Trouble with CYA

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M

Mypool12

0
May 20, 2017
46
Central New Jersey
Pool Size
25000
Surface
Vinyl
Chlorine
Liquid Chlorine
I have had a pool for a few years and I have always relied on the pool stores. Last year, in the beginning of the season, I brought my water in to be tested and the pool tech said I had no CYA in the pool. They instructed me to put in quite a bit of it and I did. Turns out, I had CYA in the pool, it just didn’t show up because my water temperature was too cold (I think). I added the suggested amount and then had a CYA reading of 140ish. I was so annoyed that I went online seeking answers. I decided to buy a TF 100 pool kit after finding this website. I dealt with the high CYA until the end of the season. At the end of the season, I drained the pool to the floor of the shallow end of the pool (4ft of water). The deep end of my kidney shaped pool is approximately 8 ft.

At the beginning of this season, I drained an additional 1 & ½ feet of water. I tried to get a CYA test and got a zero reading. I went to two different pool stores and got different readings. One store had a reading of 10ppm and the other 1ppm. I do not trust the pool stores and wasn’t sure how I can get an accurate reading if the water is still in the mid 60s. I am afraid to make the same mistake as last year with the CYA. It doesn’t seem like I let out enough pool water to have a reading of 0-10. Does the temperature of the water alter the tests?

On Saturday evening, I put 12 bags of ProTeam Magic AC Superoxidizer into the pool. The ProTeam Magic AC Superoxidizer worked last years. As of today, Monday morning, I have the following readings:

FC: 7.5
CC: 0
PH: 7.4
Alk: 130

Thank you in advance for your help.

Tom
 
Hi Tom and welcome to the forum. :wave: So right now you're seeing a "zero" CYA result form your own testing correct? We'll just ignore the pool store tests. :wink: The CYA test can be effected when the water temp is chilly - about 60 or below. So if your water is cold, bring it indoors to warm up a bit, then go back out under the sun for a viewing test. The tough and really "unknown" part of this scenario is not knowing what your true CYA was last season before your got your TF-100. Pool store CYA tests are so whacky, that it could've been higher or lower. But let's assume it was 140 last fall, then you drained let's say about 50-60%. That would bring the CYA down as low as 60 I would think. It's also possible to lose a few ppm each month, so after 4-5 month you could've lost another 20-30 ppm perhaps. Take into account and winter-specific degradation of stabilizer, and it could've dropped more. So by now your CYA could be at 30 or below. My example leaves a lot of room for "what-ifs", but I think you can see where due to some unknowns, your CYA may have really plunged quite low.

The main point here is to start fresh, and if you're cautious, that's understandable. So instead of dosing your pool with stabilizer for a large goal (let's say 40 for example), start lower and only dose for a CYA of 20 and see where that gets you. Your FC level is quite strong right now, and if you had no CYA at all, I would expect that FC to get burned-off by the sun very, very rapidly. So perhaps you have "some" CYA remaining.

Try this:
CYA Testing:
Proper lighting is critical for the CYA test, so you want to test for CYA outside on a bright sunny day. Use the mixing bottle to gently mix the required amounts of pool water and R-0013 reagent, let sit for 30 seconds, then gently mix again. Recommend standing outside with your back to the sun and the view tube in the shade of your body at waist level. Then, begin squirting the mixed solution into the skinny tube. Watch the black dot until it completely disappears. Once it disappears, record the CYA reading. To help the eyes and prevent staring at the dot, some people find it better to pour & view in stages. Pour some solution into the viewing tube, look away, then look back again for the dot. Repeat as necessary until you feel the dot is gone. After the first CYA test, you can pour the mixed solution from the skinny view tube back to the mixing bottle, gently shake, and do the same test a second, third, or fourth time to instill consistency in your technique, become more comfortable with the testing, and validate your own CYA reading. If you are still struggling with this test, have a friend do it as well, but keep your results separate until the end as to not influence one another.
Click to expand...
Give that a shot and let us know if that helps.
 
As Texas splash suggested, allow the sample to warm up as it does change the test results. I would do as he suggests and see what your results are. It would be surprising if you were able to exchange that much water. Only other thing would be ammonia consuming the CYA.
 
I did not have a reading last night when I tested for CYA. I put a pound of CYA in a sock and put it in my skimmer basket last night and ran the filter all night. I just checked CYA this morning and I still do not have a reading. I know I am going light on the CYA but I just don't want a repeat of last year. I also read on the site that CYA might take a few days to show up on the measurements. I squeezed the sock this morning and there was still quite a bit in there. I suppose I shouldn't be surprised with the result.

Any thoughts?
 
Yes, the sock has to dissolve completely for the CYA to get in the water. If you are afraid of overshooting you can aim for 75% of your target, and then test and adjust as needed. If you only add a pound, that would raise your CYA 3.6 which wouldn't be detectable. You are looking at 8lb total if you are trying to get to 30. Add 6lbs and retest if you want to be safe.

Edit: When I add CYA I like to get in the pool and swing the sock around squeezing it. This makes the sock dissolve much faster, as in a couple of minutes. If it's too cold to get in the pool I'll do it in the skimmer.
 
I am laughing with you as having spent 6 years prior to TFP with a horrible pool ownership experience I too "knew" that all my woe's were caused by my mis-use of CYA based products (Pucks in our case).

Then we get this knowledge and we swear we will not repeat. Well last year was my first year with a TFP pool and like you, I was cautious about adding my CYA, but what I learned from my own experience and looking back on what was likely my case in the previous years.

My CYA today at 30 or if I overshoot to 40 is a Galaxy away from a CYA of 50-60-70 AND you/we have the CYA/FC chart to compensate for this now which tells us, IF we do overshoot, we just adjust our Chlorine usage up accordingly and we STILL AVOID cloudy or worse outcomes.

Do not be shy of CYA as it is an ally to our valuable chlorine. Just know and understand what products to use and not use for your situation.

Knowing this alone for me personally was 90% of my solution and my pool was the best it has ever looked for the ENTIRE season.

I wish for you the same wonderful TFP experience we had last year and are looking forward to already this year.

Cheers


Mypool12 said:
I did not have a reading last night when I tested for CYA. I put a pound of CYA in a sock and put it in my skimmer basket last night and ran the filter all night. I just checked CYA this morning and I still do not have a reading. I know I am going light on the CYA but I just don't want a repeat of last year. I also read on the site that CYA might take a few days to show up on the measurements. I squeezed the sock this morning and there was still quite a bit in there. I suppose I shouldn't be surprised with the result.

Any thoughts?
Click to expand...
 
wow, I had no idea CYA testing was affected by cold water. I hope I didn't add too much then, my water is freezing right now.
 

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I finally got my CYA up to 30. I took my time doing it but I didn't want to overshoot my mark.
FC: 4ppm
CC: .5
PH: 7.2
ALK: 125
CYA: 30

My pool looks clear but with a greenish tint to it. I am going to SLAM the pool tonight for the first time and I had a question for you. When I use the pool math calculator, it suggests I bring the FC from 4 to 12. The calculator suggests 338 oz of 10% Liquid Chlorine in 1 gallon containers. This is the level that I need to try and maintain for a few days. Is this correct?

I am unsure of when I would know I am successful and can bring the chlorine level down to a safer level.

Thank you for your help.
 
Mypool12 said:
I finally got my CYA up to 30. I took my time doing it but I didn't want to overshoot my mark.
FC: 4ppm
CC: .5
PH: 7.2
ALK: 125
CYA: 30

My pool looks clear but with a greenish tint to it. I am going to SLAM the pool tonight for the first time and I had a question for you. When I use the pool math calculator, it suggests I bring the FC from 4 to 12. The calculator suggests 338 oz of 10% Liquid Chlorine in 1 gallon containers. This is the level that I need to try and maintain for a few days. Is this correct?

I am unsure of when I would know I am successful and can bring the chlorine level down to a safer level.

Thank you for your help.
Click to expand...

You will come out of SLAM Process when you pass Overnight Chlorine Loss Test and not before. It is the formula to a Trouble Free Pool.

Keep asking questions, everyone is here to help,

Cheers,
 
I think the CYA test is the most subjective of all. I performed the test as it is quoted above by Texas Splash, that seems to work the best for me. This is my first year using the TFPC methodology and am convinced after 3 or 4 days of SLAMming in the early part of May it is the way to go. I actually got liquid shock from the pool store (really the only reason to visit one nowadays) for $5 a gallon, 12.50%. I went through about 8 cases of bleach, but got the FC into the 20s and maintained there for 3 or 4 days. My pool looks clearer now than it ever has so I am convinced the methodology works. I can tell you that you have to persevere and when you think you can't add any more bleach, you will be adding more bleach. It has been about 2 weeks since the completion of my SLAM and my last results were FC 10, CC 0, so it has taken two weeks for my FC to trickle down from the 20s to 10. I have a solar cover as well which helps a great deal with the burn-off, I was only losing 1ppm of FC over 24 hours for a week and a half until the rain started. Now my pool is overfilled and the chlorine is getting down to a level where I can kick on the SWCG and let that maintain the FC levels. Also I found the CYA you can purchase on Ebay other members have posted for $40 for a 25lb bag to be far and away the best deal. Good luck!
 
I am now in the process of doing my first slam. Pool math suggested that I add 338oz of 10% bleach. I added 3 full gallons (384oz) tonight. If my levels drop too much, should I add more in the morning or do I wait until the next evening. Sorry if it sounds like a dumb question but I just want to make sure. I am assuming that I should add more chlorine during the day.

FC: 4ppm
CC: .5
PH: 7.2
ALK: 125
CYA: 30

Thank you.
 
If my levels drop too much, should I add more in the morning or do I wait until the next evening.
Click to expand...
Now that you are starting a SLAM, you want to maintain that FC of "12" as much as you can all day long. If you leave for work or something, sure, it may drop, so just increase it when you get back. But try to keep it at 12 as much as you can. Good luck!
 
Mypool12 said:
I finally got my CYA up to 30. I took my time doing it but I didn't want to overshoot my mark.
...
I am unsure of when I would know I am successful and can bring the chlorine level down to a safer level
Click to expand...
The SLAM Process is successful when your final test (close to dark) of FC is the same or within 1 of your (at first light) morning FC test

I wanted to add that your pool water is "safe" for swimming IF it's clear and the FC level is between the maintenance and shock level for your CyA level
 

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