Breakpoint chlorination

before the FC drops to a swimmable level

Your pool is safe to swim in with FC at or below shock level for your CYA, you can see the bottom of the pool, and your pH is between 7.2 and 7.8
 
I maintain FC=7-9 with a cya of 50 - 60 and still get the beginning of visible algae in low circulation areas of the pool even with 0.0 CC. I just brush, raise the chlorine to a little over 10ppm and run the filter for 24 hours and the algae doesn't come back for a few days. I don't believe that I need to raise the FC to 24 each time I see algae.

The 24ppm shock level at 60cya seems to be an ambiguous number to me. What is it derived from or how do we come to that particular number considering that our FC is always killing algae at any level. I seem to be able to control the algae at much lower FC level and I don't have to wait for very long before the FC drops to a swimmable level.

Mike.

See joyfulnoise's response in post #19 above
 
If you COMPLETE a SLAM Process, then you never let FC get below the minimum for your CYA [FC/CYA][/FC/CYA], the algae doesn't come back. That's what the others are saying. With out completing a SLAM it clears but doesn't kill all the algae.
 
I maintain FC=7-9 with a cya of 50 - 60 and still get the beginning of visible algae in low circulation areas of the pool even with 0.0 CC. I just brush, raise the chlorine to a little over 10ppm and run the filter for 24 hours and the algae doesn't come back for a few days. I don't believe that I need to raise the FC to 24 each time I see algae.

The 24ppm shock level at 60cya seems to be an ambiguous number to me. What is it derived from or how do we come to that particular number considering that our FC is always killing algae at any level. I seem to be able to control the algae at much lower FC level and I don't have to wait for very long before the FC drops to a swimmable level.

Mike.

Honestly it sounds like you are not able to control the algae your way as you say the algae "doesn't come back for a few days". The purpose of the SLAM process and 40% FC / CYA ratio is so that algae NEVER comes back. This is the "light at the end of the tunnel " that the TFP methods provides. You actually don't have to "deal" with algae, you eradicate it ant it doesn't come back.
 
I have been maintaining 7 - 9 FC which is what is recommended by the FC/CYA chart and I still get algae. I understand that you all say that the pool is safe with FC up to but below shock level but I am not comfortable with that.

Through the years I have maintained FC at 5 or less and just brushed and shocked for algae and it worked for me. Now that I have been following TFT procedures and maintaining 7-9 FC , 50-60 CYA and PH stable at 7.2 I am still seeing occasional algae and my wife is complaining of burning eyes for the first time.

Mike.

- - - Updated - - -

I should add that when I was maintaining a minimum FC=9 I did not get algae.

Mike.
 
Burning eyes is more often a symptom of pH issues, not FC. At least, that's what has been found over the years.

That is what I have read too. Is low or high ph more likely to burn eyes? For years I measured with test strips and never had any complaints. Now that I'm monitoring closely she is complaining.

- - - Updated - - -

I have always felt that the less chemicals I put in the water the better. Becasue of this I have kept FC between 3 - 5ppm and used the brush on the walls once in a while. Then once a week or so I would elevate the FC to 15 or so and I've been doing that for years.

I know that if I maintain FC at 10ppm or so that I'll not have algae but I'm just not comfortable with doing that.

Mike.
 
Well, in the end, it is your pool. TFP just wants to make sure you know what the different chems do and how to make it as troublefree as possible. You are free to do what works best for you as long as you understand that clean, clear water isn't necessarily safe and sanitized.
 
I maintain FC=7-9 with a cya of 50 - 60 and still get the beginning of visible algae in low circulation areas of the pool even with 0.0 CC.

This is your problem more than anything else.

Just because you test your FC and find it at the correct levels does not mean that this number is the FC everywhere in your pool. In low circulation areas it is easy for algae growth rates to exceed chlorine kill rates. As a personal example, I have a waterfall with a partial stone ledge that is submerged in only 2" of water. There is a rock embedded in the wall near it. Right at the water line where the mortar joint is holding the rock in place I get a very tiny patch of green. It's standard green algae and it's able to grow because the FC in that area is lower than in the bulk of the pool water. However, it stays confined to that tiny little patch and never grows any larger.

Improving circulation and maintaining the correct FC/CYA ratio is the best way to avoid algae of any kind. As I said, the 40% was chosen using two constraints - making the amount of chlorine high enough to totally overwhelm the algae growth rates BUT low enough so as to not damage liners or plaster colors. There's nothing especially magical about 40%. One could use 60% or 80% and get even faster kill rates. One can use 20% and get lower kill rates. 40% was chosen simply to strike a balance and allow a pool owner the ability to clear a pool in a reasonable time frame.

In fact, if a pool for some reason bottomed out in FC and got a little cloudy, 40% might not be necessary at all. For water that is a little hazy from having too low a chlorine level, 20% FC/CYA ratio could easily cure it as well. Again, 40% was chosen for efficacy, safety and consistency. TFP does not want to teach people, like the pool stores do, to just blindly throw in whatever amount of chlorine and hope it all works out. Consistent application of chlorine both as a cure (SLAM process) and as a preventative maintenance measure (testing and maintaining daily chlorine levels) is what we teach...not the pool store "dump and pray" methodology.

As for shocking weekly, yes you can maintain a pool that way. However, it is typically more costly to do so. Consistent levels of chlorine over long periods of time uses less chlorine overall than allowing FC to fluctuate and then blasting the pool with shock. Would you rather drive in a car where the driver maintains a consistent 40MPH or a driver that slams on the gas, goes 0-60MPH in 4 secs and then slams on the breaks when he reaches a stop sign? Which way of driving is better for the life of the car and the passengers inside??

As for burning eye, these are the three main factors -

1. pH outside the 7.2-7.8 range
2. CCs too high
3. Rubbing your eyes too much - you should blink when you come up from the water, not rub your eyes.
 

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Regarding circulation -

I have a 16x32 inground pool and the two return ports are near each end of the same long wall. This setup doesn't circulate well especially in the corners adjacent to the ports.

I ordered two of the following and will see if it helps

https://www.amazon.com/Infusion-V-f...F8&qid=1503342463&sr=8-4&keywords=pool+return

I've allso seen rotating jets that I may try down the road.

Mike.
Mike, let us know how well they work for you. good luck.
 
IMO, your issue is likely less a problem with circulation as it is with never properly completing the SLAM process until you pass the 3 criteria to stop so that you know the algae is eradicated and you can stay ahead of it with normal maintenance FC levels. Only 1 way to find out ....
 
IMO, your issue is likely less a problem with circulation as it is with never properly completing the SLAM process until you pass the 3 criteria to stop so that you know the algae is eradicated and you can stay ahead of it with normal maintenance FC levels. Only 1 way to find out ....

I can't agree with that. I had approx 0.5ppm loss oclt for two nights in a row with near 0 CC and very clear water. I was only losing about 1ppm FC in a 24 hour period with full sunlight. At the time I had 30ppm cya and as soon as I let the FC drop to 6.5ppm I got a little algae in a corner.

With cya=60 and CC=0.4 yesterday evening I raised the FC to 12. This evening the FC was 11ppm and I added 2 cups calhypo which I figure should get me up above 15ppm. The filter is running 24 hour per day. It seems to me that this should kill the little algae that I have.

Mike.
 
Perhaps a further discussion of the algae issue belongs in the Algae Prevention Sub-forum. We're no longer talking about the original topic anymore.
 
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