Our pool liner hasn't been in great shape since we moved in (we estimate it to be 10-15 years old). We were going to hold off on redoing the liner until we redo the whole patio, but at this point it makes the most sense to do the water and liner together. Thanks for your help!
My pool won't hold ANY chemicals! NONE! HELP!
- Thread starter raeben23
- Start date
- Jun 8, 2019
- 4,576
- Pool Size
- 20000
- Surface
- Vinyl
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
That works too! Once you get the new liner and new water in, I recommend switching over to liquid chlorine and granulated CYA to add CYA to the point you want it and keep it there. Things will stay much more sanitary if you follow the FC/CYA Levels, and using liquid chlorine means no additional CYA building up from tab use. 
If your liner isn't trashed, damaged, you can get your PH in line to keep it from attacking it.
Some 20 Mule team borax will help greatly. Pool math app or the website here will tell you how much.
Still have to drain for the CYA, but the PH is not good.
I have the pool at my rental property almost lined out from what i have learned here.
The test kit makes you feel like a chemist and super accurate. My CYA was bottomed out and i thought it was just the test strips.
Keep at it.
Some 20 Mule team borax will help greatly. Pool math app or the website here will tell you how much.
Still have to drain for the CYA, but the PH is not good.
I have the pool at my rental property almost lined out from what i have learned here.
The test kit makes you feel like a chemist and super accurate. My CYA was bottomed out and i thought it was just the test strips.
Keep at it.
We have considered switching to a SWG system during this whole process as well.....thoughts? We thought about it when we first moved in, but now this this overhaul we are thinking about it again.
Switching to SWG was the best pool choice of my life. I would suggest, though, that you get a really firm handle on all the chemistry before you go SWG. You'll end up testing less frequently so you need to be confident in the overall chemistry of your pool.
I have an electrical issue keeping my SWG from working correctly that I just haven't had time to dig into but I swapped over to SWG the first year I bought the house, instead of buying chemicals, and it worked great.
Open pool, clean pool, get it running right and let the SWG keep it maintained.
Sweep, vacuum as needed and enjoy.
For my 24' AG an Intex model from Rural King did the trick for about four years and then it developed a crack, likely my fault and i couldn't find a replacement part. Just bought a new one.
Open pool, clean pool, get it running right and let the SWG keep it maintained.
Sweep, vacuum as needed and enjoy.
For my 24' AG an Intex model from Rural King did the trick for about four years and then it developed a crack, likely my fault and i couldn't find a replacement part. Just bought a new one.
So after MUCH debate and about a 50% drain and refill of our pool (done yesterday) we are thinking about just riding out the season with our manual chlorine system (if able with our chemistry) instead of switching to SWG (we think.....)
Current numbers:
FC: 0 (haven't added any yet)
pH: 6.6-6.8 (tough to gauge color)
CYA: 80
TA: 140
CH: 130
We need to get the CYA down, but aren't sure if we should do 1 or 2 more trucks of water (6500 gal per truck, we have a 22k gal pool). If we do 1 truck, CYA might not be low enough...but 2 seems like a lot.
Once the water swap is over, then we need to add chemicals to adjust all of the levels of course. Is there a particular order we should do this in?
The last question is....is keeping it chlorine for the season and adding all of the chemicals back in a bad idea versus just switching to SWG? If we switch to SWG now, do we have to drain and refill any more? Or will it work with our current chemistry? I imagine we need to raise the pH with SWG, but I don't know about the over levels.
Thanks for your help!!!
Current numbers:
FC: 0 (haven't added any yet)
pH: 6.6-6.8 (tough to gauge color)
CYA: 80
TA: 140
CH: 130
We need to get the CYA down, but aren't sure if we should do 1 or 2 more trucks of water (6500 gal per truck, we have a 22k gal pool). If we do 1 truck, CYA might not be low enough...but 2 seems like a lot.
Once the water swap is over, then we need to add chemicals to adjust all of the levels of course. Is there a particular order we should do this in?
The last question is....is keeping it chlorine for the season and adding all of the chemicals back in a bad idea versus just switching to SWG? If we switch to SWG now, do we have to drain and refill any more? Or will it work with our current chemistry? I imagine we need to raise the pH with SWG, but I don't know about the over levels.
Thanks for your help!!!
- Jun 8, 2019
- 4,576
- Pool Size
- 20000
- Surface
- Vinyl
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
First get the water aerating now to get the pH up. Also get some FC in the water with bleach / liquid chlorine. You don’t want an algae bloom or damage to your equipment / finishes while you figure things out.
Draining and refilling with two trucks worth would be best. Your CYA is ~140 (if you did the diluted test and got between 60 and 70 you round up to 70 and then double). Exchanging 13k gallons in a 22k gallon pool is about 60% of the water. That would bring it down to 50-60 CYA which is about what you want. So that’s ideal. One truck is only 30%, which would only bring CYA down to 100.
Draining and refilling with two trucks worth would be best. Your CYA is ~140 (if you did the diluted test and got between 60 and 70 you round up to 70 and then double). Exchanging 13k gallons in a 22k gallon pool is about 60% of the water. That would bring it down to 50-60 CYA which is about what you want. So that’s ideal. One truck is only 30%, which would only bring CYA down to 100.
Sorry, I don't think I was clear on my first post. We already did a drain and refill which has brought our CYA down to 80. We are debating doing 1 or 2 MORE trucks to lower the CYA further. Also, how do you recommend aerating to bring up pH? Just run the system with the returns pointed at the surface? Sorry if that's a dumb question!
Mixing air into the water (aeration) drives up pH without adding any chemicals. Anything that really churns the surface of the water over an extended period of time will mix in air and raise the pH level.
If you decide to switch to an SWG this year, you can run it with a CYA of 80. It will be a touch high, but not really significantly so. Recommended CYA level for SWG is 60-70ppm. You would just need to run the SWG a little higher to maintain the correct amount of chlorine.
If you decide to switch to an SWG this year, you can run it with a CYA of 80. It will be a touch high, but not really significantly so. Recommended CYA level for SWG is 60-70ppm. You would just need to run the SWG a little higher to maintain the correct amount of chlorine.
- Jun 8, 2019
- 4,576
- Pool Size
- 20000
- Surface
- Vinyl
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-60
80 is manageable with chlorine too - the issue is testing pH, which can’t be reliably done when FC is over 10. One more truck would be a 30% drop, which would take it down to 50-60, but you might make 80 work. CYA does degrade, just slowly, so you might be able to ride it out with higher FC levels until it naturally drops over a few months to a year.
Get the pH up into the 7’s and add a bunch of FC. How does the water look?
Get the pH up into the 7’s and add a bunch of FC. How does the water look?
mguzzy
Gold Supporter
I agree with Ice.. get that pH up! and if you want to work toward putting in a SWG this year, I don't see anything wrong with that. You'll need yet another testing kit (K-1766) to test the amount of salt in your current water before you add salt to get it up to the target for whatever SWG you buy. And you'll get your FC in line with liquid chlorine before you let the SWG take over. There are a lot of good resources in the wiki on how to transition to a SWG.. Go for it
After reading all of the responses (thanks so much!) here is what we've decided...
Also, the water right now is clear, no algae, just a lot of debris from the rainstorm last night!
- Drain and refill one more truck of water
- Increase pH
- SLAM
Also, the water right now is clear, no algae, just a lot of debris from the rainstorm last night!
The test reagent for PH can give a false elevated PH result when FC (chlorine) is over 10, that is why the PH has to be stable and between 7.2-7.8 before starting a SLAM
As for raising PH, have you tested TA? If the TA is low, you can use Baking Soda, if the TA is "good" you'll want to create aeration (air compressor works too!) and/or use Washing Soda (soda ash) to raise PH instead of paying double for the same thing in PH up (check the chemical ingredients on label)
CH (calcium hardness) = not needed for vinyl, don't add!
That can change in a heartbeat with no chlorine in the water
Our TA is 140 now, but we'll have to check again after the water swap. This may be silly, but how do you use an air compressor to aerate? Just point it at the water and wait? LolThe test reagent for PH can give a false elevated PH result when FC (chlorine) is over 10, that is why the PH has to be stable and between 7.2-7.8 before starting a SLAM
As for raising PH, have you tested TA? If the TA is low, you can use Baking Soda, if the TA is "good" you'll want to create aeration (air compressor works too!) and/or use Washing Soda (soda ash) to raise PH instead of paying double for the same thing in PH up (check the chemical ingredients on label)
CH (calcium hardness) = not needed for vinyl, don't add!
That can change in a heartbeat with no chlorine in the water
Where do you get soda ash?
I'm of the "no-question-is-silly" group
With a TA of 140, I would definitely get the water churning/actively splashing vs adding any "chemical" PH up
I'll try to search a couple of posts here on the forums, but getting the nozzle in the pool and running it
Can you point the returns up so they break the surface of the water at all?
It is Arm & Hammer Super Washing Soda, laundry aisle of Walmart or hardware store
- May 3, 2014
- 58,690
- Pool Size
- 6000
- Surface
- Fiberglass
- Chlorine
- Salt Water Generator
- SWG Type
- Pentair Intellichlor IC-40
Baking Soda = big TA change, small pH change
Borax = Big pH change, small TA change
Washing Soda = big pH change, big TA change. Probably more TA change than you want.
Borax = Big pH change, small TA change
Washing Soda = big pH change, big TA change. Probably more TA change than you want.
You can make an aerator fairly easily by getting some pvc from HD or Lowes or plumbing supply. and build it so it attaches to the return and outlets above water line. A search of the sight would show some examples. I think some "water fountains " are sold on line fairly cheaply that do this also just attach it to the return. But I would do it quickly with Borax (20 mule team at the supermarket or big box discount retailer like Walmart'
DeanP66
0
I made one out of pvc and attached it to my Polaris return line.
@raeben23:
I noticed you have water trucked in, Is it because you are on well water? How expensive is that? Just curious because I live in NJ and have done a refill and if I remember right, the water bill was only $400 and we usually go over $100 when not in use or watering grass, so I did not think that was too expensive. It does take longer though.
I noticed you have water trucked in, Is it because you are on well water? How expensive is that? Just curious because I live in NJ and have done a refill and if I remember right, the water bill was only $400 and we usually go over $100 when not in use or watering grass, so I did not think that was too expensive. It does take longer though.