Pool equipment installer says heaters never need bypass valve

[xpert66]

Just had a discussion with someone who may be coming out to install my plumbing for my pool equipment which I originally intended to do myself since I am very handy. This is my first pool so I just wanted to be sure. From the great support from the crew at TFP and the many online searches and videos stating adding a bypass valve on a heater is beneficial in more than one way, I want one installed. The installer is insisting there is never a need for them and is refusing to do it. He's insisting I do not know what I am talking about and has proceeded to tell me he has installed over 200 heaters and not one has a bypass valve. My pool will not have an automatic chlorinator and it will be chlorine not salt if that makes a difference. Thanks

 

[ajw22]

Is this your pool or your installers? You have to live with it not him. I use my heater bypass every season during the pool opening while getting the pH adjusted.

If the heater springs a leak, you have to shutdown the pump, which stop waters circulation, filtering and chlorinating your pool. Having the pump stopped too long can lead to algae and a dirty pool, and more work once you get the heater repaired and the pump running again.

With a relatively new pool or heater you may not see a leak for many years and wish you had a heater bypass valve. However you may encounter another situation where bypassing the heater is helpful. Heater cores can be damaged by acidic low pH below 7. Maybe you misjudged your acid addition and accidentally lowered your pH too much. If you have a heater bypass you can turn the valve and stop the acidic water from flowing through the heater.

Or maybe you purposely lower the pH to around 7 to treat a scale problem. You can use the heater bypass valve to take the heater offline and protect the core.

Also, if you are in an area where you close your pool for the winter, like NJ, your water chemistry may need adjustments upon Spring opening and you may not be confident that your pH is stable while adding chemicals. You can bypass the heater and protect the copper core during the pool opening until your pH is stable between 7.2 and 7.8.

Heater Bypass - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

 

[Deb04]

Personally, I don’t hire people who tell me I don’t know what I’m talking about. Even if I don’t, I expect someone to treat me respectfully. They can educate me, but don’t treat me like I’m an idiot. My pool (or yard, or car, or whatever.)

 

[needsajet]

Just had a discussion with someone who may be coming out to install my plumbing

I'm glad to see the word "may"

 

[xpert66]

Is this your pool or your installers? You have to live with it not him. I use my heater bypass every season during the pool opening while getting the pH adjusted.

If the heater springs a leak, you have to shutdown the pump, which stop waters circulation, filtering and chlorinating your pool. Having the pump stopped too long can lead to algae and a dirty pool, and more work once you get the heater repaired and the pump running again.

With a relatively new pool or heater you may not see a leak for many years and wish you had a heater bypass valve. However you may encounter another situation where bypassing the heater is helpful. Heater cores can be damaged by acidic low pH below 7. Maybe you misjudged your acid addition and accidentally lowered your pH too much. If you have a heater bypass you can turn the valve and stop the acidic water from flowing through the heater. Or maybe you purposely lower the pH to around 7 to treat a scale problem. You can use the heater bypass valve to take the heater offline and protect the core.

Also, if you are in an area where you close your pool for the winte, like NJ, r your water chemistry may need adjustments upon Spring opening and you may not be confident that your pH is stable while adding chemicals. You can bypass the heater and protect the copper core during the pool opening until your pH is stable between 7.2 and 7.8.

Heater Bypass - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

Everything you stated is exactly what I read and the reason why I want a bypass valve. I am just extremely surprised that this particular installer is recommended by several people on social media. Thanks

I'm glad to see the word "may"

Exactly.

 

[pjt]

Very happy I installed a bypass on my heat pump. When the Texas freeze damaged the heat pump, I could still operate my pool normally.

Your system will also run more efficiently when bypassing the heater.

 

[xpert66]

BTW what would be the proper or best bypass to use? Jandy or this one I saw on Amazon? Amazon.com : FibroPool 3 Way Diverter Pool Valve 1 1/2" Female Threaded : Garden & Outdoor

 

[BassPlayingDude]

Find another installer. I had the same issue with people telling me I didn't need a mixing valve on my indirect hot water tank ( I now keep it at 140F to kill legionnaires ) and also that I didn't need a bypass on my new boiler install. Both parties now no longer work for us.

I gotta say, I just don't understand this attitude. I am a Software Engineer by trade and this would be like me telling our client, "No, I will not write code to do what you want because I think your requirements are stupid". Who does that?? I would expect to be fired in a hot minute! (And yes, I have written code for some VERY stupid requirements ) The only reason I would ever refuse (unless I got something in writing taking full responsibility off me ) is if it would affect someone's health and safety (like not properly generating HazMat codes on a manifest for instance ).

 

[Newdude]

I will be the lone dissenter here having never needed a bypass. I brought my equipment inside every winter and had I even wanted to postpone hooking up the heater, I would have easily made and installed a dummy pipe in its place. (Also being a handy dude). The same goes if a problem would have arisen needing it.

I totally respect them for their purpose. I wholeheartedly support them for people without the skills to work around them. I consider it half a dozen or six for the rest of us. MY $.02.

 

[BassPlayingDude]

Other than a small amount of increased complexity (and another place that could potentially leak ) I just don't see the downside of having one.

 

[ImNotAChemist]

I will be the lone dissenter here having never needed a bypass. I brought my equipment inside every winter and had I even wanted to postpone hooking up the heater, I would have easily made and installed a dummy pipe in its place. (Also being a handy dude). The same goes if a problem would have arisen needing it.

I totally respect them for their purpose. I wholeheartedly support them for people without the skills to work around them. I consider it half a dozen or six for the rest of us. MY $.02.

So you don't bypass your heater when you shock the pool or adjust chemicals? I was under the impression that this is necessary... We just installed our heater so I'm a newbie and figuring all this out too!

 

[Newdude]

So you don't bypass your heater when you shock the pool or adjust chemicals

We don’t shock pools here. FC levels are safe for equipment up to and including SLAM level based on the FC/CYA Levels. We also don’t recommend going over SLAM level so it should never be an issue.

The rest of the chemicals get added by a return (the jets) and are well mixed before they get anywhere near the heater.

Now. In the case of a heater issue, the bypass is awesome for somebody who can’t just bypass it themselves. But to me the costs of the valves just aren’t justified otherwise. I think your builder is seeing it in these terms. If you have a problem they can show up and throw a bypass (dummy) pipe in mere minutes until the issue is fixed correctly be it waiting for parts or a new heater. Overall they probably don’t see enough need for it to justify the costs. You should be happy he isn’t overselling you because it probably means he didn’t elsewhere either. Most builders would jump at whatever the customer wanted, no matter how little it would be used. He makes his profit selling and installing parts. More parts equals more profit. And he is telling you no, so he clearly honestly feels that way.

 

[ajw22]

Now. In the case of a heater issue, the bypass is awesome for somebody who can’t just bypass it themselves. But to me the costs of the valves just aren’t justified otherwise. I think your builder is seeing it in these terms. If you have a problem they can show up and throw a bypass (dummy) pipe in mere minutes until the issue is fixed correctly be it waiting for parts or a new heater. Overall they probably don’t see enough need for it to justify the costs. You should be happy he isn’t overselling you because it probably means he didn’t elsewhere either. Most builders would jump at whatever the customer wanted, no matter how little it would be used. He makes his profit selling and installing parts. More parts equals more profit. And he is telling you no, so he clearly honestly feels that way.

In case of a heater issue why would I want to wait for a service man to arrive and pay him $125 for a call out to throw a bypass dummy pipe in? It is one thing if the pool owner has the DIY chops to do it It is another to be overly reliant on maintenance people for simple services.

We try and teach pool owners how to maintain their own pools and not be reliant on other for simple tasks. If you design the proper valves into the system then it is easy for a pool owner to make adjustments when necessary.

We see Pool Builders recommending things that make the pool owner reliant on their services so they can get recurring revenue after the job is done. Instead of building a pool that is simple for the customer to operate.

 

[mguzzy]

Oh lewrd! So many dudes in one thread; New, Bass and Handy!.. Its a Dude Trifecta! well you can add Goofy, as that was my moniker in my class clown days, so make that a four-fecta...

New'.. you don't count because your are Handy' and essentially made your own bypass... The OP-dude is hiring a plumber-dude to be a Handy-dude for him even though he could be his own Handy-dude! If the first dude won't do what he wants he should just blow off that dude and find another dude.

I close my post in reverence to the king of all Dudes:

 

[BassPlayingDude]

I'm with @ajw22 here ... I suspect the motivation is to keep the customer reliant on service calls vs installing a simple-to-operate valve. I could be wrong of course...

 

[Newdude]

New'.. you don't count because your are Handy' and essentially made your own bypass... The OP-dude is hiring a plumber-dude to be a Handy-dude for him even though he could be his own Handy-dude

For the install, this time yes. He made it clear he could handle the rest. Which was my point that being handy it was much less of an issue to have/ not have.

We try and teach pool owners how to maintain their own pools and not be reliant on other for simple tasks

Agreed. I was speaking from the builders perspective that they weren’t the least bit worried about temporarily fixing anybody’s equipment that wasn’t capable themselves. Which OP is.

If you design the proper valves into the system then it is easy for a pool owner to make adjustments when necessary

Also agreed. But from my sample size of *exactly 1*, having never needed it, I don’t see it worth the sky high costs at the moment. Those valves aren’t cheap right now.

Now, had I had many heater problems, then of course I’d think differently. But even then, I probably woulda just thrown my own bypass in and went about my day / fixing the heater.

We see Pool Builders recommending things that make the pool owner reliant on their services so they can get recurring revenue after the job is done. Instead of building a pool that is simple for the customer to operate.

Statistically speaking, The failure rate of any appliance is negligible at best. 99 times more happy customers than ones with issues.

 

[BassPlayingDude]

Doesn't the friction of flowing water cause wear and tear on the expensive heat exchanger (even if its' very slight )? Seeing as how the heater is probably the most expensive element in the system, bypassing it when not in use seems perfectly reasonable to me. My heater does not have a bypass, but I certainly plan to install one when it finally gives up the ghost. I do of course realize that that poses some risk to the heater if you have it bypassed, leave it turned on with the gas shutoff open and for some reason the flow valve fails, but that falls under the category of "operator error"

 

[ajw22]

Statistically speaking, The failure rate of any appliance is negligible at best. 99 times more happy customers than ones with issues.

Given all the pool pump and pool heater problems we see here statistics does not seem to apply to pools.

 

[ajw22]

Doesn't the friction of flowing water cause wear and tear on the expensive heat exchanger (even if its' very slight )?

That is why all heaters with copper heat exchanges have a maximum flow rate. Excessive water flow can cause the heat exchanger to prematurely wear.

Seeing as how the heater is probably the most expensive element in the system, bypassing it when not in use seems perfectly reasonable to me. My heater does not have a bypass, but I certainly plan to install one when it finally gives up the ghost.

If your flow rate is within the manufacturers specifications then the heat exchanger is designed to handle it and I don't see a need to bypass it. The heater will likely rust out before the heat exchanger will wear out.

 

[BassPlayingDude]

What if you have a variable speed pump? Wouldn't you be able to save a little energy by not having to overcome the friction/ head from the extra 20 feet of piping?