New Pool Build - Nashville suburbs

First off thanks again to everyone on this site. You have no idea how much help this place has been. I believe I've just talked myself into adding the natural gas heater. My operating costs don't look nearly as bad as I assumed. If someone would just double check my math.

I checked a recent natural gas bill and determined that I pay $0.6666/CCF. There's also a flat $20 distribution charge but lets ignore that for now. Assuming 1.031 therms/CCM, I'm paying roughly $0.69/therm.

Ted from Montoursville PA was kind enough to post his pool heating costs ($1.079/therm) so I used it as reference. (Thanks Ted!) Obviously TN is much warmer than PA but right off the bat my costs should be 36% lower than his based on lower fuel costs alone. I also came across this Link. If I use Atlanta as my reference, maintaining the pool at 80° around the clock with a cover isn't unreasonable. The more likely scenario would be maintaining the pool @ 75° and bumping the temp up to 85° Friday-Sunday and select weekdays. It looks like religious use of the cover will be mandatory.

Just for giggles I also checked my electric rates against Ted's. His $0.13/KWH is a bit higher than my $0.11 but for our usage I think the instant heat of the natural gas is a better match than the heat pump. I'm not terribly excited about writing yet another check but in this case I think the benefits are worth the extra costs. The next time I speak to my PB I'll see if he can give me a ballpark estimate for the price to hook-up the heater to our main gasline. I'll be shocked if it's over $400 since it's so close and no digging is req'd.

mx702,
I agree with your assement that adding a heater wouldn't really extend your swim season. You've probably got a quick transition between summer and fall in MA. I suspect Halloween snow isn't an entirely freak occurance there. Nashville might get 4" of snow annually and almost never before X-mas. And while it isn't traditionally swimming weather here in October, I don't even consider wearing a jacket during the day until November.
 
tatertot09 said:
Yes, Our pool is just a few inches from going over but the pool builder insists its okay- Rain can stop any day- Hopefully it will get nicer for you soon!!!

Hi, not to hijack this thread but Tatertot, from what I've heard you do not want to let your pool get up to the liner track.
It will probably float the liner, which will cause many problems as you can imagine.
Does your pool have any overflow drains? If not now would be a good time to backwash your sand filter or just select rinse or waste.
Hopefully your PB had a good reason to tell you not to worry, but I would ask.

Aeromiorris05, following your interesting build.
I like the idea of running the gas line for the fire pit and heat for later, for now put your money in decking.
Best of luck,
John
 
John,
Thanks for the advice regarding decking. My intention was to layout our deck and then increase everything by about 25%. It's only costing us $4/sqft so we might as well do everthing now. I like grass as much as the next guy but I don't want clippings anywhere near the pool. The builder includes a standard 6ft perimeter. We'll probably reduce it to 4-5ft on the backside of the pool but the ends will be extended to about 14' & 20' respectively. We'll also have them extend the driveway past the garage. That way the kids will have somewhere to park their jalopy once they reach driving age. I hear that shuffling cars in the driveway can become a serious pain.

Our next big decision is weather to have color pigment added to the concrete mix. I'm kinda partial to the Pebble (641) and Dune 6058 from Davis Colors: http://www.daviscolors.com/#concrete. Of the various concrete treatments this seems to be the most economical option. Nothing too loud or fancy but enough pigment to upgrade from standard whitish/gray brushed concrete. Since the color is throughout the material I'm not even sure if it requires periodic sealing. I've got some more research to do before making a decision.
 
And if I didn't already say so. Very nice pool! Your build was the one that got me second guessing our decision to go with a single ColorLogic. Our PB reassured us that it would be bright enough given our configuration but I'm still a little bit concerned.
 
Regarding the single light.... We have almost the exact pool just installed in late fall. I had one color logic 4.0 installed and it is REALLY bright! Our house is white and privacy fence is also... It illuminates the entire back yard.
 
Aeromorris05, wow $4/ft concrete is a good deal. I would not ever mow any grass again for that, just color it green. :mrgreen:

On the Colorlogic issue, I believe the light placement and the color of the liner have the most bearing on whether or not you need two.
We had a dark liner and a placement dilemmna, and in our case we really needed two. They are plenty bright but our dark blue liner does not reflect the colors well nor accurately, i.e. even with two, the red colors are weak and barely discernable.
The Colorlogics, (or other LED), are the best money spent on your pool because they make it look cool and attractive year round.

I'm thinking about a fountain in the middle for the times of year we can't swim.

Best of luck with the weather and your build,
John
 
Aeromorris05,

We paid $6 per sq feet for any concrete over and above what was included. Did 1100 sq feet more in a moderate brush finish. Also did concrete cantilever coping and would highly recommend for your mountain pond like shape. Stegmeir was the form used. Awesome finish gives it a high end finish.

photobucket-1687-1318018701818.jpg




Regarding the color additive - if you are doing more than one pour/load, there is a chance of color variation. There are never two exact mixes of concrete. Also the color chart assumes a certain color of base concrete. Ours is whiter than the sample, so colors would have been more washed out/lighter. With all this, we bailed on the color idea.
 

Enjoying this content?

Support TFP with a donation.

Give Support
We live in NE Tennessee and installed a gas heater for our pool. We keep the pool open year-round. We crank up the heat for Thanksgiving, Christmas, and about one weekend a month in the winter so that we can all get in and swim. I turn off the heater when we are not planning to swim. We have a great time! I keep a solar cover on the pool to keep in some of the heat. It is cold getting out so we have a patio heater going and big robes. On average, it costs about 50.00 extra a weekend on our gas bill in the winter.
 
Update: We have plumbing! :party:

I'll grab some pictures when it stops raining. At first I was a bit disappointed as all the pvc lines were 1.5" instead of 2". Being an engineer this was the first thing I noticed as I walked up to the site. My head began to swim as I calculated the likely efficiency hit. Five minutes later I had purged the concern from my mind. Would I have preferred 2"? Sure. Will I be satisfied with 1.5"? Absolutely! I refuse to let this nit ruin my pool high. If the larger piping saved me $5/yr, I'll never miss it. I'm in for $35K on this project so I'm trying to keep things in proper perspective.

Rv4hess/Thadius - Thanks for the info regarding lights. From your comments and others, my mind is now at ease. I think we may have bailed on the colored concrete idea as well but there's some additional research to do. Our PB includes the cantilevered coping standard with all his IG pools. And his standard brushed concrete appears to be toward the white side of the color spectrum. We shouldn't have any problems with it being too hot or slippery to walk on.

Creechy - Thanks for the heating estimate. With ~23K gallons I'm probably looking at close to double your number. And at that rate we'll probably close around Halloween (although I could see opening it for thanksgiving since the kids are on vacation). We probably wouldn't swim again until April 1st. I think it might be warm enough here in middle TN to heat continuously in April with a solar cover. I'll hope to test that theory in 2 months. I'd like to keep the added gas costs under $200/mo. Overall gas consumption here is pretty low April-October so it won't be hard to budget for.
 
aeromorris05 said:
At first I was a bit disappointed as all the pvc lines were 1.5" instead of 2". Being an engineer this was the first thing I noticed as I walked up to the site. My head began to swim as I calculated the likely efficiency hit. Five minutes later I had purged the concern from my mind. Would I have preferred 2"? Sure. Will I be satisfied with 1.5"? Absolutely! I refuse to let this nit ruin my pool high. If the larger piping saved me $5/yr, I'll never miss it. I'm in for $35K on this project so I'm trying to keep things in proper perspective.

As an engineer myself, I would have been certain to ensure that the materials being specd were satisfactory prior to installation. Or did the builder deviate from the contract? Either way I wouldn't lose sleep over it.
 
pool_snob said:
aeromorris05 said:
At first I was a bit disappointed as all the pvc lines were 1.5" instead of 2". Being an engineer this was the first thing I noticed as I walked up to the site. My head began to swim as I calculated the likely efficiency hit. Five minutes later I had purged the concern from my mind. Would I have preferred 2"? Sure. Will I be satisfied with 1.5"? Absolutely! I refuse to let this nit ruin my pool high. If the larger piping saved me $5/yr, I'll never miss it. I'm in for $35K on this project so I'm trying to keep things in proper perspective.

As an engineer myself, I would have been certain to ensure that the materials being specd were satisfactory prior to installation. Or did the builder deviate from the contract? Either way I wouldn't lose sleep over it.

It's one of those situations where I had about a million different things going on in my head and I thought I verbalized it but I can't be sure. It's not anywhere in our paperwork and our PB has been a real straight shooter so I have no concerns about them deviating from something we agreed to. I've been very pleased with his work thus far. I'm gonna chalk this up as a "shame on me" moment and just move on.
 
It's been kinda wet the last week or 2 so I've been slow with pictures. About a week ago plumbing was installed and yesterday the pool-wall was back-filled. Here's a few pix.


1) Looking across the yard. The gravel pit on the near side is for access to the pool light.
ry%3D400


2) View from the opposite side.
ry%3D400


3) One of the 2 skimmers
ry%3D400


4) View of the deep end from back door. All plumbing converges @ the 8:00 position in this picture and leads to the equipment pad.
ry%3D400
 
Sorry I haven't updated this in a while. There hasn't been much activity regarding the pool build but tons of stuff related to our other subcontractors. During this downtime we received bids from 2 builders for the construction of a pavilion.

The first guy (a landscaper) wrote up a a bid that included a 14x14 structure, hip roof w/ 30yr shingles, pavers, rough sawn cedar, and a few other flourishes. Total cost +14k. Upon request he also submitted a +7k bid for a fire pit and sitting area. :shock: After waiting a week+ to get his bid and then seeing his final price we were just about ready to throw out the pavilion completely but I was convinced we could pull this off.

I went down to a local lumber yard that also builds small sturctures such as sheds, barns, etc and gave them my specs to see if they were interested in the business. Apparently their construction business revolves around selling corregated siding/roofing. My HOA would never allow that material on the roof so they couldn't build the pavilion. However the secretary indicated that this isn't the first time they've had to turn down work and she recommended me several roofers that they consult with that could build what I was looking for. The first guy I call comes out to the house takes a look at the yard and listens as we describe the features that we want. The guy then proceeds to draw the structure on un-lined printer paper better than I ever could on a green engineering pad.
The end result:
- 16'x12' pavilion w/ long side facing the pool
- 8' high eaves wrapped in trim to match house
- 5 - 6"x6" pressure treated posts (2-front corners, 3 along back),
- wood molding/trim to wrap the posts
- 30yr archit. shingles to match house
- Roofing done w/ T1-11 groove side down (we'll paint or stain it after construction)
- flooring to be concrete (same as pool deck)
- All construction to be done in his shop and assembled on site once yard grade info is communicated via pool builder.
- Total under $4k. :goodjob:

I tried to find an example online but this is the best I could come up with:
Ramada-6584-C.jpg

Note: We'll most likely paint our posts white and our pavilion won't have a cupola on top. I'm sure ya'll get the idea.

For my next trick I'm hoping to find a plumber to install our gas line for under $1100 which was our first quote. This is with no digging req'd!!! :shock: It ain't rocket science. If it was water, I'd re-plumb it myself but in my area you have to be certified to work with NG so it's off-limits to the average do-it-yourselfer which kinda sucks.
 
We talked with the electrician yesterday. Left him a drawing of the non-pool related wiring we wanted.
He'll do the following
- Stub out a 20-30A line to one of the rear posts of the pavilion
- Wire the pavilion for electricity (3 outlets low on the posts, 1 4-plug outlet mounted high for suspended tv/dvd, etc)
- Wire for ceiling fan and switch box controls
- Add an outlet to the exterior of the house on the far side of the pool
- Run a separate circuit to a sub panel & transformer (mounted on rear of pavilion) for 6-8 low voltage landscape lights. Something like this:
I think these are from a company called Brass Works (similar to CAST). I'm hoping they're a bit brighter and more durable than the solar kits from HD & Lowes.
347202~dtl.jpg
 
Got some electrical work done yesterday:

Conduit and wiring from pool light to equipment pad. The bonding wire is also visible.
ry%3D400


Bonding wire attchment to pool wall
ry%3D400


Each wall panel is tied into a main wire that travels around the entire pool circumference (sorry this one's a bit blurry)
ry%3D400


And here's a picture showing where we plan to have the pavilion constructed. It's offset a bit from the pool centerline and angles toward the house. (3 rear posts, 2 front corner posts)
ry%3D400


The temperature hit 77° in Nashville today. Pool fever is starting to set in.
 

Enjoying this content?

Support TFP with a donation.

Give Support
Thread Status
Hello , This thread has been inactive for over 60 days. New postings here are unlikely to be seen or responded to by other members. For better visibility, consider Starting A New Thread.