My generic pump is too much I think

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DrHorshenschwartz

DrHorshenschwartz

0
Jul 6, 2017
113
Throop, PA
Would anyone like to comment on my generic pump? I think it's working a lot harder than I need it to.
I have 1-1/2" hard PVC from skimmer to pump to sand filter to return with a slightly funky mess of a junction to allow the return water to flow straight out of a 1-1/2" pipe as needed. I can turn on and off ball valves to choose the regular return or the alternative return or a mix of both. With the straight pipe the pump pushes water so fast that it can't keep up and the pump basket area becomes noisy, air filled, and generally upset. I have to partially close the valve to throttle the water down.
So using just the normal light / return combo does this pump seem inefficient?
Total length of PVC is probably 15ft each with four 90degree elbows, three 45degree elbows.
Unfortunately I didn't buy sweep elbows but I could change that at some point if it seems relevant.
Thanks for reading.
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That looks like you're doing a nice job with the hard piping and full-sized filter. Good stuff!

If you're getting air in the pump strainer, you might have a suction side leak. Throttling down the pump is inefficient, yes, but OK while you sort it out.
Pool School - Suction Side Air Leaks

Sweep elbows don't make a noticeable difference in head loss. I have them on a few spots and they do look nice :)
 
The only time I experienced what you describe is when I had a suction side leak as needsajet mentions.

Unrelated, but where is your pump's bonding wire, I see an empty bonding lug?

View attachment 66178

Are those live electrical boxes hanging off of the pump return line?

boxes on return line.jpg
 
You don't need a pump that big if that's what you mean, but 1.5 HP on 1.5" pipe was pretty standard not that many years ago.

As far as the air, you can keep the water level a bit higher, but the angle of the picture leaves me wondering if the skimmer has the weir in place. If that is missing or stuck down, the skimmer is more inclined to develop a suction vortex.
 
Ok I figured the HP was too much. Im not familiar with how to decide what I need. I see all the talk of two-speed motors and just not sure what is worth buying.
I do have the pool much more full than previously. The weir is in place even though the installer claimed it was unnecessary. He said that because he had installed the skimmer and tightened it so much that he gasket squeezed out and stopped the weir from flapping freely.
The installer was a moron.
I'm don't know if there is an optimum water level in relation to the weir flapper. My alternate return pipe allows me to turbo-skim to water by adjusting the ball valve I can draw water in and clear floating bugs quite rapidly.
 
I have a 1.5HP pump with a 21" sandfilter and do not have the issues you describe, so I don't think it's too big of a pump. Have you tried raising the water level a bit? How far up the skimmer opening is the water level?
 
I'm with Dom, it's not too much HP for your setup. A 1 HP would be enough, and a two speed would allow you to save money on filtration, but not necessarily for skimming, that depends on the pool. Halfway up the skimmer throat should stop it from sucking air, and yes, the weir flap needs to be swinging and keeping the water level high and flowing across the skimmer water surface. I'm not clear about the other return and it's method of skimming, but sounds fine as long as it's not sucking air either.
 
needsajet said:
I'm with Dom, it's not too much HP for your setup. A 1 HP would be enough, and a two speed would allow you to save money on filtration, but not necessarily for skimming, that depends on the pool. Halfway up the skimmer throat should stop it from sucking air, and yes, the weir flap needs to be swinging and keeping the water level high and flowing across the skimmer water surface. I'm not clear about the other return and it's method of skimming, but sounds fine as long as it's not sucking air either.
Click to expand...
Water level is currently an inch below the top of the skimmer box opening.
 

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Am I reading this incorrectly, but your profile has "IG" IN-Ground, but that looks to be an Above Ground to me...I've always read that the pump needs to be just slightly higher than the pool elevation for optimal operation..rgds, tstex
 
My IG sucks air at one of the skimmers from time to time. I bias it a little more to the main drain and it fixes it. Do you have just the one skimmer? If you have two, you can bias the valve to the one farther away.
 
So I checked it out again tonight.
I have a ball valve below the skimmer, just before the through-wall return/light, and I made an additional return that hooks over the wall and gives me the ability to have both returns on 100% or any combination really.
So it's very convenient to shut down flow.
When I have the return water going just through the light there's a lot of vibration noise between the hard pvc and the flexible hose that came with it. If I hold the hose the vibration gets a little less.
I can have any portion of the return water flow through my alternate 1-1/2" hard pvc return.
Take the through-wall out of the equation and have all water run through the alternate. If I have the ball valve open to full flow the pump and motor makes a lot of almost vibration or grinding noise. If I throttle down the return the pump and motor become much more silent. When I had it on full I went to the pump and put my foot on the motor to see what making the most noise. I'd say it was the impeller.
 
So through the above description, was there zero air getting sucked in? Also, does the noise sound a bit like pea gravel rattling around inside the pump?

If yes to those, then the pump may be cavitating because it's not able to draw enough water from the skimmer. The valve under the skimmer should be fully open. Then to settle it all down, restrict the flow by partially closing the return side valves only.
 
What you describe about the sound is correct. And your solution seems to be exactly what the doctor ordered.
I haven't tried restricting the flow from the skimmer. So it has free flow from the skimmer but if I don't restrict the return a bit, that's when the pea gravel sound picks up.
With 1.5" pvc on both sides if I don't restrict return flow then the pump is ridiculously loud and gravelly.
To me, just another unforseen cost involved with a pool install that the pool store doesn't tell you about.
I guess I'm still wondering if I should have a two speed pump or a lower hp.
 
Do you have eyeballs in both returns? They create a bit of back pressure which would change things.

A 2-speed, when running on low speed, will move approx. 1/2 as much water for 1/4 the electricity, so that can be a substantial savings to measure against the cost of the switch. Think about how you will control it as well (either two-speed pump timer, two timers, or manual).

By the way, did you catch Dom's heads-up about bonding?
 
Sorry if this doubles posts, I replied a minute ago but I don't see it now.
I had ball valves coming and going. The return has to be throttled down to quite the pump.
Can you suggest a specific two speed pump and timer? I run 24 hours a day because I don't really know how long I should run.
Also I'm just coming down from a slam so I figured I should be running 24 hours.
 
Here's some info on pump run time. For your current pump, a good starting point is 4 hrs per day. Once the three SLAM criteria have been met, you can cut back pump run time. Pool School - Determine Pump Run Time

I notice that you or someone recently swapped the motor. That's an economical option for the switch to 2-speed - just buy the motor. A lot of people here use Intermatic timers and I'ved used those in years past as well. I don't know brands over there the way others here do, but from reading here, I would choose from Pentair, Hayward and Jandy.

Give inyopools a call. They're super helpful
 

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