First Time Owner - Frustrated and Broke

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Wishbone851

Wishbone851

0
Jun 30, 2018
23
Willco IL
My pool was installed 2 week ago and we've had nothing but problems trying to get our chemicals balanced. I've brought water samples to different stores, and rec'd different readings each time. The most current reading (today) is:

TA: 235
pH: 8.4
Hardness: 672
Free Chlorine 0.1
Total Chlorine 0.1
CYA: 50
TDS: 750
Optimizer Plus: 2
Saturation Index: High

Yes, I have well water that is very hard. Tonight I added (per pool store) 1 Gallon Acid Magic. I was told to wait a few hours and then add an entire 5lbs bottle of Bioguard Burnout 73 to overshock the pool. The bottle says 1lb per 16,500 gallons, so I am hesitant. He also told me to add 3 jumbo pucks of trichlor into my skimmer (in addition to my floating duck with 3 pucks who has been in the pool since filling).

Over the past two weeks, we've tried getting the TA down - first reading (at a different pool store) was 340, and I was told to add 8 lbs of dry acid, 1 lb every 4 hours - which I did - and the next test showed 350. I did six more lbs of dry acid (1lb every 4 hrs) and still got a reading of 340 - but the other pool store showed 245. Last saturday I was told to add 1gal of Acid Magic - and today's reading was 235 (I have not gone back to pool store #1 who had me burning thru dry acid with no results).

I'm seriously at my wits end and regretting getting the pool. Any suggestions would be welcome and appreciated - more than you know!!

Please and THANK YOU!!
 
According to my "Water Analysis" - "Optimizer Plus enhances water quality, softens water and prevents algae."

In fairness, the pool store totally ignored that section of the report - focusing only the high pH and low chlorine. I figured I'd put the whole report on here.
 
STOP!!!!

Please get your own test kit. Pool store tests are inaccurate, unreliable, and often not repeatable. Either Test Kits or Taylor K-2006C.

TA is the wrong thing to focus on. Keep your PH below 8 using Muratic Acid, not dry acid, and your TA will come down. Ta is not that important to you right now.

Most important is getting your chlorine up. With a CYA of 50 you need a FC level of 6-8 according to this chart. Pool School - Chlorine / CYA Chart

Don't use your Burnout or your trichlor pucks. Your pucks will raise your CYA level and you are already at the high end of a non-SWG pool.

People here use liquid chlorine AKA bleach. Plain bleach, unscented with no additives.

Please read Pool School above and get familiar with Pool Math. Pool School - Pool School

Right now the only 2 things you should be adding to your pool are bleach to keep the chlorine level up and Muratic Acid to keep your PH between 7.2 and 7.8. Once you get that stable we can help you with the Muratic Acid and aerate technique to lower your TA.
 
Welcome to the forum. You already have received great advice. If you can figure out a way to collect rain water, outside the pool surface, you will be able to get the levels down over time, making your life easier. You can manage your pool with high CH. Once you have read all the material on the forum and ordered a recommend kit, plug all your "accurate" test results into Pool Math to see where your CSI falls. You can then play around with PH & TA to remain within the parameters. We can get into what needs to be done, only after your results.

Pool Stores will have you adding chemicals to your pool that not only are they not necessary, but can potentially damage liner surfaces, pool equipment, cause rusting and major corrosion. Please stay out of there.
 
Catanzaro said:
You can manage your pool with high CH. Once you have read all the material on the forum and ordered a recommend kit, plug all your "accurate" test results into Pool Math to see where your CSI falls. .
Click to expand...

Is CSI important and does CH matter to an AGP without a SWG or heater?
 
Thank you - all of you.

Looking at test kits now - wish I could find one at a brick&mortar store. No patience to wait for shipping!! lol

- - - Updated - - -

On the subject of hardness, my husband and I were honestly discussing draining the pool halfway and having it filled with city water to try to improve both the TA and hardness.
 
At this point I would ignore 100% of everything you “learned” from the pool store. Looking at the test results and the junk they sold you I can tell their “assistance” only set you back. For now I personally would hold off on doing anything until your personal kit arrives and run tests then. I wouldn’t do a thing based on anything they told you. Additionally I would visit the ABCs of Pool Water Chemistry to give you a strong foundation to build upon.

While high CH can in theory give you headaches it’s very rare (but not unheard of) for vinyl pools to see issues. Focus on your pH, CYA, and FC levels at first until you get the hang of things. Then work on items such as TA or CH as you get more control of your pool.
 

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Add some MA to lower your Ph into the 7's and add some bleach to raise your FC to 6-8. Do them about 30 minutes apart. Let your pump run for a while and then go swim.
 
What I would recommend is to go back and figure out how much Stabilizer you added to your pool upon start up, and you will have a rough idea on CYA levels, or you can use the results from PB. Then use pool math to gauge your levels. You can then bring the pool up to SLAM level the first day and it is safe to swim up to this level. Do not open eyes up in the pool water as they may sting, or wear goggles for a nice tight seal. Then each day after, until you receive the test kit, I would add about 5 ppm at the most, early morning, out of the sun while pump is running. For your pool, this is about 100 oz. of 8.25%, each and every day. This is assuming you are swimming at least 4 hours daily and at 5-8 people, with 3 children.

For the first few years, I tested the water right before and after heavy activity to determine how much extra I should be adding on a daily basis, and it was between 4 ppm- 5 ppm. Remember that your original bleach will be consumed by organics and if you have algae.

How much stabilizer did you add to the pool upon startup, and if you know, brand? Liquid or powder? Thanks!
 
So - here's my rundown -


Pool was installed on June 28, fully filled with city-well water by the 30th.
At that time, Leslie's told me to just put 3 3" jumbo tri-chlor pucks in the duck (done)
July 2nd they sampled my water and told me to add:
4 lbs of Dry Acid (1 lb per hour every 4 hours) July 2nd & 3rd
1 lb, 20 oz of Chlor-Brite Shock (done July 2 overnight)
4 lbs of Leslie's Conditioner (done July 3 - premixed and added directly to skimmer)

restested on July 6 - told me to add
8 more pounds of Dry Acid (again, 1 lb every 4 hours - stopped at 7 lbs) - July 6 & 7th
1 lb, 20 oz of Chlor-Brite Shock
4 lbs of Leslie's Conditioner (I only added 2 lbs - premixed with water directly to skimmer)

went to a different pool store - had water tested on July 7:
Add 1 Gallon Acid Magic (done July 7)
1 Quart Scale Inhibitor (done July 7)
2lb Smart Shock (done overnight July 7/8)
added 3 more 3" Jumbo Trichlor Pucks to floating duck (first 3 are nearly gone)

tested again at 2nd store on July 12 - results in first post of this thread - told to add:
1 Gallon Acid Magic (done July 12)
5lbs Burnout 73 (did not add - did not open)
Add 3 more 3" trichlor pucks to skimmer in addition to what is in duck -- didn't do

Based on my tests just now (July 13, 6:30 pm)

Pentair/Rainbow test kit (drops)
Chlorine: less than .3
pH: 7.6

HDX Test Kit (drops)
Chlorine: less than .6 (almost clear - barely a tinge of yellow - lighter than the lowest marking)
pH: 7.4
TA - 310

I have strips, but can never figure out the reading on them. I purchased 3 gallons of HDX 10% Liquid Chlorine (or as they call it - HDX Liquid Chlorine Shock from Home Depot.

Using the last reading of 50 for my CYA, the chart indicates I should have a minimum of 4 for Chlorine, with a 6-8 range. Using the Pool Math calculator, to go from .1 to 7 would require 119 oz of 10% Liquid Chlorine - which again, I have three 128oz gallon jugs. Can I just add one gallon to the pool water and let my filter run tonight?

Hoping that will get me into a good place for tomorrow?
 
Wishbone851 said:
So - here's my rundown -


Pool was installed on June 28, fully filled with city-well water by the 30th.
At that time, Leslie's told me to just put 3 3" jumbo tri-chlor pucks in the duck (done) {added 7.4ppm of CYA}
July 2nd they sampled my water and told me to add:
4 lbs of Dry Acid (1 lb per hour every 4 hours) July 2nd & 3rd
1 lb, 20 oz of Chlor-Brite Shock (done July 2 overnight) {assuming 1 pound, added 4.5ppm CYA}
4 lbs of Leslie's Conditioner (done July 3 - premixed and added directly to skimmer) {added 36ppm CYA}

restested on July 6 - told me to add
8 more pounds of Dry Acid (again, 1 lb every 4 hours - stopped at 7 lbs) - July 6 & 7th
1 lb, 20 oz of Chlor-Brite Shock {assuming 1 pound, added 4.5ppm CYA}
4 lbs of Leslie's Conditioner (I only added 2 lbs - premixed with water directly to skimmer) {added 18ppm CYA}

went to a different pool store - had water tested on July 7:
Add 1 Gallon Acid Magic (done July 7)
1 Quart Scale Inhibitor (done July 7)
2lb Smart Shock (done overnight July 7/8) {assuming Bioguard, added 9ppm CYA}
added 3 more 3" Jumbo Trichlor Pucks to floating duck (first 3 are nearly gone) {added 7.4ppm of CYA}

tested again at 2nd store on July 12 - results in first post of this thread - told to add:
1 Gallon Acid Magic (done July 12)
5lbs Burnout 73 (did not add - did not open)
Add 3 more 3" trichlor pucks to skimmer in addition to what is in duck -- didn't do

Based on my tests just now (July 13, 6:30 pm)

Pentair/Rainbow test kit (drops)
Chlorine: less than .3
pH: 7.6

HDX Test Kit (drops)
Chlorine: less than .6 (almost clear - barely a tinge of yellow - lighter than the lowest marking)
pH: 7.4
TA - 310

I have strips, but can never figure out the reading on them. I purchased 3 gallons of HDX 10% Liquid Chlorine (or as they call it - HDX Liquid Chlorine Shock from Home Depot.
Click to expand...

1 pound, 20oz does not make sense since there are 16oz in a pound.
So, I just assumed you actually just added 1 bag which is a pound.

So you have added about 87ppm of CYA so far.

All those pool stores have gotten you to the point where you might should consider replacing water to lower the CYA.
 
1lb PLUS 20oz - total of 36 ounces

- - - Updated - - -

Sooo...the duck is coming out (er, staying in without the trichlor pucks, just because he's cute when he lights up at night)

We are considering draining the pool by half and having it refilled with city water (to lower both the CYA and TA)

Until then, can I add a gallon of 10% (by weight) HDX Liquid Chlorinator and hopefully have a pool I can use this weekend?
 
Well, is that what the printout said? that is a really silly way of stating it ... why not say, 2 lbs 4 oz :hammer:

So an extra 40oz of dichlor is another 11ppm of CYA.

Putting you at 98ppm of CYA that has been added ... assuming your 13.5k volume is correct.

I would replace half the water.

- - - Updated - - -

You need to have the FC > 8ppm for the pool to be "safe" with a CYA up around 100ppm.

1 gallon of 10% will at 7.4ppm of FC to your pool. So, I would say add 1.5 gallon initially and then another 1/2 gallon each day until you get a test kit.
 
I have to correct that - it was 1lb, 12 oz - for a total of 28 ounces - that was my mistake (when writing, not when adding it to the pool - she sold me 1 lb bags, so i just pulled 4 oz out of one of the bags and dumped them in.

What frustrates me the most is that no one told me that all these things were adding CYA - or I never would have bought the trichlor pucks.

So, tonight I will add bleach, test again in the morning - hopefully will be able to actually use the pool this weekend!!

Monday I start calling for prices on 6,000 gallons of fresh city water and start over. Thinking that maybe backwashing the filter might get some of the still undissolved conditioner out, but minimal, I'm sure. The upside is that the 3 most recent pucks are barely dissolved, and there are still remnants of the first 3.

THANK YOU TO EVERYONE FOR HELPING ME AND TEACHING ME SO MUCH IN JUST 24 HOURS!! I spent a fortune at two stores and learned NOTHING!
 
Your story is all too typical. We've even coined a phrase for it. We call it "getting pool stored".:D

The store probably doesn't even know that all those pucks and bags of shock have cya in them. They basically ignore that fact. Or they'll tell someone with a vinyl liner to raise the CH level, when it is absolutely unnecessary. We see examples of this kind of stuff daily here.

Stick with us, your pool will truly be trouble free very shortly. However, trouble free does not mean MAINTENANCE free. You still have to do your testing and add what your pool needs. After you have everything dialed in, you'll probably only need liquid chlorine and some muriatic acid to lower the pH occasionally. That's it.
 

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