Plumbing layout recommendations

[Dgremaud]

Hello,

I purchased a new Pentair Intellflo VS pump and installed it a couple days ago. My neighbor is a licensed electrician so the electrical is complete and working great. My questions are all related to my current plumbing layout and determining if improvements are recommended. Outside of the heater and salt generator my layout seems pretty straight forward. I've noticed a small leak from the pump to the filter so I need to redo it so I figured if other changes will improve performance then I may look at my options before replacing according to the current setup. I'm looking for all improvements regardless of severity and location so please fire away. I also have about 2 feet of clearance to the right of my pump before my air conditioner so moving the pump location is also an option.

Thanks!

 

[Dirk]

Pentair recommends a straight run of pipe before the SWG. I think it's to help with the flow of water through it. And Pentair ICs can be fussy about flow. From the manual:

Note: For best flow sensing, provide at least 12"-18" of straight pipe in front of the cell inlet.

And if I remember right, there's supposed to be a good run of pipe before the pump, too. Though I can't remember why, or how much. Hopefully someone else here can weigh in about that.

Also, there are some here who can pick these out of an image. I'm not as good as they are. The sweep fittings in your setup: where did you get those? Are they all Schedule 40, or did you buy DWV fittings from Lowes or HD? This is a pretty common mistake, as they look very similar. But the DWV fittings are meant for drains and are not pressure rated as true Schedule 40 fittings are. Some here say they'll be fine, others claim they will fail eventually. The problem is, if they do fail, your pump could run itself dry, and that's not good.

There are Sch 40 sweep 90s, you just have to find 'em (online).

Additionally, a member here claimed street elbows to be counter to good flow. He didn't explain how or why, just not to use them.

And since you asked... I can't quite make it out in the pic. Is that a valve coming off a T, going into your filter? I had selected a similar setup for my plumbing, but the installer who put my pad together chastised me for that. He claimed that little 1/2" part of the T was a weak spot and subject to breaking (like from stepping on it, or some other such force). So he replaced my 2"x1/2"x2" Ts with 2"x2"x2" Ts, and then glued in a reducer to accommodate my valve. He also poo-pooed the PVC ball valve I had chosen, and used instead a brass hose bib. I later had a PVC ball valve fail, so I agree 100% with that call. And now that I see the T setup he chose to use, I have to say I feel better about that, too.

 

[Dgremaud]

Thanks Dirk, does that mean the run from the heater outflow to the SWC doesn't count? I didn't measure but there's at least 12" straight run before the 90 into the cell. If I need the 12-18" straight into the cell then should I move it to connect straight from the outflow from the heater then use a 90 back to the return? Also, if I move the cell would you recommend adding a zinc anoid (spelling?) between the heater and cell too?

 

[Dirk]

Oops, one more. It's good practice to leave as much straight pipe between components as possible. You've done a pretty good job of that. Maybe a little too tight around the SWG. And you left no where to go with your three-way valve. The idea is: should you need to replace something, you have straight pipe to cut it out and glue in a new one using PVC couplers. If everything is jammed up next to something, you might have to replace expensive parts because there's nowhere left to glue in the new one. Sometime you can't help it, but when you have the room, leave yourself plenty of pipe between everything.

 

[proavia]

As Dirk suggested, look at those sweep 90's and be sure they are schedule 40 and not DWV fittings. If they are DWV, replace with standard 90's in schedule 40 - the sweeps aren't increasing water flow or efficiency to any measure anyway.

Consider using unions on both the suction and pressure sides of the pump. Like these: https://www.amazon.com/PACK-Hi-Temp-Union-Whisperflo-Intelliflo/dp/B00AKMV4K8/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1529765576&sr=8-5&keywords=2+pump+union . I didn't check prices, they may be available elsewhere for less.

It appears your main drain and skimmer are plumbed as separate runs all the way back to the equipment pad (this is a good thing). Consider adding a Jandy 3 way valve in place of the hose bib between the pump and filter. This will allow you to drain water easier if pool overfills after a rain storm or if you need to drain a bunch of water.

 

[Dirk]

Thanks Dirk, does that mean the run from the heater outflow to the SWC doesn't count? I didn't measure but there's at least 12" straight run before the 90 into the cell. If I need the 12-18" straight into the cell then should I move it to connect straight from the outflow from the heater then use a 90 back to the return? Also, if I move the cell would you recommend adding a zinc anoid (spelling?) between the heater and cell too?

The run from the heater doesn't count because of the elbow. The elbow would disrupt the flow in the worst possible place, directly next to the SWG. The 12"-18" run should come right out of the SWG.

Why do you think you need a zinc anode? I went back and forth on this with my [now X-] pool guy. As I understand it, anodes are used to counter the corroding of metal parts in your system. I believe this has something to do with electricity running around, and exacerbated by salt. But my pool guy claimed that a properly bonded pool takes care of this issue, making an anode unnecessary. I honestly don't know the truth of it. I started to think I'd put one in anyway, just to be safe. But then I rethought that: where does the dissolved zinc go? in the water? I don't know anything about that either, so I've kinda stalled out on my own anode quest.

Speaking of run between SWG and heater... Typically a check valve was used between a tab chlorinate and the heater, to keep super-chlorinated water from backing up into your heater. Folks here claim no such check is need with a SWG, because the chlorine production stops the second the flow stops. So there is no super-chlorinated water to run back up. But I've also read that some heater manufacturers require that check valve, even before an SWG, or they don't honor their warranty. I had such a check valve, because I used to have a tab feeder. That check valve was replaced with a new one when the installer put in my SWG, so he must have thought it necessary, though he turned out to be an idiot. But I just took it out the other day to install something else in its place, banking on the advice here about not needing it, and the fact that I never use my heater and don't ever plan to, so if the advice is wrong, I won't really know or care.

So sorry, not a lot of help, just pointing out some things for you to research and make up your own mind about, before you replumb...

 

[Dgremaud]

Great suggestions guys, thanks for the feedback! The layout schematic is from the installer 10 years ago. I'm finding out the hard way about not having room between runs as I'm spending a lot of valves and other pieces. Is there any benefit of converting the skimmer side suction from 1 1/2 to 2" before the Jandy 3/way valve? I'd have to dig down and convert the pipe far enough down to improve flow or is that overkill? I'm thinking that may be necessary anyway if I need to move my pump to the right because I'll have to replace the Jandy valve so maybe I should incorporate that change as well.

Also, before the pump, could I use ball valves on both the skimmer and main drain suction plumbing instead of the Jandy 3-Way valve? Would that make any sense?

I'll need to check the fittings but you're probably right since I got them from Lowe's. I'm sure I can go to one of the local pool stores to get schedule 40 fittings.

 

[Dirk]

Also, before the pump, could I use ball valves on both the skimmer and main drain suction plumbing instead of the Jandy 3-Way valve? Would that make any sense?

If you're talking about PVC ball valves, then no. Those will be your failure points. They're usually junk: jam up, leak, deteriorate in the sun, etc. (Remember, PVC is not UV resistant and so is not supposed to be installed above ground, despite the fact that you see that just about everywhere. So be sure to paint all your PVC when you're done.)

More importantly: the three-way valve allows you to balance the suction at the drain and skimmer, but doesn't allow both to be shut off at the same time. Two ball valves are harder to use for balancing, but can also be closed completely (think little kid fooling with your pad), which would choke your pump and create some potentially expensive havoc. Jandy three-way is the preferred setup there.

You'd use shut off valves like that if your pad was lower than your pool and you needed to isolate everything to replace components, so your pool wouldn't drain while doing so. But even then you'd want Jandy two-ways, not the cheapies.