Why is my new SWCG making my pool cloudy with bubbles!?

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Kodiak said:
@carpenter333: somehow I missed your message initially. Great advice. Do you think we are going to enjoy having the SWCG? I'm particularly interested in your perspective given that you come from an even colder climate than me :)
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I love my SWCG system. This is my second pool I had installed and both with the SWCG. It really makes managing the season easy once your up and running. In the cooler weather there isn't really much you can do but wait, clean and have a cold one around the pool. As mentioned above, get your test kit, post results and don't turn that SWCG on until you have a little warmer water temperature to work with. Its not like you are going to be out there in it, but it does give you a break to go and check on it.

Keep a couple jugs of bleach on hand at all times, some MA, a case or two of beer and wait for the sunshine.
 
I can't remember the brand of pool salt offhand, but I did double check to make sure it was 100% NACL with no additives. It said it had been refined to remove any impurities and contained less than .001% "other". As for the water itself, we are on city water, so no wells to deal with.

I dropped the pool level by about 10" last night and refilled it and then did so again this morning. My SWCG seems pleased with this, as the high salt content light is no longer on. I too am hoping that this helped to dilute some of the "elixers" I've fallen victim to.

I'm looking forward to learning more as soon as my tests arrive. I am trying to internalize all of this, but I know it will be different once I'm in action.

I ended up skipping Amazon altogether and went directly to TFTestKits.net, as you all suggested, and ordered the TF-100 (XL) test kit, along with the K-1766 Salt Test Kit, Speedstir Stirrer and a "Samplesizer tool". Is there anything that I missed that I should have ordered? I don't know how long shipping usually takes, but I will sit tight and post my updated numbers as soon as they arrive.

Thank you all again. Especially to those of you who have followed up with multiple responses. You have no idea how much my family and I appreciate the guidance.

:handwave:
 
You are so going to love the TF100, and you got the good stuff with it :)

You will be surprised at how different your test kit numbers and the pool store numbers will be... Keep your head up, once the kit arrives we will get you going :)
 
Ok! So I just tested all levels twice with my new kit that arrived.

pH = 7.5
FC = 10
CC = 0 (the solution did not change color at all)
TC = 0?
CH = 150 (I triple checked this reading)
Alk = 240-250
CYA = 55-60
Salt = I did not test this level because my SWCG is telling me that the salt level is within the "ideal range".

What should I be doing next???? The water is clear when only the pump, filter and heater are running, but becomes milky with tiny bubbles as soon as the SWCG is flipped on. And it isn't an issue with water flow in my case...

Thank you!!!
 
Total chlorine is FC + CC so 10. Your TA is crazy high, curious if your pH swings around. pH test is iffy above 10, don't know about 10 exactly. CYA is on the low end for SWG, you will probably want to bump that up a little. I would take half measures to avoid overshooting.
 
I am sure someone told you, but bubbles are normal with a SWG.

Now, looking at those numbers, the first thing I see is that your TA is way off, as mentioned in the previous post. A SWG system really needs the TA to be around 70-80. I am betting the high TA is causing a huge pH swing near the returns, and causing clouding. When my pH is off, my pool will cloud too. You need to go through the process of lowering TA, which is actually pretty simple but can take time. Lower the pH to 7.2, then let it climb back up to 7.8 due to your SWG, then lower back to 7.2, and on and on... Eventually TA will come down.
 
Kodiak said:
Ok! So I just tested all levels twice with my new kit that arrived.

pH = 7.5
FC = 10
CC = 0 (the solution did not change color at all)
TC = 0?
CH = 150 (I triple checked this reading)
Alk = 240-250
CYA = 55-60
Salt = I did not test this level because my SWCG is telling me that the salt level is within the "ideal range".

What should I be doing next???? The water is clear when only the pump, filter and heater are running, but becomes milky with tiny bubbles as soon as the SWCG is flipped on. And it isn't an issue with water flow in my case...

Thank you!!!
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If you haven't tried this, wipe the tip of the TA drop bottle with a damp cloth in between drops to remove the static charge. You may get a lower result. Then again, it explains the bubbles you're seeing at night being so pronounced.

Your FC at 10 is not affecting your ph.

This is not a big deal, if your TA is really that high. Its simple. Whenever your PH creeps up to 7.8 or higher, you add enough muratic acid to lower it down to 7.2. Eventually your TA will lower as well into the recommended range and your ph will stabilize and acid additions will be less frequent.

:) You're on your way!

Edit: Oops, just realized I said the same thing as RobbieH. lol
 
Great!! Thanks for your advice here.

I will repeat the TA test and will be sure to be more careful about wiping the static charge. If I get different results, I will post an update. If the results repeat themselves though, what is the most cost effective means of procuring muratic acid for my pool? What concentration? And how much should I add?

Should I be doing anything to get the calcium levels up at all?

Is there anything else I should be doing right now besides muratic acid?

Please se confirm the following course of action:

(1) Retest to confirm accurate results (wipe tip)
(2) Add _______ amount of muratic acid to lower my pH to 7.2.
(3) Then run the SWCG and throw on the robot and jet aeration attachment for the pool and aerate the water until pH is back up to 7.8.
(4) Repeat #2 & #3 until TA comes down towards 100.
***Any thoughts on how many cycles of this process it might take me?


thanks again!!!
 
Just retested TA making sure to wipe the tip of the bottle between drops. The new reading is 190, which is still high, but not as high as we thought it was earlier. So, the muratic acid cycle? How much? How many times? Anything else?

RobbieH - Got ya in terms of the vinyl. But doesn't the calcium levels also impact the bubbles? Or is that only if the calcium levels are too high?
 

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The bubbles are due to the process of generating chlorine in the SWCG. If your cell is transparent, you can see them in the cell as the water passes through. Turn off the SWG and they go away. There is nothing else causing them.

To lower TA, follow the process I already posted above. Lower to 7.2, aerate to 7.8, repeat. No way to tell how long it will take.
 
For the number of cycles, I don't think there is anyway to tell. Last season my TA went down (I don't have my log in front of me, guessing) 50 over the summer, and that was a "cycle" / week in a pool twice as big as yours.

TA is fine tuning, don't worry about being crazy aggressive like you have to be in a SLAM, unless you want sparkling water NOW.
 
1. No, turn off your SWG and it will come down on its own.
2. You can swim as long as the water is clear, pH is balanced, and FC is below SLAM level.
3. Use PoolMath. If you are scared, try adding 1/2 at first then the other half in 30 min after another test.
4. It is swimmable within a few minutes. Some will say 30. Mine is just fine in about 10.
 
Kodiak said:
Should I be doing anything to get the calcium levels up at all?
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I often see advice from various members on this forum telling people with vinyl liners they need not worry about calcium, this
is incorrect if you have a heater.

Check the owners manual for your heat pump and see what they recommend for calcium levels. (usually just above 200 ppm)

EDIT: I checked the manual for the XL pump of your brand and no calcium or other recommended chemical levels appear
unlike other heat pump mfgs...I would contact them directly for that info.


ALL heaters need a proper calcium level to avoid leaching from the heat exchanger / coils. If it isn't followed the warranty is no good.
 
Muriatic acid (aka hydrochloric acid) is available from hardware and pool stores. A lot of people here at TFP mention Lowes. Here in Aus it's cheap as chips and you find it at the building supply in the section with mortars and concrete products. The label includes swimming pool pH adjustment. The good stuff is 31% MA. Sometimes you might see 15%.

Get to know http://www.troublefreepool.com/calc.html which is best way to figure out quantities for yourself. For a 20k pool to drop from 7.5 to 7.2, PoolMath says 58 oz of 31% MA, so just under half a gallon. As mentioned try less at first until you're comfortable with it and/or until sure of your pool volume. Read Pool School - Recommended Pool Chemicals to get succinct info and safety advice.
 
borjis said:
I often see advice from various members on this forum telling people with vinyl liners they need not worry about calcium, this
is incorrect if you have a heater.

Check the owners manual for your heat pump and see what they recommend for calcium levels. (usually just above 200 ppm)

EDIT: I checked the manual for the XL pump of your brand and no calcium or other recommended chemical levels appear
unlike other heat pump mfgs...I would contact them directly for that info.


ALL heaters need a proper calcium level to avoid leaching from the heat exchanger / coils. If it isn't followed the warranty is no good.
Click to expand...

Why would calcium matter to a copper or nickel heat exchanger?
 
borjis said:
I often see advice from various members on this forum telling people with vinyl liners they need not worry about calcium, this
is incorrect if you have a heater.

Check the owners manual for your heat pump and see what they recommend for calcium levels. (usually just above 200 ppm)

EDIT: I checked the manual for the XL pump of your brand and no calcium or other recommended chemical levels appear
unlike other heat pump mfgs...I would contact them directly for that info.


ALL heaters need a proper calcium level to avoid leaching from the heat exchanger / coils. If it isn't followed the warranty is no good.
Click to expand...
This thread, What does Calcium Hardness really do?, clears up any confusion. Calcium is not required.
 

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