Serious help needed
- Thread starter richardc
- Start date
The green has been there a long time, I believe Swampwoman is aware as well and a few comments she made leads me to believe she is looking ahead, BUT with all the crud that is still in the pool, it would indicate algae is still at work and that is the 1st priority, once that is resolved. we can move to other matters. My pool sat between 3-5 years depending on who I talk to. When my water turned blue but I still had black growth on the side that acted like algae you could see it slough off, I kept scrubbing and it did come off and fairly quickly.
The sand still may be a problem and good to take note of but you are doing the correct thing for now.
The sand still may be a problem and good to take note of but you are doing the correct thing for now.
Good call on the CYA, it's under 20! I have old Dichlor, and Calcium Hypochlorite in the house. i would rather use this material then purchase more stabilizer. What do you think? Thanks for your help!
Calcium hydrochloride will increase calcium and will not impact cya. You can use the dichlorvos but don't use too much as it will drop your ph which you can't test for right now because your fc is too high.
It is safer to use solid or liquid cya/stabilizer/conditioner because you know it won't impact your ph.
I used some dichlor but it did not readily dissolve. My recollection is that when sprinkled in the water the chemical rapidly dissolved? I must note that this container of previosly opened dichlor is likely over 5 years old. How should it behave/ thank you
This is a super long thread. This may have been answered.....
Why wouldn't the advise be to drain the pool, have the high school guys scrape out all the debris and start fresh?
Why wouldn't the advise be to drain the pool, have the high school guys scrape out all the debris and start fresh?
Interesting: for about 3 hours I have not lost any FC. I doubt it means anything but FC has been somewhat stable since I used some old Dichlor in the pool. In any event, I'll see what the reading is in the morning.
Also today, I re-vacuumed the shallow end finding areas that either I missed or stuff re-settled. If the latter, then its fasinating because the "missed" debris was in the exact area that contained the major concentartion that I hit yesterday. I also vacuumed some areas of the mid and deep ends "blind". Earlier today, I was able to vacuum debris that was lodged in the curve between the wall and bottom of one side to the mid-deep end. The manual vacuum had a tough time dealing with the curved bottom, but it appears that most has been expelled. I saw no other concentrations at other locations throughout the pool. However, my inspection revealed quite a bit of growing, and I think dead algae on the far side of the mid, and deep ends. It was located on the sides of the pool about 6-24 inches down. The matter showed a dark green, milky white, and grayish type slippery slime. All of these concentrations were adjacent to one another. They were removed using a fabric pool brush without an attached pole. Later on, I reattached the pole and heavily brushed the sides. As the day wore on, I attempted to use my Barracuda G3 with varied success. At times it worked great, while at other instances it stalled, or locked up the filter. After this limited sucess, I decided to attach it to the deep end skimmer, but it immediately locked up the filter. Ok, so no go with the Barracuda.
I'm not sure where to go from here. Either I need more stabilizer or dichlor. What are your opinions?
Also today, I re-vacuumed the shallow end finding areas that either I missed or stuff re-settled. If the latter, then its fasinating because the "missed" debris was in the exact area that contained the major concentartion that I hit yesterday. I also vacuumed some areas of the mid and deep ends "blind". Earlier today, I was able to vacuum debris that was lodged in the curve between the wall and bottom of one side to the mid-deep end. The manual vacuum had a tough time dealing with the curved bottom, but it appears that most has been expelled. I saw no other concentrations at other locations throughout the pool. However, my inspection revealed quite a bit of growing, and I think dead algae on the far side of the mid, and deep ends. It was located on the sides of the pool about 6-24 inches down. The matter showed a dark green, milky white, and grayish type slippery slime. All of these concentrations were adjacent to one another. They were removed using a fabric pool brush without an attached pole. Later on, I reattached the pole and heavily brushed the sides. As the day wore on, I attempted to use my Barracuda G3 with varied success. At times it worked great, while at other instances it stalled, or locked up the filter. After this limited sucess, I decided to attach it to the deep end skimmer, but it immediately locked up the filter. Ok, so no go with the Barracuda.
I'm not sure where to go from here. Either I need more stabilizer or dichlor. What are your opinions?
Yes, Its been answered. I am well beyong the 'shoveling" out stage. I believe I passed that milestone before I started the SLAM on July 2nd. However, I did find some liquified goop that I believe has now been vacuumed out. Mind you, I cannot see the floor of the deep end, but shallow areas can be visualized. I"m certain there must be some forms of algae hidden on the mid-deep bottom that is causing my trouble.
I am very frustrated and have not dismissed exploring partial drain options. However, I am leary of a partial drain because i would have to be able to thoroughly brush/wash/ clean all areas of the pool, and I'm not sure I would be able to visualize everything. Make sense?
Richard. I feel like you departed from the "let it settle until the top clears" plan by brushing, dropping a barracuda in, and tinkering with the deep end before you could clearly observe the drifts. etc.
If you're simply choosing a different route than the one that I'd advised, that's fine, I'm happy to circle back when the water is clear to help you address the metals.
And again, perhaps with Summer heat you'll simply wouldn't get the results I did my way when the water and air temps were colder.
But if you WERE trying to get visibility in the deep end and do a single, comprehensive vac to waste, the putting the barracuda in or otherwise disturbing the depths was counterproductive until you can see clearly enough to get the majority of it. And if the water is still cloudy, more debris will keep settling.
In other notes:
- Your picture certainly looks like incorrect or otherwise altered sand to me, and it does not look like mustard algae. I think PA girl is right. In which case, letting it settle is paramount.
- Your water may be green from oxidized metals which you cannot clear until your slam is finished. We will only be able to dx that remotely by you passing the Overnight Chlorine Loss Test and still having green tint or clearing the cloudiness and still having the green tint.
- RE SLAM level... the tile line of your liner is already fading from presumably before you started using the more modest TFP slam levels. Every time you exceed mustard shock level, you're risking your liner. Its your call to go higher, and it is your liner, but we cannot recommend it in good faith and risk the unintended consequence of damaging your liner. This has been consistently expressed by multiple posters so please don't ask us to make that kind of recommendation. It would not be ethical of us to do so.
Lastly, I don't have a good meter to measure this by now with the water action today, but if clarity does not dramatically improve by say the weekend, you may wish to consider using your shop vac to remove your new sand to carefully check/inspect the laterals for cracks or a loose fit from when you changed the sand. I believe INYO pools as a "how to" video on this if you need to look it up. Because it HAS been clearing, albeit slowly, I'm inclined to this this may be unnecessary.
Cheers to clear
If you're simply choosing a different route than the one that I'd advised, that's fine, I'm happy to circle back when the water is clear to help you address the metals.
And again, perhaps with Summer heat you'll simply wouldn't get the results I did my way when the water and air temps were colder.
But if you WERE trying to get visibility in the deep end and do a single, comprehensive vac to waste, the putting the barracuda in or otherwise disturbing the depths was counterproductive until you can see clearly enough to get the majority of it. And if the water is still cloudy, more debris will keep settling.
In other notes:
- Your picture certainly looks like incorrect or otherwise altered sand to me, and it does not look like mustard algae. I think PA girl is right. In which case, letting it settle is paramount.
- Your water may be green from oxidized metals which you cannot clear until your slam is finished. We will only be able to dx that remotely by you passing the Overnight Chlorine Loss Test and still having green tint or clearing the cloudiness and still having the green tint.
- RE SLAM level... the tile line of your liner is already fading from presumably before you started using the more modest TFP slam levels. Every time you exceed mustard shock level, you're risking your liner. Its your call to go higher, and it is your liner, but we cannot recommend it in good faith and risk the unintended consequence of damaging your liner. This has been consistently expressed by multiple posters so please don't ask us to make that kind of recommendation. It would not be ethical of us to do so.
Lastly, I don't have a good meter to measure this by now with the water action today, but if clarity does not dramatically improve by say the weekend, you may wish to consider using your shop vac to remove your new sand to carefully check/inspect the laterals for cracks or a loose fit from when you changed the sand. I believe INYO pools as a "how to" video on this if you need to look it up. Because it HAS been clearing, albeit slowly, I'm inclined to this this may be unnecessary.
Cheers to clear
Richard I’ve been following along. I am impressed with you following SW directions. She won’t stear you wrong. Only thing is go down to Walmart and pick up some stabilizer
Arizoniann
Active member
Philo
Richard has a vinyl liner and as such, even if his water table was low enough that he could empty his pool without floating or caving it in, a complete drain is very risky. The first problem with vinyl liner is if you drain to less than 1' in shallow end you run the significant risk of getting wrinkles that will not come out. The second is an old liner could shrink and crack. Water replacement could have been done using the "Sheet method" or "Tarp Method" but that would not get the stuff out that he is working on, so in the long run not sure it would have helped much. This surely is a difficult case, but a very interesting one from which we all can learn, or at least me.
Richard has a vinyl liner and as such, even if his water table was low enough that he could empty his pool without floating or caving it in, a complete drain is very risky. The first problem with vinyl liner is if you drain to less than 1' in shallow end you run the significant risk of getting wrinkles that will not come out. The second is an old liner could shrink and crack. Water replacement could have been done using the "Sheet method" or "Tarp Method" but that would not get the stuff out that he is working on, so in the long run not sure it would have helped much. This surely is a difficult case, but a very interesting one from which we all can learn, or at least me.
Richard. I feel like you departed from the "let it settle until the top clears" plan by brushing, dropping a barracuda in, and tinkering with the deep end before you could clearly observe the drifts. etc.
If you're simply choosing a different route than the one that I'd advised, that's fine, I'm happy to circle back when the water is clear to help you address the metals.
And again, perhaps with Summer heat you'll simply wouldn't get the results I did my way when the water and air temps were colder.
But if you WERE trying to get visibility in the deep end and do a single, comprehensive vac to waste, the putting the barracuda in or otherwise disturbing the depths was counterproductive until you can see clearly enough to get the majority of it. And if the water is still cloudy, more debris will keep settling.
In other notes:
- Your picture certainly looks like incorrect or otherwise altered sand to me, and it does not look like mustard algae. I think PA girl is right. In which case, letting it settle is paramount.
- Your water may be green from oxidized metals which you cannot clear until your slam is finished. We will only be able to dx that remotely by you passing the Overnight Chlorine Loss Test and still having green tint or clearing the cloudiness and still having the green tint.
- RE SLAM level... the tile line of your liner is already fading from presumably before you started using the more modest TFP slam levels. Every time you exceed mustard shock level, you're risking your liner. Its your call to go higher, and it is your liner, but we cannot recommend it in good faith and risk the unintended consequence of damaging your liner. This has been consistently expressed by multiple posters so please don't ask us to make that kind of recommendation. It would not be ethical of us to do so.
Lastly, I don't have a good meter to measure this by now with the water action today, but if clarity does not dramatically improve by say the weekend, you may wish to consider using your shop vac to remove your new sand to carefully check/inspect the laterals for cracks or a loose fit from when you changed the sand. I believe INYO pools as a "how to" video on this if you need to look it up. Because it HAS been clearing, albeit slowly, I'm inclined to this this may be unnecessary.
Cheers to clear
The sand like material was there before the sand change. I also noticed it when my pool guy vacuumed with his stand alone pump to waste. So this was something that was in the pool. I have no idea how that happened. I did at least two sock tests on the return lines, and nothing of that sort was found. I did have some "specks" of dirt/debris (see the above sock pictures)found in the socks.
I'm so frustrated i don't know what to do. When I saw the debris on the mid-deep areas I thought it would be wise to get rid of it. Others, also suggested vacuuming the deep end? Gees, I am a novice at this, albeit a frustrated one.
At the rate that the pool is clearing it will be days, if not a few weeks before things are somewhat clear.I just don't what to do...help!!!
(The fading on the liner has been there...it's not new)
My CYA is low, do you recommend stabilizer, or using the dichlor I have from days of old in my house?
Test results at 645 AM CST, July 18th
FC 15.5 *
CC 1.0
CYA 22
FC drop over night at .5 PPM
FC 15.5 *
CC 1.0
CYA 22
FC drop over night at .5 PPM
I have noticed that since late yesterday afternoon, my FC numbers have been more stable. This may not mean anything, but it does coincide with my re-vacuuming, and brushing the pool? The most surprising thing, to me, was the discovery of what was obviously live algae on the far side of the pool. At last from a visible perspective, that was the only area(s) where I noticed same. It was 'living" adjacent to this "milky white" substance that must have been oxidized algae, and a gray slippery stuff that just looked like dirt.
Also, the shallow end needed re-vacuuming. There were spots that re-appeared in the exact areas that were targeted a day earlier! Stuff either re-settled, or I am half-blind. Probally a little of both !! In any event i am confident that all has been removed from the shallow end.
I will follow Swampwoman's advice, and see if things settle before proceeding with further stirring up activity. I'll also watch my FC levels during the day.
Onward!
Also, the shallow end needed re-vacuuming. There were spots that re-appeared in the exact areas that were targeted a day earlier! Stuff either re-settled, or I am half-blind. Probally a little of both !! In any event i am confident that all has been removed from the shallow end.
I will follow Swampwoman's advice, and see if things settle before proceeding with further stirring up activity. I'll also watch my FC levels during the day.
Onward!
Hi richard,
I am sorry I gave you a bit of a bum steer on the vacuuming the deep end and the robot, I thought that while you were getting the shallow end and disturbing the water it would not make much of a difference to do deep end as well. But I would go back to Swampwoman's method as she has much more experience, I can imagine how frustrating this is, I only dealt with it for a week after adopting TFPs methods. But for 2-3 weeks before that while getting "pool $tore $chooled" I almost bulldozed the pool in, would have if it had not cost so much to do, I am glad now I did not do that.
I am sorry I gave you a bit of a bum steer on the vacuuming the deep end and the robot, I thought that while you were getting the shallow end and disturbing the water it would not make much of a difference to do deep end as well. But I would go back to Swampwoman's method as she has much more experience, I can imagine how frustrating this is, I only dealt with it for a week after adopting TFPs methods. But for 2-3 weeks before that while getting "pool $tore $chooled" I almost bulldozed the pool in, would have if it had not cost so much to do, I am glad now I did not do that.
This is very good news (reduced FC during the day and low OCLT). It shows that the amount of algae has been greatly reduced! You have come a long way!
The color of the water is now more of blue/grey which matches the lower FC consumption. Photos of the stairs will really show the progress on clarity.
The DE you have been adding will definitely help filter out the dead algae carcasses.
The color of the water is now more of blue/grey which matches the lower FC consumption. Photos of the stairs will really show the progress on clarity.
The DE you have been adding will definitely help filter out the dead algae carcasses.