New pool build in AZ!

[proavia]

Welcome to The Valley of the Sun.
And glad you found TFP early in your pool adventure.

It got to 116* at my house in the East Valley today. It's been 110+ for the past week and those temps will continue for the next week at least. Are you sure you want to be outside in daylight manually vacuuming the pool in summer?

It would be easier for you to forget everything you think you know about pools and start fresh.
Much has changed in the last 20+ years.

 

[mbdesa]

I think you know this given your background but, as an O/B, you’re going to be on the bottom of any sub-contractors priority list. Your experience is great for dealing with the subs and probably twisting their arms on price (you know more than the average joe) but the subs live to satisfy their big pool builder clients and if comes down to working on your pool versus do a job for their PB that feeds them 25-30 jobs per year, they’re going to come up with all manners of excuse not to show up at your site or they’ll send over the crew run by their 18 year old nephew who barely knows how to wipe his own rear end let alone run a crew.

Just sayin’ … not trying to discourage … but I’m guessing you know all this.

Anyway, I’m a big Pentair fan so I say look at their stuff. The IntelliCenter is their flagship automation system and their variable speed pumps and salt water chlorine generators are the gold standard. Stay away from the hype (mineral systems, ozone, UV, etc). Install a salt water chlorine generator pool and you’ll be golden.

Also, make sure your home has a whole house water softener install and make sure that your pool’s auto fill line is hooked up to the softener water supply. You will regret it otherwise.

WaterTec is a great, locally owned family company for water conditioning needs.

I have to respectfully disagree with being on the bottom of the list for subs. I am just finishing another OB here in Phoenix, AZ. The subs I used were bending over backwards to get my business. I think what you mentioned was likely the case in 2020-2022, but now things are different. Nearly all of the subs I used mentioned how they had little to no work right now. The large pool builders are not selling very many pools, and so the work isn't trickling down. A few of my subs went out of their way spending multiple days on site, when before it would have been a rushed one day job. One of them even told me he was going to just take his time (assuming I was ok with that) because he didn't want to sit at home without work. Every one of my crews showed up on the day and time they were supposed to.

OP, if you need Phoenix Subs, message me, and I will give you the good ones.

 

[Time2Relax]

@JoyfulNoise OK, I am on board with cartridge filters (thank you)... an old dog can learn new tricks I suppose. I watched this video and I think it agrees with your take (?)

 

[Time2Relax]

Welcome to The Valley of the Sun.
And glad you found TFP early in your pool adventure.

It got to 116* at my house in the East Valley today. It's been 110+ for the past week and those temps will continue for the next week at least. Are you sure you want to be outside in daylight manually vacuuming the pool in summer?

It would be easier for you to forget everything you think you know about pools and start fresh.
Much has changed in the last 20+ years.

I am learning quickly that I should open my mind and learn the new stuff...there's some cool stuff out there.! And BTW, I started my pool service business in 1977 when I was in my early 20's...yikes time flies!

I am absolutely positive that I want to vacuum my own pool. I will do it early in the morning or late evening with a cold one. I find it so relaxing. Now, that may change (as has been mentioned) with illness, but I'll deal with that when It happens.... adding a suction fitting will allow me to get an automatic cleaner in the future.....
Thank you!

 

[Newdude]

I am absolutely positive that I want to vacuum my own pool. I will do it early in the morning or late evening with a cold one. I find it so relaxing

I vac mine with a snorkel/mask. Not only is it way easier to see those spots you missed, but it's 95% swimming and 5% work.

 

[Schwimmbad]

Hey @Time2Relax I'm curious how your pool is coming along? Did you make all the major decisions and get it started? My excavation is schedule to start Tuesday next week.

While I am planning on a robot initially, I'm still going back and forth on a dedicated suction line. @JoyfulNoise is making some strong arguments. I like to have options for the future, so I'm leaning towards putting one in.

 

[Time2Relax]

Hey @Time2Relax I'm curious how your pool is coming along? Did you make all the major decisions and get it started? My excavation is schedule to start Tuesday next week.

While I am planning on a robot initially, I'm still going back and forth on a dedicated suction line. @JoyfulNoise is making some strong arguments. I like to have options for the future, so I'm leaning towards putting one in.

Hi and thanks for asking! Are you in the Phx area also? So we literally (well 2 weeks) just moved down here (West Valley) and are still getting un-boxed and settled in. And I am going to use proceeds from the sale of our other house up north of Prescott to build the pool. So not started as of yet, hope to get everything settle and start the dig in Nov or Dec. Definitely want the pool in by next summer, I could use a dip today!

But all decisions have been made (with of course some adjustments expected as the build goes along I have already used input from this forum to make and change decisions. But I am looking at this:
In-ground gunite
12 x 30 ft rectangle
4x6 Baja ledge
No steps
Pebbletec surface, white pearl or sky blue color
Travertine bullnose coping
6x6 tile
Boulder waterfall feature (I'll make it myself so no design yet)
Separate suction line to vacuum (no reason not to and it will get use regardless of a robot or not)
Separate drain line
4 one inch returns, located with wind direction in mind
Pentair Multi-speed pump
Hayward 48SF filter (may switch to cartridge)
No heater
No automation
Salt Hayward W3AQ
LED lighting

So that's it so far....One thing I need to ask the County is abut fencing. The property - 1.25 acres, has a 5 ft chain link fence. But in some places it measures like 58" or 59", and I wonder how fussy they will get about that...? I'm guessing pretty fussy, knowing building inspectors like I do.....we'll see. There has to be a work-around for that.

I will post a drawing as I get closer to starting......

 

[Schwimmbad]

Well howdy neighbor! We are in West Valley also, Buckeye actually.

Looks like your major decisions have been made. If you were like me, I kept browsing this forum and continuously adjusted my plans and thinking. Just when you think you are done tweaking you read something else (like @JoyfulNoise's comments about the suction line) and you change your mind. It will be nice once you are done with the decisions and can enjoy the fruits of your labor!

By the way, I have a pretty extensive list of contractors in the phoenix area that I did quite a bit of research on, so PM if I can help in any way.

 

[proavia]

Hey @Time2Relax I'm curious how your pool is coming along? Did you make all the major decisions and get it started? My excavation is schedule to start Tuesday next week.

While I am planning on a robot initially, I'm still going back and forth on a dedicated suction line. @JoyfulNoise is making some strong arguments. I like to have options for the future, so I'm leaning towards putting one in.

Adding the vacuum during the plumbing phase of the build may incur a small price increase for the pipe, fittings and valving.
Adding the vacuum line after the build is complete will incur quite a bit of work and a hefty price tag.

Do it during the build. Even if you never use it, it may come in handy for the next owner.
A dedicated vacuum port also makes manual vacumming easier.

 

[proavia]

Since chain link fencing is easy to climb, you may find out that a separate pool fence is required.
As well, check about if steps are necessary - some places have something in the code about them.

 

[Time2Relax]

Well howdy neighbor! We are in West Valley also, Buckeye actually.

Looks like your major decisions have been made. If you were like me, I kept browsing this forum and continuously adjusted my plans and thinking. Just when you think you are done tweaking you read something else (like @JoyfulNoise's comments about the suction line) and you change your mind. It will be nice once you are done with the decisions and can enjoy the fruits of your labor!

By the way, I have a pretty extensive list of contractors in the phoenix area that I did quite a bit of research on, so PM if I can help in any way.

Howdy back at ya! We are in Wittmann....I would love a list of subs if you would share.... I have a local excavator so far, that's all, but he's good at $2000 for the job. Maybe if we are doing our projects at similar times we can have some sort of respect from the subs?
I need gunite/steel/coping prices for my budget. I think I will do my own tile, mainly just for fun and old times sake...I could regret that though, huh, I ain't as young as I used to be...

 

[Time2Relax]

Adding the vacuum during the plumbing phase of the build may incur a small price increase for the pipe, fittings and valving.
Adding the vacuum line after the build is complete will incur quite a bit of work and a hefty price tag.

Do it during the build. Even if you never use it, it may come in handy for the next owner.
A dedicated vacuum port also makes manual vacumming easier.

Yep! There is no reason not to run an extra 1-1/2 pipe to the pool. Costs almost nothing in extra labor since you can share a trench, and a valve is ~$100 so why not? Ya never know when an extra pipe under the ground might come in handy....

 

[Time2Relax]

I know it would cost a bit more, but much easier and way less chance of a pipe cracking down the road. I seem to remember doing this way back in the days when I was building pools....any thoughts on this?

 

[proavia]

Never heard of it in Phoenix. I think it is (or used to be) more of a back east or northern climates thing.
Flex pipe has its own set of issues. I've heard termites might like to chew thru it (yeah, termites are prevelant in our desert).

Properly installed solid sched 40 PVC pipe isn't going to crack.

 

[mknauss]

PVC Repair - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

 

[AZRider]

Howdy back at ya! We are in Wittmann....I would love a list of subs if you would share.... I have a local excavator so far, that's all, but he's good at $2000 for the job. Maybe if we are doing our projects at similar times we can have some sort of respect from the subs?
I need gunite/steel/coping prices for my budget. I think I will do my own tile, mainly just for fun and old times sake...I could regret that though, huh, I ain't as young as I used to be...

Hello I will be watching your build thread. I am new to the forum. My wife and I decided a pool was a necessity here after moving from Northern NV. We are starting to investigate pools and are finding this site very informative. We are interestedly watching your progress since we are also in Wittmann.

 

[Time2Relax]

Properly installed solid sched 40 PVC pipe isn't going to crack.

Oh but it does. That's why I'm wary I think.....I owned a Leak Detection Franchise over in San Diego area for a while. Made a LOT of money finding and repairing cracked rigid PVC. I mean thousands of broken pipes, and up and down the West Coast, the number was 10s of thousands. Two main causes: 1) ground movement and 2) improper backfill (ie rocks dumped against pipes). Maybe there is not much ground movement in AZ I'm guessing? In which case, I'd rather use rigid anyway, so good. Just worth asking.....

 

[Time2Relax]

@mknauss Thanks for the link. Some interesting stuff in there, good tips for beginners....

 

[JoyfulNoise]

Oh but it does. That's why I'm wary I think.....I owned a Leak Detection Franchise over in San Diego area for a while. Made a LOT of money finding and repairing cracked rigid PVC. I mean thousands of broken pipes, and up and down the West Coast, the number was 10s of thousands. Two main causes: 1) ground movement and 2) improper backfill (ie rocks dumped against pipes). Maybe there is not much ground movement in AZ I'm guessing? In which case, I'd rather use rigid anyway, so good. Just worth asking.....

Improper construction practice. The industry standard is for all PVC pipe to be buried at least 12” below the frost line and 18-24” if there is going to be substantial heavy traffic over the area. Pipes should be joined either outside the trench or inside but allowed to fully cure for 24 hours before backfilling. The pipes should be laid on a bed of clean fill sand at least 2” thick and then filled with clean sand until it is buried by at least 2” of sand. These layers should be water flooded or tamped to ensure compaction. Then the remaining trench can be filled with excavation material. Compaction of each lift is important to reduce settling.

You’ll find most contractors will be very lazy in this regard and skip a lot of these critical steps. They will often stack pipes up to closely or lay them on top of one another or throw trash in the trenches. It’s something you have to stay on top of and force compliance because the PB and subs will try to get away with it.

 

[proavia]

Oh but it does. That's why I'm wary I think.....I owned a Leak Detection Franchise over in San Diego area for a while. Made a LOT of money finding and repairing cracked rigid PVC. I mean thousands of broken pipes, and up and down the West Coast, the number was 10s of thousands. Two main causes: 1) ground movement and 2) improper backfill (ie rocks dumped against pipes). Maybe there is not much ground movement in AZ I'm guessing? In which case, I'd rather use rigid anyway, so good. Just worth asking.....

Hence why I said "properly installed".