) and take a measurement.

Questions
1) Do I continue with this process until the leak stops either at the returns or below them thereby gathering better intel as to where the leak is?
2) Do I stop the process, plan on disconnecting the main drains, install the liner, sing Somewhere Over the Rainbow, and enjoy my pool?