6 weeks since fill up, a few questions about circulation and PH

[Alset2]

Hello, hope this is correct place.

so we put water in pool 6 weeks ago and fired up SWG 3 weeks ago.

About my circulation question, I can't seem to get my skimmer to work well. And when I mess with the jets ( which I have done a lot these 6 weeks) I can't seem to find a setting with the pool circulation going the direction the pool builder set it up with (counterclockwise) .
I have attached a marked up Pic that I think tells the whole story. The arrows are direction currently . Theses are very similar to how PB set it up except i have pointed them down a bit to try to stop the ripples in the surface.
First issue is above, cant get trash into skimmer...
Second issue is I have ripples from jets at shallow end and can't seem to do much about it,especially #1 because it hits the bench no matter what I do and boils water. It also can't turn it enough to shoot down the wall...its always pointing towards center of pool .

Before I drive my self mad does anyone have any suggestions about how to point jets so the trash doesn't just go by the skimmer?
and my PH goes up about .2 per day. Is this normal? I understand New plaster causes some thanks to this site.
Do ripples cause PH to rise or does the water have to be churned up with bubbles and such?
any help is appreciated .

 

[Jimrahbe]

Al,

It matters little which dirction your water circulates... Use whatever works best for you.

If "trash" floats by the skimmer, the most likely cause is that your water is moving too fast past the skimmer.

Skimming is best when the water level is at the bottom of the skimmer and worst when the water level is at the top of the skimmer.. Because you never want your water level to get below the skimmer's mouth, we recommend running the water level at the middle of the skimmer's opening.

Tell us more... My guess is that you are running your pump way too fast... What speed does your pump run most of the time?

I am also guessing that you are trying to keep your pH at 7.2... Most SWCG pools like their pH to be 7.8 or so...

New pools will have a constant pH increase and for now anyway, I would not worry about any ripples from your returns.

Please show us a full set of recent test data.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Alset2]

Test data:
Last full test was on 09/27
CL = 7
Cc 0 (also 0 on the LaMotte colorq -i test with both to collect data)
pH =8.2 added 32 oz acid after this test and retested 4 hours later and it as 7.4 (7.3 on lamotte)
alk = 90-but had been steady at 80 for few days prior -learning curve with TF kit ??
ch =450
cya=70 I'm having a learning curve with tf kit, my LaMotte has been steady between 80-90 for weeks

today PH was 7.8 so Added 16oz of acid and knocked it down to 7.5- I did not do full test today, going to start to only do full test once a week .

I have pump running at 2000 rpms ,up from 1600 trying to get more suction at skimmer.
main drain valve is set to 45degs to also help with this
water flow is fast...no doubt. I have tried different valve settings and are currently at about 45degs with it to try to slow it down. PB said i should leave return open atw when they turned pool over... I am jus trying stuff,hope I'm not causing problems.
PB left pump running at 2400 but told me I could play with it.
as far as PH l actually just try to keep it below 8. So i need to add 16oz of acid about every other day to do that,. Pool store said just add acid once a week but that don't feel right to me...
oh yeah,my water level is about 1/4"below half way up waterline tile

once again ,thanks Jim

 

[Jimrahbe]

Al,

I suggest that you set your main drain so that it is open only about 10% and set your skimmer to full open.. Main drains are really not needed for most pools...

Skimmer "action" is not seeing water swirling around in the skimmer... Skimmer action is actually made possible by the weir door that is between the skimmer basket and the pool.. Check to make sure the door is working like it should.. (I suspect it is fine..) The door floats up and down and makes it appear that the water in the skimmer is lower than the water in the pool.. Water being water, wants to flow downhill.. This flowing action is what causes the surface water to enter the skimmer rather that the water below the surface.. Pump speed does not have as much to do with it as one might think.. The movement of surface water is what drags the trash into the skimmer basket.

I run my pump at 1250 RPM and it skims just fine.. It does require some patience... The key, in my mind, is does it work, not how fast it works.. If I have 5 leaves in my pool and the pump is running, if I come back in an hour they will all be in the skimmers.. Somehow, the leaves know when I am watching, and will just float around in the center of the pool until I go inside...

I also have the ColorQ and like it.. But, keep in mind that it measures Total Hardness and not Calcium Hardness.. The difference can be significant, or not much, depending on your local water. Just don't be surprised if the ColorQ and your TF-100 are different. I know that the ColorQ paperwork says CH, but I talked with LaMotte directly and they acknowledged that their test is for Total Hardness.. In my case the difference is about 50 ppm, but it can be much higher than that..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Alset2]

Thanks Jim, the door is working good .
i will keep playing with it . I might even try reversing circulation since the way it goes now there is a jet pointing towards the skimmer only about 8 ft away . My only concern is ll of my jets will have to point towards the center of pool somewhat and not parallel to the wall, but maybe this doesn't matter so much?

the test results I post are TF results unless i note otherwise. I actually have read some postings from you about the LaMotte. I am trying to establish criteria (by collecting data from both kits from same water sample) to be able to use the lamotte acceptably for more frequent testing but still use the TF for a weekly or bi weekly test to be sure.
I will give the main drain a tweek down . After all of this I am almost certain the flow past my skimmer is too fast. I have witnessed trash just going by... and also seems to be some under current that pushes the trash away from the wall as it approaches the skimmer opening...

so in review ,ripples are no big deal.

is the .2 per day PH rise out of ordinary ?

am I hurting anything modulating the return valve to slow down water? (I keep eye on pressure )

would you suggest I try pump at lower rpm? 1600 maybe?

Sorry, i have lots of questions lol

 

[Jimrahbe]

Al,

I would not worry about the ripples, but if you can eliminate them I would.. If not, no big deal.

The further away from 7.8 you are the more the pH will try to get back to 7.8 or above.. think rubber band..

I would slow the pump rather than modulate the return valve..

Only you will be able to decide what speed to run, but 1600 sounds good to me..

Recently I have been adding 5 oz of MA each day at the same time. I only measure it once or twice a week, but 5 oz per day (for my pool).. keeps my pH stable at 7.8..

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[Alset2]

Thanks , so sounds like Im at least in the correct book (working towards same page...lol) .

This morning before work I adjusted my pump speed down to 1500 rpms . The salt cell lights all seemed ok with that speed . I emptied the basket and will see what it looks like when I get home

Thanks again Jim

BTW, is there some kind of "rating" system on this forum? I am not real social media savvy, but I dont want to miss an opportunity to give you guys credit where its due if such an avenue exists ...

 

[Jimrahbe]

Al,

Do you use Hairnets in your skimmer? If not, you should think about it.. It will keep most junk out of your filter.

The main reason I ask is because without a hairnet, you really don't realize just how much stuff the skimmer captures..

As far as a review or rating, you have already done it by becoming a Gold Supporter..

Jim R.

 

[Alset2]

I do not use hair nets, but I will look into that....could be interesting.

BTW, just subscribed to pool math and will be posting logs frequently.