Replacing light leads to pump failing to prime ???

[mguntow]

Hello all,

My pool lights failed a little while ago. I’ve been trying to fix them. Instead of working lights, I’ve ended up with a pool full of bubbles and a pump that won’t prime when used with the spa. I’m confused. Thought I’d see if anyone here has any ideas.

In troubleshooting the light failure, I found and fixed two problems. There were two gfci circuit breakers on the circuit. Unnecessary and I read that can cause intermittent problems. I also found a loose wire in my EasyTouch enclosure. It wasn’t related to lighting but needed to be fixed anyway. After that, the power tested correctly at the light junction box. I verified neutral and ground there as well.

I hooked up the light to the now working junction box, got the light back in the niche, filled up the spa and tested it. Light! Woohoo! … for a few seconds. Then it flickered and went out. Junction box still tested correct. Light did not have water in it when I pulled it back out. After reading more about the lights - Pentair IntelliBright 5G LEDs - I concluded there was a good chance the lights had failed. I decided to replace them with a Pentair AmeriLite with an LED bulb. Easy, right?

As I removed the old light, I pulled in a pull string while pulling out the old wire. When the ordered light arrived, I tried to pull the new wire in using the pull string. It broke.

I then spent several hours trying to push the wire through or get a fish tape through. Nope. I filled the conduit with laundry detergent. Very effective. The wire slide right in until it hit the same sticking point and will not budge. I ran a hose to the conduit and hoped to push out any debris. Result: Spa full of bubbles.

Meanwhile, the spa is refilling with water. There appears to be a leak from the pool to the spa just below the tile line. I turned the pump on to remove some of the water from the spa. Nothing. After another hour of troubleshooting, I find that no matter what, there’s no water getting to the pump from spa suction. Pool is fine. And I can route it so pool water goes into the spa. So everything but spa suction seems to be fine. I’d used this method to drain down the spa just a few hours before. I’m completely confused as to how anything I did led to the spa suction failing.

Any suggestions???
I’m contacted my pool guy to try and get on his schedule. I’m leery of continuing to try and fix any of this myself since I just seem to have made things worse. But I’m also just puzzled as to how one thing could have led to the other.

 

[Rancho Cost-a-Lotta]

If you switch the diverter valve to pull suction from the pool, will the pump prime? It sounds to me like your suction diverter valve maybe blocked or defective.

If I'm off base, at least you get a quick bump.

 

[mguntow]

If you switch the diverter valve to pull suction from the pool, will the pump prime? It sounds to me like your suction diverter valve maybe blocked or defective.

If I'm off base, at least you get a quick bump.

Yes, the pump will pull water from the pool. I set the diverter valve in every combo. Everything works but spa suction.
Pool suction, out to pool - works
Pool suction, out to spa - works
Spa suction - out to spa or pool - nada

 

[Rancho Cost-a-Lotta]

I ran a hose to the conduit and hoped to push out any debris. Result: Spa full of bubbles.

Is it possible some of the debris got sucked into the spa drain? If so, it may be partially obstructing the suction drain, or the debris may be further downstream. I would also try disassembling the diverter valve to check for obstructions there.

 

[Jimrahbe]

m,

I agree with Mike above...

Please show us several pics of your equipment pad..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[mguntow]

Is it possible some of the debris got sucked into the spa drain? If so, it may be partially obstructing the suction drain, or the debris may be further downstream. I would also try disassembling the diverter valve to check for obstructions there.

I was thinking that’s a possibly.
There was a lot of cruft in the niche initially. I cleaned it out when I took the original light out of the niche. Perhaps using the hose dislodged something. The spa intake does have a grated cover. I wouldn’t have thought anything big enough to block it could get through.

At one point in my troubleshooting I thought maybe the problem was not enough water in the spa. The jets were above water. They should just be outflow but I was grasping at straws at that point. I used a hose to put more water in the spa. I held it to the spa intake grate thinking the force might dislodge something there.

So I’m thinking now to try getting the hose into the suction pipe. I should be able to temporarily remove the grate in the spa to access the pipe directly. I’m thing I need a way for any debris to get out… so I’m thinking to disassemble the valve to create an opening. (It’s an automated valve. I replaced the seals in it about a year ago so I know I can take it apart and put it back together.)

 

[mguntow]

m,

I agree with Mike above...

Please show us several pics of your equipment pad..

Thanks,

Jim R.

Thank you all for the responses!!!!
I will post some pics when I get back out there this morning. Too chilly for pool time at the moment

 

[Jimrahbe]

m,

Does not happen often, but does happen.. The valve stem breaks so the diverter never moves, but the actuator does and it gives you the impression that the valve is actually moving, when it is not..

I like your idea of dissembling the valve and forcing water back into the spa..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[mguntow]

Here’s some pics of my pool pad and the pool area…








So, yeah, that’s soap bubbles in the spa.
This morning some water is getting through on spa suction. Still not enough, the pump “basket” never fill completely. I tried turning the pump speed down. Even with that it won’t fill more than halfway. Again… pool side is working fine this morning.



And the other half of my troubles - Getting the new light wire pulled through the conduit. I poured laundry detergent in the conduit via the junction box last night. Read leaving it sit overnight can help. The first interesting thing was that when I poured it in, it filled to the top of the conduit in the junction box. That’s at least 10” above the water level in the pool. This morning I checked it and its dropped a couple millimeters. It’s still at least 10” above the water level in the pool. To me that says the conduit is actually plugged somehow. But… the old wire was in there and came out. My pull string broke off in there but it’s hard to imagine that plugging it.

I’m off to Harbor Freight Tools to pick up a different type of fish tape that might work better on that part of the problem. I’ll try disassembling the suction valve when I get back.

Thank you so much for the ideas!

 

[mguntow]

Update…
After some snafus at the start: the cover over the suction in the bottom of the spa appears to be glued in place. Had to use goggles and hold my breath under water to get 8 screws out only to find out that fun fact. Grrrr. Since I’d already taken apart the valve, I put a hose in from that side and forced water through. Ended up with _alot_ of bubbles in the spa. And the hose stuck in the pipe below the valve. But things have improved.

I stuck a second hose in the pipe, not allowing it to go far in. It had higher pressure than the first (now off). Didn’t come out then but did about 10 minutes later after I let it sit there. Don’t know if it was the second hose or walking away from it for a few minutes but thank goodness.

Decided to see if the “blowout” might have helped. Put the gate in the valve like it would be for pool suction (without putting it all back together) and turned on the pump. Water flow from spa suction!!!!! There’s still more air than I think is right but the spa side has always been wonky. I left it on to drain down the spa so I could work in it.

While it was doing that, I got the handy fiberglass pull tape I got this morning from Harbor Freight. It went past where everything has been getting stuck!!!! Another minute or so of fiddling and I’ve got fish tape all the way through to the niche!!!! Don’t know if letting the laundry detergent sit in the conduit overnight or the fiberglass fish tape made the difference. But yay!!!!

Next I try to pull the wire for the new light back through. Wish me luck!!!!

 

[mguntow]

New light is hooked up and working!!!!
And I’m sitting it the spa with the pump working away to send soapy water through the filter!
Things were looking pretty dark last night. Much brighter… literally… today.

Any suggestions on getting rid of all the bubbles? Just let the pump and filter do their thing?

Thanks all for the advice and support!

 

[Jimrahbe]

m,

I would lower the water level in the spa and then used a wet-vac to suck out the suds..

When you put the Intake valve back together, I'd leave the actuator off and run some tests switching back and forth between the pool and spa modes. If the tests work, then I would put the actuator back on and run the tests again.

Thanks,

Jim R.