Is it worth to install VS pump?

[locky]

Because of install Circupool RJ45 (18,000 gallons pool), I'm thinking replace my single 1.5 HP single speed pump with VS pump. Is it worth? my local electric rate is 0.2 - 0.9 cents (depend on day time).
Which VS pump should I buy ?( I'm interesting on Pentair 342000 )
What RPM should I run to operate RJ45 (25-30 GPM) ?

Thanks in advance.

 

[ping]

Yes, it is worth it to change the pump to a VS or 2-speed and run on mostly at low speeds.

Fill out your signature to list all of your pool specs and we can give some advice on which pump we would suggest. It seems the members like the Pentair VS pumps. Look for utility rebates to see which pumps are covered.

If the SWG will work with a pump running 1000 RPM then that should be your target speed for most of the day. You will have to experiment with different speeds and see when the SWG stops working due to low flow and then bump it up some to account for a dirty filter. The high speed run time will need to be figured out to keep the surface clean.

 

[randytsuch]

Do they give rebates up there?
In LA, DWP gave me a pretty healthy rebate and my rates are much higher, made it a no brainer. My installed cost was $150.

At your rates, payback may be pretty long if no rebate, depending on if you will install yourself and what your final cost will be.

There is a spreadsheet here
http://www.troublefreepool.com/threads/830-Hydraulics-101-Have-you-lost-your-head?p=6231&viewfull=1#post6231

that will help calculate cost savings.

Randy

 

[Nectarologist]

Where I live it was not worth it since my pool is only open 4 months a year. Under the best case scenario it was years to break even. You need to calculate to be sure. Copied and pasted from some digging I did on electrical costs. Since it's VS start with a best case scenario and if it pays try mid-case scenario to see.

In order to calculate the average operating cost for any electrical appliance you can use the following formula:

watts/1000 = kW x hours of operation = kWh x kWh rate = cost
Watts can usually be found on the appliance nameplate. If the nameplate only lists amps: volts x amps = watts

My pool pump (single speed):
1,840 watts (115 volts X 16 amps per Jandy)
1840 / 1000 = 1.84 kW X 8 hours of operation = 14.72 kWh X $.10 (cost/kWh) = $1.472 per day to run pool pump ($44.16 / month & $185.47 for summer of 2016 (May 14 – September 17).

 

[locky]

Thanks for all quick reply and helps. Let me find out of my pool used equipment which I will put on my signature.
My RJ45 SWG does not arrive yet (due to Harvey storm delayed). My pool now are running without SWG:

1. Main pump (I don't know name but the motor is AO Smith 1.5 HP): 3 hr/day
2. Polaris 3/4 HP Booster pump: 1.5 hr/day
3. Self Prime Spa pump ( I don't know the name but motor is AO Smith 2 HP): 1/2 hr/day
My current electric bill cost $200.00/month ( house hold size =2), in near future with SWG which required to run long hours in order to produce balance FC, so I cannot imagine how much electric bill will be cost ?

 

[locky]

Added signature.
Please recommend for VS or 2 speed pumps ? ( ? HP)

 

[Pyrodav]

The quiet operation of a Pentair VS is worth the extra to me after being around other pumps.

 

[ping]

Stay away from the Superflo and go with an Intelliflo. I believe some of the pump experts sill confirm this opinion. Do a search on Superflo vs. Intelliflo and that should yield some results.

 

[locky]

Stay away from the Superflo and go with an Intelliflo. I believe some of the pump experts sill confirm this opinion. Do a search on Superflo vs. Intelliflo and that should yield some results.

Intelliflo is over my budget, what do you think for this one : Pentair 342001 SuperFlo (on sale $648.00)
My current pump inlet/outlet are 2" pipe, is it ok for VS342001 with 1.5" pipe inlet/outlet ??

 

[ping]

I'm far from a pump expert, so I'll let others chime in on what pump to get. I'll PM one of the pump experts to take a look at this thread since it is not in the pumps forum.

 

[Swampwoman]

Locky, if budget is a concern and the wet end of your pump is fine, I wanted you to know that it is possible to replace just the motor with a variable speed made by Century (formerly AO Smith) called V-Green 165. Cost of the motor is $399 at Swimming Pool Supplies - Pool Parts - INYOPools.com and their guys will help you get the right variant if you give them the serial number. (You need to know square flange or round flange.)

My cost for electric is cheaper than yours at .17, and I saved about $60 each of the last two months since installing it over last year's bill -- ymmv as I run my pump continuously, which is viewed as unnecessary here...(If you're curious, I do it because I get a lot of debris in my forest, am on well, use sequestrants which increase spent phosphates, and I run my heater a lot...plus now I'm operating in winter in a dome and need water to mve 24/7). in summer, it is not necessary to turn the water this much but I simply prefer to and with these considerations, my approach makes sense for me, though others would say I'm nuts

So a vsp was a no-braner for me. In Cali, I thought they've actually banned single-speed...requiring vsp on replacement.

Hands down you should go with vsp over 2-speed. With 2-speed, if the low speed is too low for your swg and heater, you've got nowhere to go...but with vsp you just bump it up - The savings are pretty dramatic even if you only drop down to 2850 or 3100. And with solar, future gas, and swg, its difficult to predict what flow you'll get because each pool is different depending on feet of head.

Ps. From my product research earlier this year, Superflo does not get a lot of love from pool techs and others in the know. I'd steer clear when there's a cheaper option...or go the other direction with intelliflo, which does get a lot of love I went with the cheapest option because I wanted something that fit the same wet end so that if I had a pump failure in winter I could just swap my single speed back in if I had to race against the clock on pipes freezing...so the retrofit made perfect sense for me!

 

[mas985]

Intelliflo is over my budget, what do you think for this one : Pentair 342001 SuperFlo (on sale $648.00)
My current pump inlet/outlet are 2" pipe, is it ok for VS342001 with 1.5" pipe inlet/outlet ??

That would work fine as long as you aren't trying to program the pump through a controller. The Superflo works well as a standalone pump.

Also, the above recommendation of a motor add on would also work fine but has the same controller limitation.

in near future with SWG which required to run long hours in order to produce balance FC, so I cannot imagine how much electric bill will be cost ?

Only if you get a SWG that is too small. Correctly size the SWG and you shouldn't need to run the pump much at all. I think most SWGs run around 250 watts. Mine runs about 50% for 6 hours so 750 watts per day so not too bad in terms of power.

 

[locky]

First, let me say sorry if I posted in the wrong forum, because it relate to my coming SWG RJ45. Thanks a lot of all helps here fro the expert, I'm a newbie just start to learn how to take care the pool (just retired and want something to do).
I'm thinking to replace just a variable motor, but my current main pump had a little leak under need the impeller. Now I got an idea how to select my own pump (a gain thanks all)
As this "That would work fine as long as you aren't trying to program the pump through a controller. The Superflo works well as a standalone pump.
" I'm confused, please explain more on boldface sentences above

 

[mas985]

First, do you have a programmable controller?

Something that turns on and off the pump, pool lights, landscaping all with programmable timers. If not, then a standalone pump like the SuperFlo would work fine. It includes it's own controller with a timer so you can program run times at various speeds. The downside is it will not control anything else. Some people have controllers such as the Pentair EasyTouch and with that you can control and program some VS pumps (e.g. Intelliflo) through the controller and bypass the pump controller. It is just a different way of doing things. So if you are thinking about getting a controller in the future, you may want to think about this.

Pentair - EasyTouch Control Systems

 

[locky]

Locky, if budget is a concern and the wet end of your pump is fine, I wanted you to know that it is possible to replace just the motor with a variable speed made by Century (formerly AO Smith) called V-Green 165. Cost of the motor is $399 at Swimming Pool Supplies - Pool Parts - INYOPools.com and their guys will help you get the right variant if you give them the serial number. (You need to know square flange or round flange.)

I checked with INYOPools, V-Green 165 ( total horse power = 1.65), while my current pump 1.5 HP x 1.47 service factor = 2.2 total horse power. Is it OK for replacement?

 

[Swampwoman]

You might want to submit the q. To their customer service team...they usually respond very quickly and they know the product best. There is a higher HP variant of VGreen.

 

[dradam]

4 years ago I switched to pentairs variable flow pump, which by definition means variable speed. I calculated that with energy savings in my area it would take about 8 years for the savings of the pump to offset its initial cost compared to a one stage pump. I am halfway there but it will have to go 4 more seasons without issue for me to recoup the added cost.
The value of the pump for me is greater than that though. I run 24/7 at the lowest setting 15gpm. At this setting the pump uses about 240 watts. I have a chemical automation system and heater. By running 24/7 even at this low rate I get enough turnover to keep my pool clear, maintain the chemical balance and maintain temp. Hope this helps.

 

[locky]

You might want to submit the q. To their customer service team...they usually respond very quickly and they know the product best. There is a higher HP variant of VGreen.

Talked to tech support, he recommend V-Green270 ($699.00) to replace my current pump.
Check my local PG&E , will get $100.00 for Pentair Intelliflo 011018 VS3050, and $100.00 from Pentair which I don't know will get from PG&E and Pentair or PG&E OR Pentair.
I decided will go with Pentair Intelliflo (on sale $801.99 @ VM Innovations).
Thank you so much for support. It is amazing forum, learn a lot from you.

 

[peterl1365]

Locky,

Excellent choice. I wanted to point out that you stated your electric cost at 0.2 to 0.9 cents.

As a fellow Californian, I'm fairly certain that the cost in San Jose is closer to 0.2 to 0.9 DOLLARS per kWH. Either that, or you did not include some of the other costs that are included in your electric bill.

Either way, with a bill around $200 monthly, a VS pump is a no-brainer. Even if you are billed based on Time-of-Use, you most likely are in one of the upper usage tiers where you get charged more per kWH than someone who uses fewer kWH in a month. In these cases, the savings from a VS pump will be dramatic.

EDIT: By the way, the 011018 VS3050 pump is probably a little bit more energy-efficient at lower speeds than the 342001. The 011018 uses a permanent magnet motor instead of what looks like an AC induction motor in the 342001. Not completely certain, but PM motors tend to use less power at lower speeds and loads.

 

[locky]

No, I did not include some of the other cost in my electric bill. There are 2 frigs, 1 air conditioner (turned on 2,3 times for the hot days), 2,3 hours on the computer, 2,3 hours on the TV. On the bill chart which show my household usage is higher compare to my neighbors.
Thanks for your pointing out.