OmniLogic - Two Water Features On One Pump

[kvoigt]

We recently completed our pool which has two bodies of water: spa and pool. The spa has two spillovers into the pool and the pool has bubblers on the tanning ledge and sheer descents waterfall on the accent wall along the side of the pool.

Our PB originally designed the pool with only one pump controlling all the different features. The issue with that was when all three (spa spillover, bubblers, and waterfall) were turned on, there was not enough water flow in the spa for the spillover to maintain the shape. The water would sort of dribble over on one of the spillovers.

To correct this, the PB added an additional VSP pump connected to just the sheer descents and the bubblers.

The issue now is that the bubblers and sheer descents do not operate independently. The sheer descents will turn on by themselves - Once they are on, you can turn on the bubblers. But to have the bubblers on, the sheer descents must be on. If the sheer descents are off and the bubblers are turned on, nothing. I'm new to this, but it's as if the sheer descent is controlling whether or not the pump stays on or off. So whatever setting the descent is in, the pump follows.

The PB came by and tried to adjust - but is not very experienced with the configuration settings and did not fix it. He's been telling me he will get it reprogrammed for months now.
I'm wondering if this is something I can fix myself. Any thoughts / suggestions are appreciated. Thx!

 

[HermanTX]

Is this an automation control issue or a plumbing issue? Maybe post a picture of the return plumbing of the water feature pump that leads to the sheer decents & bubbler. You have a control to turn on the water feature pump so now just need to understand what is controlling whether the flow is to the sheer decent or to the bubbler.

Also, where is the suction coming from for this new water feature pump?

 

[kvoigt]

Thanks for replying so quickly - See pics below. The PB pulled the suction from the circled skimmer. The actuators are labeled on the plumbing. You can see in the picture that both are working simultaneously.

From this setting if I turn off the sheer descent, it turns off the pump so bubblers also turn off even though they are left in the ON setting. If I then turn the bubblers off and back on the pump comes on and runs for about 10 seconds - but then shuts off.

 

[HermanTX]

Thanks for the pictures. I not totally familiar with Hayward automation but it appears there is confusion with both being automated.
I would remove the automated controller for the bubblers and just have the automation on the 3-way valve. Then have it go from open to close. To the left would be the sheers and to the right would be bubbler.
Others may have views that have Hayward automation.

 

[ajw22]

In the picture you posted it looks like both the waterfall and bubbler valves are OFF. And if the pump is turned on it will be deadheaded.

You have four possible configurations:

• Waterfall and Bubbler off
• Waterfall ON; Bubbler OFF
• Waterfall OFF; Bubbler ON
• Waterfall ON; Bubbler ON

Show us this pics in each of the four configurations.

And tell us what buttons you push on your Omni system for each of the configurations.

 

[kvoigt]

Pics of configurations - I'm just toggling the app on the controller as appropriate to set each configuration. I went back and deleted the bubblers - readded it to the system and chose that it has a dedicated pump. Now it's working in the opposite fashion where the bubblers have to be on for the waterfall to come on. If I turn the bubblers off, it turns off the pump even if waterfall is set on.


Both OFF



Waterfall off- Bubbler on


both on

watefall on / bubbler off



toggle

 

[ajw22]

Okay, your valves are working correctly.

Your problem is the Omni is not smart enough to handle an OR situation with the pump on for the waterfall OR bubbler ON. As you saw if you say the pump is dedicated to the bubbler then the pump goes on and off with the bubbler. Say the pump is dedicated to the waterfall and the pump goes on or off with the waterfall. However have both waterfall and bubbler on and you turn one of them off the Omni system turns the pump off.

I think your only fix is to have separate buttons for turning the pump ON or OFF and turning the waterfall or bubbler ON or OFF. Use the pump ON/OFF to turn the water features ON and OFF.

Select the water feature or features ON then turn the water feature pump ON. Turn the pump OFF when you don't want any water features.

However I would always leave a water feature valve open or both water features ON when the pump is OFF so that the pump is not dead headed if it is turned on with both water features OFF.

 

[kvoigt]

Yes - When I delete the two features and add them back, whichever one I add back second then trumps control of the pump. I think when I get to this screen (see pic) I associate the pump, but that then disassociates the pump from the previously added feature.

I don't see where I can control the pump individually with an on/off - maybe that needs to be added? Is this buried within the settings somewhere? Perhaps getting above my pay grade!

 

[ajw22]

The pump control needs to be made visible in the CONTROLS section. In the configuration area you should be able to list the water feature pump to be controlled independently.

Then you say NO to a dedicated pump for both water features since the pump is not dedicated to a specific water feature.

 

[kvoigt]

Thanks for all the help. I don't see where the pump can be made visible. Not familiar enough with the system. I'll just need to wait for our PB to address it.

Thanks again! Super helpful

 

[ajw22]

See page 38 in https://www.hayward-pool.com/assets/documents/pools/pdf/manuals/omnilogic-hlbase-install.pdf

Edit Current Configuration

Then add a second filter pump. Call it "Water Features", pick the type of pump and relay.

 

[kvoigt]

Thanks for sending the Installation Guide. When I get to the Filter Pump screen it only shows the options on the main pump. I don't see an option to "add" second filter pump. Do I need to delete the main pump and then add both of them at the same time?

 

[kvoigt]

Here's the screens -

 

[ajw22]

Thanks for sending the Installation Guide. When I get to the Filter Pump screen it only shows the options on the main pump. I don't see an option to "add" second filter pump. Do I need to delete the main pump and then add both of them at the same time?

I am working off book knowledge from the manuals and never laid hands on a Hayward system. I am reluctant to tell you to delete the main pump since that can really shut down your system.

See page 25 in the manual. It says:



I was hoping editing the current configuration would let you change the number of filter pumps but it looks like it does not.

You may need to go back through the Configuration Wizard and I am not sure exactly where it will lead you.

You can try it. I would backup the config to a USB drive first so if you mess it all up you can restore back to what you have now.