intermatic t101r3

erock14

Well-known member
May 23, 2010
99
union beach n.j.
i installed this intermatic t101r3 120v timer today, and the manual lever kicks on no problem, but the timer itself does not move/work, i cant see what i did wrong, as the clock motor wires, neutral/hot are pre installed, and are allready mounted w/ eyelets on the terminals, am i missing somthing? i wired my supply line to the #1 pole, and my load to the #2 pole, grounds are together and to the box, and neutrals to the A pole, whats going on? thanks!!
 

Richard320

TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
Jan 6, 2010
20,815
San Dimas, CA (LA County)
erock14 said:
i installed this intermatic t101r3 120v timer today, and the manual lever kicks on no problem, but the timer itself does not move/work, i cant see what i did wrong, as the clock motor wires, neutral/hot are pre installed, and are allready mounted w/ eyelets on the terminals, am i missing somthing? i wired my supply line to the #1 pole, and my load to the #2 pole, grounds are together and to the box, and neutrals to the A pole, whats going on? thanks!!
[attachment=0:3q6p1trk]intermatic.gif[/attachment:3q6p1trk]Sounds like you hooked it up right. Still, I wonder what that dotted line on the schematic indicates? Maybe you have a bad motor? Or the black and white wires are reversed at the other end?
 

Attachments

erock14

Well-known member
May 23, 2010
99
union beach n.j.
its brand new, ordered it from inyopools, i was also wondering what that dotted line means, the wires cant be reveresed on the other side cause the pump kicks on w/ the on/off lever, its the clock that doesnt turn, oh did you mean reversed on the clock motor itself, maybe, could be defective motor, i dont know?
 

Bama Rambler

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
Jun 22, 2009
23,036
SouthWest Alabama
If you have it hooked up like the diagram Richard posted then I'm betting on a bad clock motor. It could have gotten hooked up backwards from the factory but switching the clock motor leads will solve that pretty quickly.

The dotted line is just the actuator arm that closes the contacts between 1 & 2 terminals and completes the circuit.
 

Durk

Well-known member
Jun 14, 2007
654
New Jersey
I would take a 110-240V test light (one of those plastic neon jobbies) and put the leads on the A and #1 terminals. If you have a light, and the clock motor is not turning, then you have a bad motor. If light is off, then you probably have hot load and hot line reversed. Since they are both usually black, this is easy to do. Try it with motor running to be sure. If light comes on (and clock runs) only when pump is running, they are reversed no matter how sure you are of your connections.

I am pretty sure a synchronous AC clock motor should run in the correct direction regardless of how the leads are connected to a power source, assuming voltage is present and correct. Aren't they both white? I am used to 240v systems where this is for sure true, but I think it applies to 120v as well. The motor doesn't know the difference between a neutral and a hot any more than a light bulb does.
 

erock14

Well-known member
May 23, 2010
99
union beach n.j.
yes all three terminals are hot, and line and load are definitly in right locations, but isnt the neutral not supposed to be hot just like an outlet.
 

Bama Rambler

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
Jun 22, 2009
23,036
SouthWest Alabama
You are correct. On a 120V single phase system the Neutral should not be hot with respect to ground. You can get some backfeed but it shouldn't be 120volts.
 

erock14

Well-known member
May 23, 2010
99
union beach n.j.
allright this is messed up, i just put my meter on the neutral and im getting 138v and the black hot is getting 168v, what the fudge? i traced the line to the basement and sombody reduced a 4 wire 240v down to 120v by capping the red hot in the 240 line and only connecting to the black hot but does not explain why the nuetral has that many volts or why the black has that many volts and get this its on its own seperate 15amp breaker, this is not good.
 

Bama Rambler

Mod Squad
TFP Expert
LifeTime Supporter
Jun 22, 2009
23,036
SouthWest Alabama
Sounds like a grounding issue to me. Crazy things happen when you have bad grounding. I've seen lights get dim almost go out in one part of a house and get real bright and blow out in another part. It's usually a transformer floating but you're not having problems in the rest of the house are you?
 

erock14

Well-known member
May 23, 2010
99
union beach n.j.
well i traced back to the breaker box, and that nuetral is directly in the breaker acting as a full blown hot, i know this is turning into an electric forum thread, do you think is should remove the neutral from the breaker and put on the neutral bus
 

ColdAirGuy

Platinum Supporter
LifeTime Supporter
May 25, 2010
85
California
If you are saying the "Neutral" is going to a breaker.....you've probably burnt up the motor in the timer.

If the Timer has a 120v motor, and you've connected 208v to it, it's going to be toast.

You should use a volt meter to check across what you thought were your hot and neutral to verify voltage and determine wether your feed is bad or perhaps the timer was damaged in shipping or something.
 

erock14

Well-known member
May 23, 2010
99
union beach n.j.
yeah i definitly burnt it up, who knew, i just assumed the neutral was a neutral w/ out testing, this has been a great lesson to always check my voltages before hooking anything up, somebody jury rigged this whole line, there was absolutly no reason for the neutral to be wired to a hot breaker, its a double pole 15amp breaker, it was the only white wire in my whole breaker box that was wired to a breaker, all the rest were on the neutral bus where they belong. this was a 240v at one time somewhere along the line some switched it back to 120v and hooked the neutral to the breaker by mistake, thats the only logical explanation to me anyway, concidring they used 12-3 wire and capped the red wire, its funny caused they capped the red hot and re attached the white to the hot and defeated their whole purpose. and left a problem for someone else to figure out. im lucky im somewhat capable or this would have been an expensive call to an electrician.

anyway i took the neutral off and connected to the neutral bus, and hot is now 122v and neutral is .1v is that correct or should there be 0v
i called intermatic and she said its a bad motor too send it back for a knew one. damaged from shipping or whatever so thats cool. it wasnt a total loss.
 

erock14

Well-known member
May 23, 2010
99
union beach n.j.
well i now see why they had two hots, they were running the pump on 240v

my pump now does not receive enough voltage or is wired wrong, the v shape conductor next to the capacitor now trips everytime i start the motor, it starts stops, starts stops, while turned on, am i supposed to take the nuetral off of where it is now and if so where do i put it, any body have a schematic for hayward superpump?
 

erock14

Well-known member
May 23, 2010
99
union beach n.j.
ok the two poles in the pump do they both have to be energized, do i have to run a jumper from one pole to the other, the old hot which is now the neutral where does that go or is that a delete. basically i have unknowingly converted this pump from 230v to 115v this is one heck of a day so far!!
 

ColdAirGuy

Platinum Supporter
LifeTime Supporter
May 25, 2010
85
California
The simplest way to fix your problem is to have your 120v burnt up timer replaced with a 208v timer. Which means you would reconnect that white wire to the breaker and while white isn't the correct color to use for a hot leg, you could pull a new black or red to replace it or use some colored electrical tape on the ends.

OR......run another wire from (your new hot) that breaker to your timer.
 

erock14

Well-known member
May 23, 2010
99
union beach n.j.
i figured it out, their is a harness that you pull out and lower it to the next prong, just below the one it was on, and walla, im now on 115v and running beautifully (for now) their is a arrow on the harness that you line up w/ the 115v arrow, its a little hard to see but its a done deal, i appreciate all your help, thanks!

its funny all i wanted to do was install a timer and it turned into a whole electrical fiasco, but in some sort of weird way, i enjoy when things like this happens, i look at it like this, i now know a little more then yesturday, and hopfully tommoroww i know a little more then today, and so on, and so on, so the lesson here folks is "CHECK YOUR VOLTAGE BEFORE YOU INSTALL ANYTHING", so you dont burn up your timer like me LOL
 

ColdAirGuy

Platinum Supporter
LifeTime Supporter
May 25, 2010
85
California
Sweet....Up and running!

I would consider switching it back to 208v if you ever feel like doing a weekend project in the off season maybe, only because with the higher voltage option you will be drawing less current to operate the same pump, which in turn saves you money!
 

erock14

Well-known member
May 23, 2010
99
union beach n.j.
yeah, i really wish i knew it was 240v to begin w/, i would have bought a 240v timer. i was totally fooled into thinking it was 120v cause of the way it was setup w/ 12-2 wire only used for 120v applications, haha jokes on me lol. but hey, whatya gonna do. sh#t happens. i guess im lucky i can still run the pump, cause i threw the old box and switch away. you know they used a 20 amp breaker as a switch in a non water proof rusty box (crazy) that didnt even stay shut. i just bought this home, and everyday i find more crazy stuff, and im sure i will be finding stuff for years to come.

since the timer is no good anyway i was thinking about replacing this one w/ the 240v now that i know the whole setup, i can do it in an hour or so. (if everything goes smooth that is) hopfully next week i will be back on track.
 

Other Threads of Interest