Help for a suction-side air leak

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G

Geoffv

0
May 19, 2015
8
Ottawa, Ontario
Hi All,
I’ve been lurking through the site for a week or so getting good info as I troubleshoot my pool issue, and now I’m looking for some feedback/advice. The problem is an air leak on the suction side of the pump – see the bubbles in the salt cell and from the inlet.
Bubbles - Salt Cell and Inlet.jpg

You can see there are not many fittings above ground on the equipment pad, and they’ve all been re-glued, o-rings lubed, etc. Also, at arrow A, if you put your ear to the pipe, you can hear the water sloshing around the 90 degree bend, and that is pretty much as soon as the suction comes above ground.
Equipment Pad.jpg

The pool is full – there is no air vortexing into the line. And there are no bubbles seen at the bottom of the skimmer from the main drain line to the suction line. So all this tells me the leak is underground.

The pool doesn’t seem to be losing water, so this makes me think the leak is above the water level. However, I don’t see how so much air could be making it into the line that is buried. Which makes me think the problem is at the bottom of the skimmer. But if it was, wouldn’t I be losing water when the system is not running?

Today I called the local pool leak detection people, and everyone is busy for 10-20 days out. Here in Ottawa, Ontario, our season is so short, I don’t really want to wait. So here’s what I’m thinking…

I’ve think I’ve ruled out the leak being near the equipment pad, and I doubt it would be under the patio and be able to pull that much air. So that leads me to the skimmer bottom where there is likely a void and lots of air to pull. I’m thinking I’ll rent a saw and cut a hole about 24” x 16” between the skimmer and the bricks, dig out to the bottom of the skimmer and see what I find. If the issue is there, then new fittings and it’s done. If not, then I forget about the old line, lift the needed bricks, and trench in a new line (easy to say, but should be done in a week or so…).

Skimmer + Deck1.jpg

Here some questions I have:
- Is there any value in waiting for leak-detection guy (at $225), or should I just get on with it?
- Is the hole in deck, 24 x 16 large enough?
- The skimmer is a Jacuzzi with the floating weir. From inside the skimmer you can feel a 90 degree turn just as the water exits – will that be an elbow that I can unthread? I’ll want to change the direction of the fitting by about 90 degrees
- Have I missed anything here? I also just installed the MaxFlo VS pump -- old one was seized at spring start up.

Thanks, Geoff
 
I just had a similar leak, problem was the elbow fitting below the skimmer failed after 35 years. My initial cut out was about the size you propose, although maybe a little shorter and a little wider, then had to almost double the width and cut out next to the skimmer to make the repair, the problem was the fitting is deeper than you think it is, I wear 36 / 37 inch sleeve shirts and could barely reach it with my finger tips in the initial hole.

p.s. I used a leak detection guy to isolate mine, the best he could tell me was it was either under the skimmer or within a couple of feet of it. Cost was $350 I think
 
Geoff, I've been dealing with a similar problem, and my pool is only 2 years old. I don't lose prime or see a lot of air, but I do see them return and it concerns me enough to where I keep investigating and have considered digging around my skimmer like you. Before you do though, a couple things to consider:
- Have you accomplished everything listed HERE:
- Check-out this THREAD: I was considering the temp suction line pipe thing myself.
Finally, before I consider cutting or digging to get to my skimmer, I will make sure I've replaced all 2 or 3-way valve seals, union seals, etc,. Doing all of these things before cutting concrete or digging "may" save you some time, money, and back-pain. :) I hope you find the source.
 
Hi Stebs,
Yes, I've checked the union with both the smoke trick and the water trick. Thing is, when I hear the water sloshing around that 90-degree elbow, makes me think the air is entering before that elbow otherwise it would be quiet. And if that much air was entering at the taped join of the black flex PVC and the rigid white PVC, I'd hear it.

Hi Texas Splash,
I've looked over the list, and I've tried to see the "spitting" when you turn off the pump -- no luck though.

Plan today is to pick up 50' of pipe at lunch and tonight will run a temporary from the main drain to just before the elbow (cutting the short rigid PVC) pipe. I'm thinking that if that is air-free, then I'll just replace the whole line.

All your thoughts appreciated!
Geoff
 
Taking all the advice to double-check above ground before suspecting the underground line, I ran a temporary from the main drain port on the bottom of the skimmer to the pump, bypassing most of the fittings at the pump -- with this the bubbles disappeared. So tonight I reconnected the underground suction right where it comes out of the ground, and the air leak reappeared -- so looks like the issue is underground between the skimmer and where the line emerges.

So...back to Plan A of cutting the deck and changing the fitting at the skimmer. Just hoping there's no surprises in disassembling/reassembling the skimmer fittings.

Question - is replacing the entire skimmer an option? This one is 35 years old and pretty grungy...should I even think about that?

Thanks,
 

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