Reverse Osmosis

[trickle]

This is just a practice drill, for what's to come. Reverse Osmosis trailer will be coming over on Saturday. Maybe 3 days later after the recycle and refill of lost water, I'll have one hand on the panic button, the colorful Taylor K2006 Fas-DPD kit opened up, and the other hand punching the Total Free Pool Link shortcut for help because dialing 911 will not do me any good.

It is a good break point to get rid of my pool guy. I really do like him, but I don't want to put any more of his kids through college. I have shadowed the guy and performed most of the tests periodically. Pretty much chlorine, muriatic acid, chlorine muriatic acid, repeat, week after week. No real test of all that can go wrong, so this will be game changing. I quite frankly do not know the sequence of events to follow, once I take over with I don't know what. I'll get a report of values once the R.O. is complete and a reasonably close estimate of the free form pool size, which has long been a mystery. I'm guessing that when the R.O. readings starts to remain the same, that will be the estimated volume. Not sure how accurate that might be. I used a satellite image and a known reference point of measure to scale off the pool area, took several depth measurements and made the volume calcs from that. 34,000gals+/-, is my figure, making all the necessary deducts for wall radiuses etc. Backed that up with a real world hand measurement. The pool guy has 19,000 gals on file. Somebody's way off, and I don't think it's me. How my guy adjusts the chemistry puzzles me. He plays the long slow game I'm guessing, because I think he's got to be guessing. He's found a pattern that works and he just stays with it. What ever gets it done I suppose, but it'll be mine to deal with soon, and I really want to eliminate the variables and the guess work.

Anyway, when armed with some real data, and real concerns, ...I'll be back!

 

[HermanTX]

Nice looking pool. I like the slide. Is that on a separate pump or part of your main circulation system? Hard to gauge the size but would estimated definitely above 25k gals.
What is the goal to achieve with RO?

 

[Rancho Cost-a-Lotta]

What is the goal to achieve with RO?

Nice pool. Why did you decide to go with reverse osmosis as opposed to a drain/refill? Other than added expense, there is nothing wrong with R.O.

 

[trickle]

The water slide is just piped to the house water supply and a manual valve. It serves as a second but slower refill as well. I'm considering tying the refill piping to the home water softener. Not a big deal to do. The pool was never drained in its 20 years of existence, as far as I know. We've been here for 7 years. Old hard city water continually being added in this 90+ degree arid climate has help make the Calcium Hardness level 1500ppm. Pool TDS are around 3000ppm per a cheap conductivity meter. City water CH is now below 60ppm and TDS is 440ppm per that same meter. Pool water looks clear enough to my uneducated eyes and I can see every detail and flaw on the pool bottom, including the screw type on the floor drains. I don't completely understand high CH, but for the sake of what I cannot see inside the pipes and heater, it is time to bring that number down. This pool is cut into a 5 acre 25% sloped terraced former orange grove. I did not want to disturb the pool shell and test mother nature by changing the load. To drain and refill, I would have done so in maybe 25%-30% drain/refills. Hard to get the Chem numbers down that way when you keep mixing the good water with the bad. No way is cheap, but with that in mind, R.O. was the cheaper route. I'm not sure how it will compare to the City tap water numbers. R.O. gets a lot of hype here on the west coast, where there is this perpetual water shortage. I'm not convinced it is earned where pools are concerned. We will soon see.

 

[Rancho Cost-a-Lotta]

I'm considering tying the refill piping to the home water softener.

This is a great idea if you can make it happen.

This pool is cut into a 5 acre 25% sloped terraced former orange grove. I did not want to disturb the pool shell and test mother nature by changing the load.

I see...good plan.

Another option is a "No drain water exchange." If your interested in learning more, @mknauss can walk you through it.

You didn't mention what form of chlorination has been used. If tablets (trichlor), test your CYA as well. The numbers may be elevated.

I'll have one hand on the panic button, the colorful Taylor K2006 Fas-DPD kit opened up

If you decide to go with the Taylor kit, you'll probably want the K2006C. The "C" means more of the reagents you'll need for frequent testing, a cornerstone of TFP care. The tests kits offered by tftestkits.net offer a better value. Consider a Smart Stir or Taylor Speed Stir for easier and more consistent testing.

If you decide to go the R.O. route, test your own CH level before the trailer leaves. A good CH number to shoot for is 200 ppm. It's a bit lower than TFP recommended levels, but you can adjust TA and pH levels to keep your CSI within range.

Best wishes!

 

[trickle]

This is a great idea if you can make it happen.

I see...good plan.

Another option is a "No drain water exchange." If your interested in learning more, @mknauss can walk you through it.

You didn't mention what form of chlorination has been used. If tablets (trichlor), test your CYA as well. The numbers may be elevated.

If you decide to go with the Taylor kit, you'll probably want the K2006C. The "C" means more of the reagents you'll need for frequent testing, a cornerstone of TFP care. The tests kits offered by tftestkits.net offer a better value. Consider a Smart Stir or Taylor Speed Stir for easier and more consistent testing.

If you decide to go the R.O. route, test your own CH level before the trailer leaves. A good CH number to shoot for is 200 ppm. It's a bit lower than TFP recommended levels, but you can adjust TA and pH levels to keep your CSI within range.

Best wishes!

Thanks everyone for the input. I have the Taylor K2006 FAS DPD kit with the small .75 oz bottles. Since I will now be testing for real and not for practice, I have begun to order the "C" size refills for the chems that are getting low as well as some less frequently used ones that are just getting old. The kit's 13 months old now. Not sure of the seriousness of the those "best by" dates on the bottles. These aren't groceries, so maybe they really mean it. The pool guy has been using liquid Chlorine and Muriatic acid weekly, but in the heat of the summer he will throw in a puck or two in the floating dispenser. The balance has been consistent over the past 4 years, albeit a higher end pH. An occasional sign of algae, but that's me seeing how little I can run the pump and still getting things circulated. I recall the previous pool guy dumping a few pounds of soda ash or similar in, when we first moved in, so the balance was likely quite different at that time. There is a Chlorine dispenser attached to the piping but it isn't used. There is also a "Smart Thing" inline dispenser (physically resembles a salt water gen unit in size and shape) with some supposed magical Blue Haven additive that I have never refilled. There is also a Blue Haven 3 foot long aluminum UV housing mounted on the pool retaining wall with the 1/4" tube running through a small check valve on the pump wet end. Again, never used, if it even still worked at all. I disconnected that last week. I'd like to install a SWCG system, but I am concerned about the Laars Jandy LX 400 copper heat exchanger condition and its suitability for the salty task. It currently works fine with no leaks or any signs of problems but I don't know what the 20 year old copper has been put through in its long life. If the pool remains well balanced, maybe this unit lives on for many more years. Anyone's guess without knowing the history. There is an unconfirmed rumor that the copper tubes for this exchanger are the same part as those of a few other companies. If so, I would pick up a set as spares, and move forward with the SWCG system knowing I have a path out of trouble. One step/problem at a time though. Thanks.

 

[trickle]

The bad news is that the Reverse Osmosis trailer couldn't be brought down my steep 750 foot winding canyon driveway to my home on the slope. So, plan "B" went into effect immediately. Water Softener water into the spa and over flowing into the pool and a submersible pump on the opposite 8 foot deep end pulling water out. 1050ppm out and 75ppm in. Pretty slow, so I brought in 55psi city water at 200 ppm. Concerned that I might be mixing good with bad, a few hours in I shut the supply off and drained out 45% of the water (34" down). That was all the courage I had, so I stopped there and refilled with two city water hoses and the softener water. CH was 550ppm upon refill. Any other day I might have quit there, but I am currently repeating the process and project a CH of 390ppm. I'm thinking that's a real good piece of real estate to claim, no matter whose chart or table I reference. I will rebalance the chemistry from there. Some lengthy research shows that Home Depot has all the preferred chems needed and at full strength. Good luck to me because from here on out, this is uncharted territory. Today or tomorrow, I do need to tell the pool guy that his services are no longer required. That's an unsettling feeling right about now.

 

[Rancho Cost-a-Lotta]

Best of luck. Home Depot's a pretty good place to go for pool supplies. In my area, Home Depot and Lowes carry half strength muriatic acid (14.5%). Pool stores carry full strength MA

 

[trickle]

Best of luck. Home Depot's a pretty good place to go for pool supplies. In my area, Home Depot and Lowes carry half strength muriatic acid (14.5%). Pool stores carry full strength MA

Thanks. Home Depot in southern cal here has full strength HDX store brand Muriatic and Chlorine Liquid. The Sodium Carb and Cyanuric are "Pool Time" brand granules and powder. I grabbed some 20 Mule Team Borax and some Arm & Hammer baking soda for good measure, so whatever trouble presents itself, I'll be able to get into it. I picked it all up this afternoon. Lowes has the weak stuff. I just started refilling the pool at 11:30PM. It should be refilled by noon tomorrow and then the panic begins. I'll check all the levels, and check my notes to see what to do first, and exactly how to add those things. First time for everything. I figure if I add the chems conservatively, I can always add more. Other than that, I don't have a clue what I'm doing. What could go wrong. No. Really. What could go wrong?