Replace GFCI outlet with GFCI Breaker - Is this ok?

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kevin007

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Apr 26, 2018
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Orlando
Hi All, I am trying to make my setup "smart" by being able to control the pool light with my phone or Alexa. In order to do this, I need to adjust my electric.

Currently, I have a normal breaker feeding a GFCI outlet, which then feeds the light. "Smart" CFCI outlets do not yet exist (that I know of), so the only way I see to achieve this is to replace the standard breaker with a GFCI breaker, and then replace the GFI outlet with a non-GFCI "Smart" outlet (z-wave protocol).

Is this the proper way to do it? I just want to make sure the GFCI breaker is safe compared to having the light run through a GFCI outlet.
 
Do I understand correctly that the light plugs into the outlet? Would this work? I use it for my Christmas lights and works great.

GE Z-Wave Plus Smart Lighting & Appliance Control Outdoor Module, On/Off, 1 Outlet with Weather-Resistant Outlet Cover, Plug-In, Zwave Hub Required- Works with SmartThings Wink and Alexa, 14284 GE Z-Wave Plus Smart Lighting Appliance Control Outdoor Module, On/Off, 1 Outlet with Weather-Resistant Outlet Cover, Plug-In, Zwave Hub Required- Works with SmartThings Wink and Alexa, 14284 - - Amazon.com
 
ctmomof2 said:
Do I understand correctly that the light plugs into the outlet? Would this work? I use it for my Christmas lights and works great.

GE Z-Wave Plus Smart Lighting & Appliance Control Outdoor Module, On/Off, 1 Outlet with Weather-Resistant Outlet Cover, Plug-In, Zwave Hub Required- Works with SmartThings Wink and Alexa, 14284 GE Z-Wave Plus Smart Lighting Appliance Control Outdoor Module, On/Off, 1 Outlet with Weather-Resistant Outlet Cover, Plug-In, Zwave Hub Required- Works with SmartThings Wink and Alexa, 14284 - - Amazon.com
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chiefwej said:
Where is the switch? I have my lights protected by a GFCI outlet, but the power is pulled from the protected side of the outlet and then fed to a switch than controls the light. I just replaced that switch with a hub free smart switch.
Smart Switch by MartinJerry | Compatible with Alexa, Smart Home Devices Works with Google Home, No Hub required, Easy installation and App control as Smart Switch On/Off / Timing (2 Pack) - - Amazon.com

How do you currently turn the light on and off?
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No, currently the circuit breaker feeds a GFCI outlet, the light is then hardwired into this outlet, not plugged in. My understanding is this is done for safety reason so the light will trip if there is a ground fault. I turn on the light by turning the circuit breaker on, which then feeds the outlet and in turn the lights.
 
My solution is merely an all-weather “smart” extension of an outlet. I use my iPhone exclusively to turn on/off (via SmartThings hub and app).

If you have a smart-switch wired up already, can’t you just use the native app for that switch via your phone to control?

Edit: I was replying to the wrong person. Sorry. This sounds like it’s going to require an electrician. Following!
 
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I don’t know who wired you pool, but using a breaker as a light switch is not an acceptable practice. Where is the outlet located, and is there a place to add a standard switch between it and the light? Take a look at my system. Is yours similar?

Alexa pool control on a shoestring budget




3F9CD1AD-7210-4290-A095-B9C500BB826C.jpg
 
Yes, you need to add a smart switch in between the outlet and the light. It'll be the cheaper and better solution, and retain the outlet. I doubt the smart outlet would even be a solution. Typically they are switching the outlets on and off, and so the things you plug into them, not things wired to them in the box.

Is the outlet built in to a wall, or is it in a box to which you have access to the sides and bottom? Can you post a picture of it? If you have access to the box, where you can add a piece of conduit and another box, then you put your smart switch in the new box, and wire it to the light and existing outlet. You'll end up with a nice place to turn the light on and off manually, plus the smart switch capabilities, you'll retain your outlet, you'll be able to stay out of your breaker panel, and everything will still be GFCI protected (if you wire it correctly).
 
Thanks guys. There is no switch currently so it looks like I will need to install one. Attached is the only I picture I currently have. Hot wire is coming in directly from the breaker, then it goes out to the light.

Imgur: The magic of the Internet

I tried uploading this but it wouldn't let me upload the image.

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chiefwej said:
- - - Updated - - -

I don’t know who wired you pool, but using a breaker as a light switch is not an acceptable practice. Where is the outlet located, and is there a place to add a standard switch between it and the light? Take a look at my system. Is yours similar?

Alexa pool control on a shoestring budget




View attachment 87815
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Is the breaker for the light GFCI?
 
Yep, perfect. Leave that outlet in place. See that knockout just under the outlet? Punch it out and you can run a piece of conduit right out of there, to another waterproof junction box, and install your smart switch in the new box. Pull some wires back to your breaker box and wire it in. The new box can be 1/2" below the breaker box, or you could run it anywhere you want, like closer to the pool, or wherever.
 
Dirk said:
Yep, perfect. Leave that outlet in place. See that knockout just under the outlet? Punch it out and you can run a piece of conduit right out of there, to another waterproof junction box, and install your smart switch in the new box. Pull some wires back to your breaker box and wire it in. The new box can be 1/2" below the breaker box, or you could run it anywhere you want, like closer to the pool, or wherever.
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So currently it's breaker to outlet to light, and it should be breaker to outlet to switch to light? I need to keep the outlet in play to maintain ground fault protection?
 

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Yes, the outlet is providing the protection. Don't mess with, or connect anything to the line side of the GFCI. Both the switch and the light need to be wired to the load side of the outlet. To be accurate, the switch is wired in series with the light, on the load side of the outlet. But the switch will also need a neutral wire (at least the smart switches I use do), which must also come off the load side of the GFCI. If any of that doesn't make sense, consider hiring a licensed electrician to do the add on. One experienced with pool wiring. Mis-wiring a pool light is not like it is for a porch light. You get it wrong on the porch, and you might get a short and a popped breaker. You get it wrong in the pool and somebody could get hurt (or worse)! Please be careful and don't work outside of your limits.
 
Dirk said:
Yes, the outlet is providing the protection. Don't mess with, or connect anything to the line side of the GFCI. Both the switch and the light need to be wired to the load side of the outlet. To be accurate, the switch is wired in series with the light, on the load side of the outlet. But the switch will also need a neutral wire (at least the smart switches I use do), which must also come off the load side of the GFCI. If any of that doesn't make sense, consider hiring a licensed electrician to do the add on. One experienced with pool wiring. Mis-wiring a pool light is not like it is for a porch light. You get it wrong on the porch, and you might get a short and a popped breaker. You get it wrong in the pool and somebody could get hurt (or worse)! Please be careful and don't work outside of your limits.
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I think I got you. I'm definitely going to have an electrician come out. But I may try and wire it myself first and just turn off the breaker until they can come out and review. Can you tell me if this looks good to you?

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Dirk said:
Yes, you need to add a smart switch in between the outlet and the light. It'll be the cheaper and better solution, and retain the outlet.
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My feeling also. Contemplated-ing this myself. You’re better off punching out a punch-out on your breaker box and adding a new junction box and put smart switch in there so it’s coming off the Load end of your GFCI. Get some appropriately colored wire length (should be 12 gauge) for your hot line -available by the foot at HDepot. And you should be able to just basically bypass the hot wire (black or whichever is not-white/neutral) and connect just that (& ground) to the switch so that’s what turns it on/off.
 
KDpoolguy said:
My feeling also. Contemplated-ing this myself. You’re better off punching out a punch-out on your breaker box and adding a new junction box and put smart switch in there so it’s coming off the Load end of your GFCI. Get some appropriately colored wire length (should be 12 gauge) for your hot line -available by the foot at HDepot. And you should be able to just basically bypass the hot wire (black or whichever is not-white/neutral) and connect just that (& ground) to the switch so that’s what turns it on/off.
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The OP has his install plan. And he's got his wiring diagram. So that's covered. But I need to correct one thing: the gauge of the wire is determined by the breaker, and is not automatically 12 gauge. If the breaker feeding the outlet and light is 15 amps, he'd use 14 gauge. If the breaker is 20 amps, then he'd use 12 gauge. There are exceptions to this rule (otherwise known as building code), but unless he's running the wires to the other end of his property, it's 15A = 14G and 20A = 12G.
 
If I pulled the cover off my box you would see that the two smart switches in the middle are wired just like that. Look along the right side of my box and you will see there is a GFCI outlet there with a transformer plugged into it. That outlet is providing the GFCI protection for both the pool and spa lights. Your box is the same setup, but doesn’t have the space for the switches, so you will have to add a weather tight box to house the switch.
 
chiefwej said:
If I pulled the cover off my box you would see that the two smart switches in the middle are wired just like that. Look along the right side of my box and you will see there is a GFCI outlet there with a transformer plugged into it. That outlet is providing the GFCI protection for both the pool and spa lights. Your box is the same setup, but doesn’t have the space for the switches, so you will have to add a weather tight box to house the switch.
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What is the purpose of the transformer in your setup? Is it to reduce the voltage of the pool light?
 
Follow up question for all of you smart folks: are you aware of any cool "smart bulbs" to replace to existing halogen? I currently have a smart things hub which I am using for everything else. Would be great if there was a bulb out there that would let you change colors, dim levels, etc from the smart things app!

EDIT:
Also, wow this experience has me going down the rabbit hole! Now I am concerned that my pool is not properly bonded as it was built in 1954. I am having an electrician come out on Friday to check everything out.
 
kevin007 said:
What is the purpose of the transformer in your setup? Is it to reduce the voltage of the pool light?
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The transformer has nothing to do with the pool, it’s for landscape lighting. I was just pointing out the location of the outlet.
 

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