IC40 in cold weather

Jump to latest Follow Reply
B

bparker

0
Dec 8, 2015
44
Dallas, TX
is there a different SWG that has better cold weather performance than Pentair?

This is my first winter after adding SWG. I added salt to my pool when "opening" it a couple weeks ago. (This is Dallas so it never really closes, but I pay less attention to chemicals over the winter.) From Feb. to March my EasyTouch reported that salt level went from 2250 to 1050 ppm. I ultimately added 400# salt and reported level only got to 2550. I had water tested at Leslie's and they showed 3500 ppm. I called Pentair and they confirmed what was reported in this thread...
https://www.troublefreepool.com/threads/94103-IC40-shows-0-salt-but-cell-on
Thank you for contacting Pentair. In response to your inquiry, the cell reads accurate salinity at 77F. For every degree off from 77F, the cell will miss read salinity to a factor of 70PPM. For example, if the salt content in your pool is at 3300PPM and water temp is at 50F.. the cell will read salinity at 1410PPM giving a low salt condition in error. If the water is at or near 77F and you are getting low salt condition and no chlorine production... this would indicate that the flow/temp sensor may need to be replaced (part number 520736).

That calculation works out perfectly for my 63 F water. Problem is, no chlorine is produced below 2600-2700 ppm and I don't want my "real" salt level much higher So two questions.
1. If I get barely over the threshold for generating chlorine (even though actual salt level is high) will chlorine production be normal, or will it be limited?
2. Is there another SWG that works better in lower temps?

Since my IC40 is pretty new, I will hang on for now with bleach, but looking to the future when SWG needs to be replaced.

Bill.
 
Bill,

The temperature sensor in the Flow Switch assembly should compensate for the error when not at 77 degrees... So if your actual salt level is 3500 and your cell reports anything outside of +/- 600 ppm, than Pentair should come out and replace your flow switch under warranty... they did for me twice...

I am not certain if there is a better SWCG or not, but it matters little since no other SWCG will work with your EasyTouch or ScreenLogic...

I have three IC40's and two of them have never had a failure of the temperature sensor... While the unit at my house has failed about three times in almost 4 years... The only difference I can visually see between the three cells, is that the two that I installed have about a foot or more of straight pipe before the flow switch, while the one at my house has a 90 degree elbow almost right at the cell. My "theory" is that this causes water turbulence that shakes the temp sensor in the flow switch... It is more of a guess than a theory, but I would be curious how your IC40 is installed.

Thanks,

Jim R.

- - - Updated - - -

I have a Taylor K-1766 salt test kit so I know exactly what my salt level is... The chances of Leslie's being any where close to right are remote at best... :p
 
Jim,

I have 9" straight pipe to the IC40, then a 45 to a multi-port valve. I was trying to get a much straight as I could when it was installed.

I asked the Pentair guy I talked to today about temperature compensation and he said it was a known issue for 10-12 years! The Pentair quote above also seems the same.

When your water temp gets in the 50s you still get a reasonably accurate salt reading from ScreenLogic? I agree about Leslie's, but my calculation of what I calculated salt should be after 400# was reasonably close to their reading.

I can try Pentair again tomorrow and see if I get a different response.

Bill.
 
Bill,

ScreenLogic does nothing but display what the cell reports... If the water temp is below 52 degrees the cell should shut off with a "Cold" light on the cell. This is about how all salt cells work...

Once the temp gets in the 60's the cell should report within +/-600 ppm what the salt level is... I tend not to pay any attention to what the cell says unless the temp is above 60 or 65 degrees.

Basically the cell only looks at the salt level twice a day.. so if it tests in the morning when the temp is low, that is reading that you will see for 12 hours.. So until the morning water temps are warm enough to allow the cell to work, I just keep using Liquid chlorine... I have been using the SWCG's this year for "about" a month now on all three pools...

Your 9" pipe kind of rules out my theory... :p Thanks for the info..

Make sure you tell Pentair that your cell is reporting salt levels that are outside the allowable tolerance that is published in their manual... and that you would like them to replace your "faulty" flow switch assembly under warranty...

Thanks,

Jim R.
 
I re-installed my IC40 the first week of March, in the Dallas area. At 55 degree water it was reading 2900 ppm and making chlorine. My drops test was 3100. Now my water temp is in the low 60's and the unit reads around 3000 to 3200. This unit appears to work at slightly colder temps than my first unit. Cycling the power will get it to read the salt level, something I used to do with my older unit to get it making chlorine after the water temp warmed up in the morning. As mentioned above it will read it twice during the day on its own. You may have a sensor going bad.
 
Well, no joy from talking to Pentair again. A different person doubled down saying my unit is OK and I need to wait till water is somewhere in the 60s before the readings get better. She had "no idea" why the manual says reported salt level should be accurate to +/- 500 ppm. She can't account for what manual writers do. Report may be off by 80 ppm (previous guy said 70 ppm) per degree, so my flow switch is probably fine. She also could not say why the 70-80 ppm adjustment figure is not in the manual.
 
Bill,

I am surprised!!... on the other hand I never called Pentair... I called my Pool builder and within a couple of days a Pentair Service Center tech came out a replaced the flow switch without any questions.

Maybe it is a time of the year thing.

Sorry....

Jim R.
 
A follow-up on this.

I got the Taylor K-1766 kit which gave me a reading of 4500 ppm vs. Leslies Pool store reading of 3500 and IC40 reading of 2600. My pool re-modeler gave me the name of the local Pentair rep, who I called. She said that NO method would give accurate reading till water is around 77 F. But that test strips (+- 500 ppm) are much more accurate than the Taylor drop test (+- 12-1500 ppm). So after pool warms up, call her if there is still a problem. But for now she sees no problem with the IC40.

Oddly, she said she had no knowledge if warming the sample water to 77 F would solve the accuracy problem! A redo of the Taylor drop test with warmed water gives 4800 ppm.

My pool is now 68F and chlorine is being made, so at least there is that.

Reading other threads here, the Aquacheck strips seem well regarded, but I also saw no problems with the Taylor kit? Not sure what to believe at this point.
 

Enjoying this content?

Support TFP with a donation.

Give Support
I've always used the aquachek strips and they've been fine for me. I'm more of a "in the ballpark" on the salt. I'm most interested in seeing green lights on my cell and not all that interested in how many ppm of salt are really in my pool.

My IC40 is in its 7th swim season and I've pretty much given up on trying to get it to reliably make chlorine when the water temp is under 70. As soon as I get the first or second low salt error in the fall and the water is 70 or lower I shut it off and switch to bleach. I don't turn it back on until the water is back above 70 reliably.
 
  • Like
Reactions: LSU
Mine is wired to its own timer and I take the "on" dog off the timer wheel so it is powered off. No, pH does not continue to increase when the cell is off, it is the aeration when the cell is on and making chlorine that increases pH. I do have a dummy blank but I never seem to use it. :)
 
62F water
My IC40 says 3300PPM
K1766 says 3400PPM
cell life reads 20% (2000 hour used)
My IC40 has been shutting down from cold water at about 57F +/- 2F

If they have a temperature sensor and it does not do temperature compensation, they are disgusting as Engineers. Ridiculous.

I can say for a fact, that phone support people will sometimes make up their own minds on stuff and spew out stuff the Engineers don't authorize. Then they will not do anything to stop them. Once those service guys see just one unit reading say 80ppm/degree, they say they all do that.
 
I think that the earlier versions did not have temperature sensors and therefore no temperature compensation. If a rep reads old literature, then they will not be accurate for the new cells.

The new cells do have temperature sensors and temperature compensation.

The sensors are prone to failure. When the sensor fails and it's obvious to the software that the sensor has failed, it defaults to a standard temperature of 77 f.

Pressing and holding the “More” button on Intellichlor launches the System Status Mode. When the lights finish scrolling, the percent lights indicate hours of usage in 1,000s. For example, if the 40% light lights, that indicates 4,000 hours.

Version 3.1 on adds the ability to determine system temperature. Pressing the “More” button after the display shows 1,000s of hours of usage, will show temperature as follows:

Lights…………….....………Temperature
No LEDs………….…..………Below 30F
40%..........................36 to 45F
40% and 60%............46 to 55F
60%..........................56 to 65F
60% and 80%............66 to 75F
80%.........................76 to 85F
80 and 100%............86 to 95F
100%.......................96 to 99F
100% blinking……..….over 99F
All LEDs blinking……...Sensor bad
 
I suspect that the problem in this case is that the temperature sensor is bad and reading higher than actual.

This gives an even bigger error than a completely failed sensor because the unit is using a higher temperature than 77 f to calculate salinity.

I suspect that the unit thinks that the temperature is over 80 f.

Check the temperature by the above procedure to find out. I suspect that it will show temperature over 80 or failed sensor.

I suspect that, if you cut the temperature wires, the salinity reading would improve because it defaults to 77f.

In any case, you probably need a new flow/temperature switch.

How old is the cell?

Is there a date and version number on the bottom sticker?
 
I bought my IC40 a little over a year ago. The date on the sticker is 09/09/2016 and Rev is 3110. When I do the More button I get 20%. Another quick press of More does nothing. A long press goes back through the flashing lights and then 20%. So it seems I don't have temperature, but is my cell new enough so it should have it?
 
Press the More button until the lights scroll. Then, you should get the 20%. Then, quickly press the More button again and see what lights come on.

Did all lights flash or did no lights flash?
 
After the long press, the % lights scrolled and other lights flashed, then 20% stayed on. Another quick press of More and no lights changed, just stayed on 20%. Another long press of More and it goes back through scroll, flash, 20%.
 

Enjoying this content?

Support TFP with a donation.

Give Support
You must log in or register to reply here.
Thread Status
Hello , This thread has been inactive for over 60 days. New postings here are unlikely to be seen or responded to by other members. For better visibility, consider Starting A New Thread.
Top Bottom
Back
Jump to latest Follow Reply