Pentair Rebel vacuum no longer working

[miltymoots]

Hi guys

First off - pool newbie here, first time owner or a quite gorgeous pool in sunny Southern California.

I seem to be having a problem with my Pentair Rebel, its not moving around the pool during the scheduled time. I can hear the pump kick in at the scheduled time, ramping up the RPM - but it goes nowhere. It worked fine when I moved in 2 weeks ago...

I have a pool guy that comes, he thought it might be the schedules or the suction valve, he adjusted - but no changes, it almost seems even more sluggish now.

This seemed to happen when I did the following: unplugged the cleaner hose from the inlet, and took the hose and the vacuum out of the pool. I noticed by doing that the pool status changed to "bad flow", because the cap had closed on the cleaner inlet. I couldn't re-open it as the suction was too strong, so turned off the pool pump to reattach. (this all happened in ~2-3 mins).

As a novice, on restarting the pool I noticed still it had bad flow error and lots of red statuses for salt levels etc. Little did I know that after 1-2 mins these would naturally go away. So instead of waiting, I panic and turn it off again. I thought I needed to reprime so after a quick google it says I need to fill the pump trap up with water, release any air in the system to prime and restart... I do all of this, system comes back to life after 1-2 mins with all green signals... sigh.

Anyway - since then its been no good. The pool guy came 2 days ago and checked the schedules and suction valve, but it made no difference.

Have I broken something? Where should I start? I've read so many articles about fixing this issue but they all point to air leaks or blocked baskets - I feel like I did this rather than something broke... maybe I didn't.

Any advice to a newcomer? Thanks all,

steve

 

[Jimrahbe]

Steve,

Welcome to TFP... A great resource for all your rebellious questions.

Your Rebel Cleaner is what is called a "Suction Side" cleaner.

These don't normally run all the time so if you are scheduling it to turn on I would suspect that a valve must open to allow the suction to be diverted from the pool skimmer to the Suction port the Rebel is plugged into.

Please post a couple of pics of the equipment pad showing the valves that connect to the input of the pump.

It would also help if you can tell us more about what equipment you have...

What type of automation system?

What type of salt system?

What type of pump? Do you have more than one pump?

I doubt you have broken anything, but there are so many different pool configurations and equipment types, it is hard to provide the help you want unless we know all the facts..

Thanks,

Jim R.

- - - Updated - - -

And.. what type of filter.. and when was the last time it was cleaned???

 

[miltymoots]

Hi Jim

Thanks - and definitely here's more:

Schedules: Pool pump is on 0900-1500 (6 hrs) daily, cleaner is on 1100-1300 (2 hours) daily. So effectively they run at same time for those 2 hours - assume that is ok? The hot tub spillway runs 0900-1030 too.

Here's some pics of the equipment.


I have a Pentair Easytouch control system and Pentair Clean & Clear Plus cartridge filter CCP420. I think its not been cleaned since it was installed less than 12 months ago. I would have to follow up with pool guy as I am new to the property (and he carried over).

Did I answer everything with this info so far?

steve

 

[Jimrahbe]

Steve,

I was looking to see if the valve that controls your cleaner was automated and in the wrong position. But it is not automated.. (I would not worry about that now, but having an automation system without automating the cleaner valve does not make sense to me.)

I don't see anything wrong with how the valves are positioned as long as you have the vacuum hooked up. If you want to remove the cleaner you need to turn the valve so that the cleaner port is closed off and skimmer is fully open.

My guess is that your filter is dirty. I suggest that you turn the valve so that the vacuum is off and the skimmer is fully on. Then see what the filter gauge reads with the pump running at about 2800 to 3000 rpm.

With the type of cleaner you have all the dirt and leaves that it picks up go directly into the filter. It would not take long to fill it up.

The filter gauge reads the amount of effort it takes to push water through it. The dirtier the filter is the harder it is for the pump to push the water through it.

I don't know much about the Rebel, but it appears that it has an speed adjustment fitting that is supposed to be between the vacuum port and the cleaner hose. If you have this fitting, it could be clogged.

Thanks,

Jim R.

 

[ZcottD]

You probably have something stuck in it, either the speed adjustment piece that Jim mentioned or in the main unit inside the throat, around the gearing. Open it up and give it a cleaning.

 

[GregInClaremont]

Miltymoots, Any resolution to the problem with your Rebel?

 

[miltymoots]

sorry guys - been away on business.

no resolution I am afraid. I checked with my pool guy and he said that the filter was cleaned ~6m ago. Took the Rebel apart, nothing in there to stop it working. Pool guy thinks there must be some wood chips its sucked up caught in one of the 90 degree pipes that is causing issues with the suction. Possibility as previous owners dog did like to kick plenty of wood chips into the pool.

Options now are him moving the rebel to the skimmer temporarily and hoping the wood chips break up (if thats the issue), or he also offered to blast the pipes with carbon dioxide (?) to remove any blockages in a future visit.

So right now I am doing nothing as its the cold season, but he suggested to wait till spring... thoughts?

 

[mknauss]

Clean versus current pressure determines if the filter needs to be cleaned, not time. Once you reach 25% above clean pressure it is time to clean the filter.

I would not use pressurized gas to blow out a line. The chance of overpressure and causing a pipe failure is too high for me.

 

[miltymoots]

Quick question - the pump trap - I can change the valve to allow more suction to the cleaner, but it reduces the water level in the pump trap. If I set it to the indicator arrow position the water is pretty much at the top of the trap with a few bubbles, if I give the cleaner more suction the water level drops in the trap to about half way or more. Where should it be? Any rights/wrongs here?

Pressure is at around 12 psi at the indicator level of the suction valve.

 

[mknauss]

By pump 'trap' I assume you mean its basket. If the water level drops that implies your suction is plugged. So the idea of something in that line could be true.

You should not have bubbles in the pump basket and if you do there is a suction side air leak, normally the pump basket lid that has not been lubed. Rarely do pool maintenance people lube that gasket.

What was the clean filter pressure? If 10 psi or less, then your filter needs cleaning.

Take care.

 

[miltymoots]

A quick update. Pool guy came in today and moved the Rebel to the pool skimmer line. Good news is now the Rebel is going crazy cleaning everywhere so I can be sure its not the problem. Bad news is it looks like there is definitely something up with the cleaner suction line.

 

[rp7777]

break up some chlorine tablets in different size pieces and place it in the suction line one at a time. Start with a small piece to see if it makes it all the way to the basket, if it does then place a larger piece and work your way up to larger ones. See if it gets stuck and if it does then you know there is a blockage. It won't make is worse because the chlorine chunk will dissolve on its own. At least then, you will know there is a clog and then you have to figure out how to clear out the real clog.