The Mess Is Now Plastered!

[Dirk]

Oh wow. That's going to be amazing. Very nice pool, and I absolutely love that backdrop of trees. The last pic was very small, but I like that edge tile color, if that's what I was looking at. Keep the pics coming as you make progress. Good luck with the PB...

 

[ald2002]

Oh wow. That's going to be amazing. Very nice pool, and I absolutely love that backdrop of trees. The last pic was very small, but I like that edge tile color, if that's what I was looking at. Keep the pics coming as you make progress. Good luck with the PB...

Thank you! Not have luck at all. Nearly in tears. Sales is arguing with me about travertine coping. I guess the customer isn’t right with this PB.

 

[Dirk]

Post pics of what you are having an issue with. Maybe we can give you some ammo. I warned you about push back. Some contractors (or their flunky staff) will push back, whether they think they're in the right or not, just to see if they can get you to back down.* Gather yourself, then push right back (if you know you're being reasonable). That might be what we can help with, if we can see what you're dealing with. A consensus about the issue might help with your confidence.

* I just went through this. Contractor was adamant, and wrong. He's now got a judgment against him to pay me for the fix. So I do talk a lot, but I walk the walk, too.

 

[ald2002]

Post pics of what you are having an issue with. Maybe we can give you some ammo. I warned you about push back. Some contractors (or their flunky staff) will push back, whether they think they're in the right or not, just to see if they can get you to back down.* Gather yourself, then push right back (if you know you're being reasonable). That might be what we can help with, if we can see what you're dealing with. A consensus about the issue might help with your confidence.

* I just went through this. Contractor was adamant, and wrong. He's now got a judgment against him to pay me for the fix. So I do talk a lot, but I walk the walk, too.

I explained on another thread. I will write more later. I called the owner!! She is ordering me brand new top grade travertine coping. I also told the owner to assign me a new sales person. Done. Finished.

 

[Dirk]

I've created a monster!!

Glad to hear you're getting a satisfactory resolution!

 

[ald2002]

I've created a monster!!

Glad to hear you're getting a satisfactory resolution!

Lol! Partly, yes. I am treating this like a business deal. Makes it much easier to manage. Long story short. I received 2 bad batches of silver travertine. It happens. Sales guy didn’t want to help and didn’t offer a solution. It’s a long story - see pictures of the travertine. I get there is variant in color but there is also an acceptable range. This was not acceptable.

 

[Dirk]

So if your materials have a tendency to vary like that, this is what you're going to need to do with the next batch (pardon if you're already planning this, ha, or if I already wrote this in your thread). Arrange to spend some time with the next delivery before the tile guys get to it. You might want to order extra, based on the potential range of variance in the material. You go through every box, every tile, and set aside (as in: hide) any tile you cannot live with. This is why you might want extra. The fussier you want to be, the more extra you get. Then physically place all the tile where you want it. (Or talk the tile guy into doing so, with you managing that, if you can't do this yourself.) Arrange the tiles to fit your aesthetic sense. Arrange the subtle color differences to your liking, so that no odd patterns or blocks of colors emerge. Place borderline tiles (because of color or finish) on the side or end of the pool where they'll be least noticeable. Conversely, put the "specials" in a location where you'll be able to admire them. All this done before the first one gets mortared in.

Discuss with the installer how you want the miters to go. It may end up you have to have a partial-length tile somewhere. If they won't shave each tile so that doesn't have to happen, then decide where that odd one is going to go (usually in the middle of the run, but I'd push for shaving tiles to eliminate it). Be prepared for a discussion about an up-charge. That wouldn't be unreasonable if your level of pickiness is costing them a lot of extra labor hours.

There's even the possibility that the PB and/or the tile guy will appreciate this extra effort from you, because it will alleviate from them the responsibility of pleasing you and having to do work twice. I placed my own step markers when I had them redone. I rejected a bunch, and sat on the deck as the tile guy tried them out position-wise, and gave him a yay or nay for each piece. I got a sense he was just as happy letting me make the decisions, but frankly, I wouldn't have cared if he wasn't.

 

[ald2002]

So if your materials have a tendency to vary like that, this is what you're going to need to do with the next batch (pardon if you're already planning this, ha, or if I already wrote this in your thread). Arrange to spend some time with the next delivery before the tile guys get to it. You might want to order extra, based on the potential range of variance in the material. You go through every box, every tile, and set aside (as in: hide) any tile you cannot live with. This is why you might want extra. The fussier you want to be, the more extra you get. Then physically place all the tile where you want it. (Or talk the tile guy into doing so, with you managing that, if you can't do this yourself.) Arrange the tiles to fit your aesthetic sense. Arrange the subtle color differences to your liking, so that no odd patterns or blocks of colors emerge. Place borderline tiles (because of color or finish) on the side or end of the pool where they'll be least noticeable. Conversely, put the "specials" in a location where you'll be able to admire them. All this done before the first one gets mortared in.

Discuss with the installer how you want the miters to go. It may end up you have to have a partial-length tile somewhere. If they won't shave each tile so that doesn't have to happen, then decide where that odd one is going to go (usually in the middle of the run, but I'd push for shaving tiles to eliminate it). Be prepared for a discussion about an up-charge. That wouldn't be unreasonable if your level of pickiness is costing them a lot of extra labor hours.

There's even the possibility that the PB and/or the tile guy will appreciate this extra effort from you, because it will alleviate from them the responsibility of pleasing you and having to do work twice. I placed my own step markers when I had them redone. I rejected a bunch, and sat on the deck as the tile guy tried them out position-wise, and gave him a yay or nay for each piece. I got a sense he was just as happy letting me make the decisions, but frankly, I wouldn't have cared if he wasn't.

Thank you and I appreciate your suggestions. I’ve saved your feedback so I can better organize the placement of the coping. I am not sure how the mason plans to cut the travertine. I will find out. The owner is ordering from another supplier with a top grade product. Hoping I won’t have another issue. If I do, I will roll with punches so long as I have support from my PB.

 

[pudisgreat]

Ugh. I can see the dilemma. I am having a similar issue with locating a flagstone I like. I love the look of travertine, but I wanted to stick with stone because I have so much of it in my yard already and I've had issues with moles and wanted something that could live on top of a concrete slab.
When I finally determined the color I wanted, I couldn't find enough pallets because even in the same family (all NC Chocolate Grey) there was huge variation. They ranged so much, that I will be going to the third stone place to try to locate additional pallets. I know I'm a bit crazy, but it is such a huge undertaking and my first frivolous purchase that I want it to look as nice possible. I asked the sales guy at the stone place, if I was nuts compared to most of the people he had come in and he said I was in line with most homeowners. But, that the builders just call in the color and take what is delivered. What a crazy world. I wanted to be able to see them ahead of time to make sure I was getting what I wanted. I also spent weeks trying to decide on my pebble sheen color too and found a lot of local pool owners via Nextdoor that let me come see their pools in person.
All in all, get what you want, it is too big a purchase to settle.

 

[Dirk]

I've often advised folks to try and see their pool finish color in person, in a pool, and throughout the day and evening, rather than relying on swatches at the PB's office. But I couldn't ever suggest a good way to do that, other than asking the PB to help them see some of his finished pools. Nextdoor! Of course!! What a great idea (and I'm on Nextdoor, but never thought to use it that way). Of course other pool owners would cooperate if asked. I would. We all went through the same challenge of picking colors blind, we'd all want to help the "new guy."

 

[ald2002]

Ugh. I can see the dilemma. I am having a similar issue with locating a flagstone I like. I love the look of travertine, but I wanted to stick with stone because I have so much of it in my yard already and I've had issues with moles and wanted something that could live on top of a concrete slab.
When I finally determined the color I wanted, I couldn't find enough pallets because even in the same family (all NC Chocolate Grey) there was huge variation. They ranged so much, that I will be going to the third stone place to try to locate additional pallets. I know I'm a bit crazy, but it is such a huge undertaking and my first frivolous purchase that I want it to look as nice possible. I asked the sales guy at the stone place, if I was nuts compared to most of the people he had come in and he said I was in line with most homeowners. But, that the builders just call in the color and take what is delivered. What a crazy world. I wanted to be able to see them ahead of time to make sure I was getting what I wanted. I also spent weeks trying to decide on my pebble sheen color too and found a lot of local pool owners via Nextdoor that let me come see their pools in person.
All in all, get what you want, it is too big a purchase to settle.

The builder thinks I am nuts! I went through each piece of travertine. The PM and another leader from the PB helped me. I am SUPER picky. We are going to look at the coping for years so it needs to be right!

 

[Dirk]

Nuts!?! What's nuts is charging $50-150K for a pool and deck and criticizing the customer for wanting it to look nicer than a driveway!! And giving him looks for doing the job that he's supposed to be doing!! Argh! Why'yhy'aughta... You want me to talk with him? I'll talk with him. Give me his number. I'll call him! I'll call him right now!!

 

[Whiskeyfox]

This is why I went with the tumbled marble. Muuuch less variance than the silver travertine that often has brown in random pieces. Well worth the $2-3 per piece upgrade I think it cost me maybe $300 extra

 

[ald2002]

This is why I went with the tumbled marble. Muuuch less variance than the silver travertine that often has brown in random pieces. Well worth the $2-3 per piece upgrade I think it cost me maybe $300 extra

Thanks! Smart move!

 

[ald2002]

Ugh. I can see the dilemma. I am having a similar issue with locating a flagstone I like. I love the look of travertine, but I wanted to stick with stone because I have so much of it in my yard already and I've had issues with moles and wanted something that could live on top of a concrete slab.
When I finally determined the color I wanted, I couldn't find enough pallets because even in the same family (all NC Chocolate Grey) there was huge variation. They ranged so much, that I will be going to the third stone place to try to locate additional pallets. I know I'm a bit crazy, but it is such a huge undertaking and my first frivolous purchase that I want it to look as nice possible. I asked the sales guy at the stone place, if I was nuts compared to most of the people he had come in and he said I was in line with most homeowners. But, that the builders just call in the color and take what is delivered. What a crazy world. I wanted to be able to see them ahead of time to make sure I was getting what I wanted. I also spent weeks trying to decide on my pebble sheen color too and found a lot of local pool owners via Nextdoor that let me come see their pools in person.
All in all, get what you want, it is too big a purchase to settle.

You’re not crazy! What pebble sheen did you pick? I picked blue surf. You can swing by to see when it’s done.

 

[ald2002]

Nuts!?! What's nuts is charging $50-150K for a pool and deck and criticizing the customer for wanting it to look nicer than a driveway!! And giving him looks for doing the job that he's supposed to be doing!! Argh! Why'yhy'aughta... You want me to talk with him? I'll talk with him. Give me his number. I'll call him! I'll call him right now!!

Thanks for validating!

 

[pudisgreat]

You’re not crazy! What pebble sheen did you pick? I picked blue surf. You can swing by to see when it’s done.

Blue Surf too...or Blue Smurf as some on here call it.

 

[Zeberifo]

One crew left all their trash. The others cleaned up. I made a point to tell the pool company about this. Complain, complain, complain became my tune. Recently while planting grass, I found a fork, lunch container and coffee container. Absolutely right about the yard being trashed. And I kept my dig dirt to help with some sloping issues. Had to rent a Bobcat to make it look decent. Planted grass about two times and may need a third (apparently I suck at this). Had to buildup grade under the fence to meet code. That took a while and apparently was my job. Oh well. Here’s to a glorious 2021!

 

[Skiddy]

So far my sub-contractors have picked up all their garbage at the end of the job they are doing. Each crew before they wrapped up took the trash with them. The back yard still looks post apocalypse but as long as the finished product is good I don't really care.
If there are any special emails or text messages to speed the process up please do share those Dirk.
I signed the contract in June and they just buried the pipes.

 

[Dirk]

I don't have any specific messages to share. Refer to the post I wrote about stating your expectations clearly. That's the guide, you supply the details, based on what those expectations are, and from whom you're expecting them.