Intellicenter-Mastertemp-Heatpump not operation woes

[TigerTater]

New pool build complete
Intellicenter I8 installed, master temp 400 as well as heat pump 140

I was having trouble getting the heater to come on line when called for via the intellicenter app. I would call for heat to pool, it would come on but only up to set point on the panel, not what I dialed in on the app. So I would raise the set point on the pad and then It would go up appropriately. Not making sense I tooth panels off both the load center and the heater, and it appears that the installer only hooked it up using the 2 wire fireman switch (blue box), and not the Rs-485, which is why I'm guessing it won't adjust from the app to the pad without me physically changing the heater pad? posting some pictures, of the panel. Should I call the electrician to come back and fix this or handle myself, I can certainly do it, not sure if I Should? Should be in connected to the yellow box or green box (connections goes to SWG board)

Next thing is the heat pump, when selecting heat pump only my heat pump does not appear to be kicking on to heat, is there a temperature delta that needs be in place for it to attempt to heat? My thought was we hated using the gas heater then use the heat pump to maintain it for a few days, weather here has been in the 40-60s during the day, water temp is mid 70s currently after being warmed, before that was around 52. It does appear to be in Rs485 connection via the brown wire to the connector in the yellow box. Am I being to impatient ?

last question- I run my pump 24/7 low speed, and ramp up to 2k for a few hours in the morning to improve skimmer flow, when the schedule kicks in it turns the heater off, is that normal function?

 

[ajw22]

I was having trouble getting the heater to come on line when called for via the intellicenter app. I would call for heat to pool, it would come on but only up to set point on the panel, not what I dialed in on the app. So I would raise the set point on the pad and then It would go up appropriately. Not making sense I tooth panels off both the load center and the heater, and it appears that the installer only hooked it up using the 2 wire fireman switch (blue box),

When the MasterTemp heater is controlled through the 2 wire firemans switch you set the heater control panel temperature to 104F in SPA mode and then do not touch it. All temperature regulation is done by the Intellicenter heat setting.

and not the Rs-485, which is why I'm guessing it won't adjust from the app to the pad without me physically changing the heater pad? posting some pictures, of the panel. Should I call the electrician to come back and fix this or handle myself, I can certainly do it, not sure if I Should? Should be in connected to the yellow box or green box (connections goes to SWG board)

The MasterTemp heat will work through either wiring once you do the above.

The advantage to using the RS-485 connection is heater status and errors will be sent to display on the IntelliCenter panels.

When a heater is being controlled via the RS-485 interface:

• The heater front panel buttons are inactive. Press a panel button to turn on the LCD display and “RS485 Control” is displayed.
• Heater Alarms/Errors are displayed on IntelliCenter’s control panel(s) Status Home screen.

I would change the MasterTemp wiring to the RS-485.

When that is changed the IntelliCenter configuration must be set to the correct control interface:

• If the MasterTemp is connected to the IntelliCenter using RS-485 then settings: system configuration: other equipment: heaters and set the heater to "mastertemp".
• If the MasterTemp is connected to the IntelliCenter using the 2-wire fireman’s switch at J2 then settings: system configuration: other equipment: heaters and set the heater to "heater".

Pentair MasterTemp Heaters - Further Reading

www.troublefreepool.com

Next thing is the heat pump, when selecting heat pump only my heat pump does not appear to be kicking on to heat, is there a temperature delta that needs be in place for it to attempt to heat? My thought was we hated using the gas heater then use the heat pump to maintain it for a few days, weather here has been in the 40-60s during the day, water temp is mid 70s currently after being warmed, before that was around 52. It does appear to be in Rs485 connection via the brown wire to the connector in the yellow box. Am I being to impatient ?

What is the water temperature and what is the HP temperature set point?

Is Remote mode activated?



Do you see a heart beat on the HP display?



I would check that the RS-485 cable is correctly wired since that brown cable does not use the standard yellow and green color coding.

Only the yellow and green data wires are needed and should be connected. The red and black power wires are not needed for this connection.

last question- I run my pump 24/7 low speed, and ramp up to 2k for a few hours in the morning to improve skimmer flow, when the schedule kicks in it turns the heater off, is that normal function?

Post a pic of your schedules page. Your heater should stay on with a pump speed change.

Also post a pic of your pump speed page. What is the low speed 24/7 rpms?

Is that enough flow for the heaters?

 

[TigerTater]

Thanks for the thorough reply!

I adjusted the pad to max on both and that did fix the problem for now, but I would like to move to the Rs485.

Can I hijack the wire going to the fireman's switch to hook up the com port on the heater? Do I need the full 4 wires or can I just use the data green/yellow? If that's okay, Can I connect it to either of the com spots shown above either the green or yellow box?

The green box has the come line going to the SWG circuit board, and the yellow has the heat pump going to it, so \may be best to put it on the green box com ?


I opened the heat pump panel and verified the connections, I also took the liberty to remove the pin 1 & 4 wires leaving only 2&3 connected, did the same at the intellicenter.

It is set to rs485 control and has a heart beat and intell address at 1.

I initiated a call for heat on the app, heard an audible click from the relay in the intellicenter, saw the heartbeat icon flash on, but nothing happened? Set point is at 82, suction temp was at 65. The heat pump pad on light never came on either, am I supposed to turn that on manually and leave it on?

Im at a loss. I had the pump speed at 2000 RPM, which was well over 44GPM, bypass was off so all flow going through the heat pump. ambient temperature 55.

pics before/after

and the pad after the call for heat was initiated

 

[ajw22]

Can I hijack the wire going to the fireman's switch to hook up the com port on the heater?

You can. It is not the best wire to use. Give it a try and see if it works.

Do I need the full 4 wires or can I just use the data green/yellow?

You just need the green/yellow two wires.

If that's okay, Can I connect it to either of the com spots shown above either the green or yellow box?

Green goes to green and yellow goes to yellow.

The green box has the come line going to the SWG circuit board, and the yellow has the heat pump going to it, so \may be best to put it on the green box com ?

You can put two wires under one screw on the comm ports. The yellow box already has two wires under each screw. Use the green box.

You also have an empty comm port connector - JP4 - on the right side of the surge board that you can connect to.

I opened the heat pump panel and verified the connections, I also took the liberty to remove the pin 1 & 4 wires leaving only 2&3 connected, did the same at the intellicenter.

It is set to rs485 control and has a heart beat and intell address at 1.

Has the HP ever worked?

Before you run after automation control problems I would take the HP out of Remote Mode on the HP control panel, have the pool running, and try and get the HP running from its own control panel.

If the HP does not run then make a warranty claim with your builder or Pentair.

I initiated a call for heat on the app, heard an audible click from the relay in the intellicenter, saw the heartbeat icon flash on, but nothing happened? Set point is at 82, suction temp was at 65. The heat pump pad on light never came on either, am I supposed to turn that on manually and leave it on?

Do you show this display with Pool Heating when the HP should be on in Remote Mode?



You can try that ON button on the HP. I am not sure what it does.

Im at a loss. I had the pump speed at 2000 RPM, which was well over 44GPM, bypass was off so all flow going through the heat pump. ambient temperature 55.

See that the HP runs in stand alone mode first. I think you have a HP problem that requires a warranty call.

 

[TigerTater]

See that the HP runs in stand alone mode first. I think you have a HP problem that requires a warranty call.

I turned the control to off and ran it manually via the pad, and it did come on! so that's positive.

when switching back to rs485 control and calling for heat via the control pad, nothing happens, it says IDLE F *
Im not sure what to do about that...its certainly not getting any request from the panel to heat

 

[ajw22]

I turned the control to off and ran it manually via the pad, and it did come on! so that's positive.

Great. That is a good sign.

when switching back to rs485 control and calling for heat via the control pad, nothing happens, it says IDLE F *
Im not sure what to do about that...its certainly not getting any request from the panel to heat

Do you have something connected to your solar sensor? A temperature sensor or 10K resistor?

When you connect the UltraTemp to Pentair automation using the RS-485 data connection you need to add a solar temperature sensor in addition to the air and water temperature sensors. Solar temperature sensor can be left loose in load center. The automation system does not use the temperature reading but just looks for resistance.

A 10K resistor will work, and is less expensive, or a temperature sensor.

You can steal the air temp sensor and connect it to the solar to test it immediately until you get a resistor.

 

[TigerTater]

Do you have something connected to your solar sensor? A temperature sensor or 10K resistor?

I verified do have a solar sensor in place, opened the panel and traced it. It also shows up in the app under history. Tightened all connections. I removed the other wires that were piggybacked, it was a wifi modul or something that I’m not using because I’m hardwired via Ethernet.

Restarted system, called for heat pump.

Nada

It just says
Pool idle
Set NA , actual 74

I’m at a loss !

Thank you for continuing to work with me on this !

 

[ajw22]

What version of IntelliCenter firmware are you running?

 

[ajw22]

Confirm that Heat Mode is set to Heat Pump.



Show me what this screen displays:

 

[ajw22]

Check in the Configuration settings that the Heat Pump is assigned to Pool/Spa...



Confirm the Heat Pump is set as an UltraTemp

 

[TigerTater]

What version of IntelliCenter firmware are you running?

1.064

Confirm the Heat Pump is set as an UltraTemp

Success!

It was not!

Was set to heat pump not ultra temp !
I should have not something wasn’t adding up, because it was not asking me to set a heat and cool temp range, simply just a single temperature.

I deleted the current configuration of the heat pump and added it back new properly selecting Ultratemp. Enabled cooling.

Back to Home Screen, selected it to call for heat and Bam! Immediately turned on!

So the proper programming of this unit is paramount to it working with intellicenter. I did not do the initial programming, my PB has someone that set it up and they acknowledged the fact that they had only done a hand full of intellicenter setups, as they prefer easytouch, even though it will be obsolete soon

Ajw22 thank you so much for the guidance.

Next step I will attempt to convert the master temp to rs485. Will get back with you on that.

Should I add that heater as new also under master temp profile vs gas heater ??

 

[ajw22]

Success!

It was not!

Was set to heat pump not ultra temp !
I should have not something wasn’t adding up, because it was not asking me to set a heat and cool temp range, simply just a single temperature.

I deleted the current configuration of the heat pump and added it back new properly selecting Ultratemp. Enabled cooling.

Back to Home Screen, selected it to call for heat and Bam! Immediately turned on!

Glad you figured it out. We just needed to work through the various possible problems one step at a time.

So the proper programming of this unit is paramount to it working with intellicenter. I did not do the initial programming, my PB has someone that set it up and they acknowledged the fact that they had only done a hand full of intellicenter setups, as they prefer easytouch, even though it will be obsolete soon

They gotta learn. Pentair is adding additional features that make IntelliCenter configurations more complex.

Should I add that heater as new also under master temp profile vs gas heater ??

Yes,
When that is changed the IntelliCenter configuration must be set to the correct control interface:

• If the MasterTemp is connected to the IntelliCenter using RS-485 then settings: system configuration: other equipment: heaters and set the heater to "mastertemp".
• If the MasterTemp is connected to the IntelliCenter using the 2-wire fireman’s switch at J2 then settings: system configuration: other equipment: heaters and set the heater to "heater".