New Construction: Cathedral City CA

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Yorker

Silver Supporter
Apr 22, 2017
489
Cathedral City, CA
Hello All,

I have been educating myself with TFP for the past couple months. Ya'all are awesome. I've learned so much and have so much more to learn :). We're in the final stages of choosing our PB and have asked for revised quotes since we changed a few specs. A number of PB gave very vague details in their initial quotes, so in this second round of quotes we asked that they all include the name and model number of all equipment.

In this weekend TPF reading I am reminded of the importance of the equipment pad. I'm a very detail oriented person and the sight of some of the examples of "bad pads" has my stomach tied in knots.

Here are my questions at this point:

1 - Should I ask and expect to see photos of PB previous equipment installs before signing a contract?

2 - Is it standard practice to expect a comprehensive diagram/layout of the equipment pad layout that I sign off on. Will I be the client from "heck" if I demand that written into the contract?

3 - How narrow can the cement pad be? I'm hoping for no wider than 3 feet deep. It can be between 8 to 12 feet long.

I've included a layout of the project.

Thanks in Advance,
York

BY PLANS 16.jpg
 
Welcome!
1. That would be nice. Referrals too -- maybe you could go see a couple.
2. Nope - ask for it. Nothing seems to be standard with pool builders. Not a very structured service.
3. My pad is about 3' by 6'. Yours should not need to be larger. Be sure none of your pipes come up through the cement pad. Just the equipment should be sitting on your pad.
4. Order your test kit way early. TFTestkits.net
Good luck!
 
Thanks MK,

I have read a number references to the Testkit, Just ONE more thing I need to learn about.

You mention to order it early ... why does it take a long time in shipping, or do I need to test our tap water a month or two before they fill the pool? I guess I see a TFP search this afternoon.

York
 
By ordering it early it gives you a chance to test your tap water a few times and get familiar with all the test so when your pool is full your ready to go.
Trust me sometimes the build is slow then BAM work happens in a furry and your pool is filling and if you don't have your test kit it will be the farthest thing from your mind. So do yourself a favor and kit it soon and don't forget the speedstir :)
 
I intend on maintaining the pool myself so I do need to learn about the chemistry involved. I was planing on using the testing service at Leslie Pools. I hear from many people down here that's that the place to go. Might Leslie's testing service be a good place to start for a newbie?
 
Yorker said:
I intend on maintaining the pool myself so I do need to learn about the chemistry involved. I was planing on using the testing service at Leslie Pools. I hear from many people down here that's that the place to go. Might Leslie's testing service be a good place to start for a newbie?
Click to expand...

The majority of the people on this forum would disagree. They just cannot give you the accuracy or repeat-ability of doing your own testing. YOU care about your pool, they really do not.

Please fully read through Pool School, a couple times. Concentrate on the Saltwater section. Also realize you will continually need to add acid to combat your high TA/CH water and to manage your CSI. Study the CSI parts of Pool School.

Take care.
 
Once you start practicing you will get he hang of it very easy. I just read the instructions EVERY time I test lol. I made a little testing station on my counter and I have also text my buddy IMAZ several times to make sure I was doing it right, and poor guy has been patient with me every time lol.
So your good friends here will help you don't worry
 
You will be fine, and if some issue pops up, you have TFP to help! I don't charge as much as the others here (I'm not an expert, you get what you pay for), so contact me first, K? Just kidding!!!! That's the beauty of TFP - it's all free and membership is optional although greatly appreciated.

Your questions in blue with my answers.

1 - Should I ask and expect to see photos of PB previous equipment installs before signing a contract? Some PB's keep a portfolio with pictures of their builds, others do not. It would be nice to see his range of builds - simple to the grand? different water features? different materials used? I definitely would want to see in person several pools he's built (the PB will show you his best pools, and why wouldn't he, right?) Still, if his best doesn't suit you, then you've learned a lot. I would also want references for some of the Pool Owners who used his company. I dropped a PB right away when I called and the owner told me the PB was hardly ever at the build sight (many aren't around much), and the supervisor who was in charge was lazy and not very good answering questions. Find out who you will deal with the most and who will be checking the site the most.

2 - Is it standard practice to expect a comprehensive diagram/layout of the equipment pad layout that I sign off on. Will I be the client from "heck" if I demand that written into the contract? [[ Hmm, newbie here - I see can't use "H*LL", I 'll have to re-calibrate my profanity :-]] I haven't seen a diagram of the equipment pad in a contract, but most people have the model numbers for each piece of equipment specified in the contract. Be sure to look up those model numbers before you sign off on it. You want to make sure no mistakes are made on the contract by whoever writes it up - accidentally or on purpose. Also, you can post the equipment brand and model #'s here, and the experts will let you know if they think any changes should be made.


3 - How narrow can the cement pad be? I'm hoping for no wider than 3 feet deep. It can be between 8 to 12 feet long. A 3' wide equipment pad sounds good to me, but let others from TFP tell you what they think. The size of your equipment pad would be a good thing to put into the contract. To give the PB some wiggle room and so you to get what you want, I would request a minimum width (and maybe a maximum width since you're more limited on the width - you want to be able to stand in front of the pad to work) and a minimum length. I'm not sure if a minimum depth is needed. That way, you'll get at least what you want and maybe longer if the PB thinks it is needed. Once you list your equipment with model numbers, you can ask what people here think would be a good size pad. It's not unusual for a PB to make them just big enough to squeeze everything on. That can make repairs difficult. You want it laid out so it's comfortable for repairmen or whoever may need to make repairs.


You have a great design! When you can, consider becoming a member of TFP, but it's not required. I found that TFP saved me money by helping me get just what I needed in equipment for my size pool. Oversized and your electric bill could be higher than necessary, too small and the equipment won't last as long or do the job efficiently. I also found the advice I got here saved me some potential headaches in the future. Membership payment is a one time thing and small compared to what TFP saved me. You can click here for more info about becoming a member:
CLICK HERE to Become a TroubleFreePool.com Supporter!!

Let me know if you have any questions about my answers!!!

Take care,
Suz :sun:
 
Thank you! So much great advise, my head is spinning from my note taking. After some time in reading about pool chemistry, I realize that I should wait to absorb that info. After reading Suz's answers to my questions, I'm reminded that I'm still in the process of picking my PB. There will be time for chemistry later.

One of the PB I was leaving towards recently sent me their revised quote, but now I'm a bit concerned because three things I clearly specified were omitted in their revision. When I pointed them out - they resubmitted the quote they still left out one of the three items. argh!

Anyway - here is the list of equipment we're considering:
Pentair 3HP Intelliflo Variable Speed Pump: PUR-10-2000
Pentair 329 SF Cartridge Filter: PAC-05-182
Pentair 400K NG Heater: PUR-15-0736
Pentair Easytouch: 8SC-IC20 Pool/Spa control w/ Salt
Pentair Screenlogic: COM-30-0544, COM-30-2104
Waterway Skimmer: WWP-25-6200
Aquastar Autofill System: API-56-2004

LIGHTS
Pentair Globrite White LED Light 12V Dimmable (dimming levels): AMP-30-7021 / 602104
Pentair GLOBRITE Shallow Water White LED Light 12V (2 dimming levels): AMP-30-7020 / 602103 (for stairs)

But we are also considering this Jandy light because of more dimming levels
Jandy Pro Series Nicheless White LED Light (4 or 5 dimming levels): JDY-30-2491 / JLUW9W50

DECK JETS
I gave the PB these 4 possibilities for deck jets that can be adjusted from a stream to a spray.
- Pentair MagicStream Deck Jet I: 580000
- Jandy Minijets: FCMJ1000
- Deck Jet (Solid Brass): 25598-363-000
- Trio Deck Jet: 557159
But they quoted Pentair MagicStream Deck Jets II: PAC-27-0007 which I don’t think can be both Stream & Spray

SPA JETS (6 jets)
- Thread-In Gunite Jets (Gunite Jets)

ADDITIONAL OPTION FOR SPA
Pentair 1.5HP Wisperflo Pump: WFE-6 (with 6 additional jets)

 

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Some suggestions:

(1) You will learn more from seeing their work in person. Some of the things to look for: (1) Were the pipes set in concrete or pebble? Pebble is better. (2) Was the equipment set on a shock pad or cement pad. I think a shock pad is better. AC units are set on shock pads. (3) What size pipes did they use for suction and return? If you see a 3.5 pipe for every pump, that's very good.

(2) Ask for a diagram. Why not? If you want, you can even compare them to the recommended set up's in the Hayward installation manual. In retrospect, however, the better question might be to ask about the size of the pipes, including the overflow line.

(3) My equipment area is 10 by 7.5. The area is bounded by a wall, with the pool 6 feet away on the other side. I thought that was pretty large, but it is actually just enough space to bound the three sets of pipes for each pump and the gas line.
 
I suggest an IC40. Very minimal increased cost and will let you run your pump less and the cell will last longer.
 
LDVPool said:
Some suggestions:
(3) What size pipes did they use for suction and return? If you see a 3.5 pipe for every pump, that's very good.
Click to expand...

Thanks. What is the advantage for larger pipe size? I have read a few posts that suggest larger pipes, though I don't recall them being that large, I thought 2" was a standard and 2.5' was considered a better way to go. I need to read up more on pipe size.

None of the PB's have sited any pipe size. Should I expect these specs to be in the contract before signing?
 
Yorker said:
Thanks. What is the advantage for larger pipe size? I have read a few posts that suggest larger pipes, though I don't recall them being that large, I thought 2" was a standard and 2.5' was considered a better way to go. I need to read up more on pipe size.

None of the PB's have sited any pipe size. Should I expect these specs to be in the contract before signing?
Click to expand...

I should have said 3 inches earlier.

I have 3" suction lines for all the pumps, including the waterfall one. My PB did it without my asking, his explanation was that it optimizes the performance of the VS pump.

Subsequently, I googled pipe size and found other PB's saying the same thing. One even suggested that there was some relation between pipe size, the possibility of cavitation, and quiet performance.

One of the articles on pipe size even suggested that with a 3" inch suction line to the spa (and some other plumbing at the spa) you can get 10 jets without adding another pump. (I found that interesting since I opted for a separate pump for the spa.)

Recently, I also happened to be perusing the instagram account of TFP member BDavis. He recommended 2.5 suction lines at minimum and 3" preferably for the spa.
 
mknauss said:
I suggest an IC40. Very minimal increased cost and will let you run your pump less and the cell will last longer.
Click to expand...

Thanks MK, I see that others on this and other sites agree with you, and for a couple hundred dollars seems like a no brainer. May I ask what causes the IC40 to allow the pump to run for shorter times when compared to the IC20, does it pump faster?
 
No. The IC40 creates twice the amount of chlorine than the IC20 in the same amount of time. So if you need to run the IC20 (and the pump, of course) for 8 hours to create sufficient chlorine, you can run the IC40 for 4 hours.

In my 6000 gallon pool I run the IC40 for 7.5 hours at 45% setting. That creates just under 4 ppm of FC per day. I run it during the hours the sun is on the pool and thus is losing FC due to that sunlight. With our strong sun and heat here in the desert I always tend to be on the high side of FC loss. I maintain ~70 ppm CYA.

Take care.
 
Got it, and great info!

I assume with our spa, our total volume may be around 11,000 gallons. Our weather may be a tad bit warmer than Laughlin, and our pool will get sun all day long. I now see one of the PB's quoted for the IC40 and another quoted the IC20. - Again, GREAT info MK! Glad I found this site when I did.
 
There are places warmer than Laughlin, NV!?!

Forecast shows 122 start of next week -- the fun begins!!

Take care.
 

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