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Thread: Question on pool Skupper waterfall

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    Question on pool Skupper waterfall

    With our pool renovation we are going to get a waterfall. Our contractor said if we do a Skupper (20") we won''t need a pump for it and we can tie into the main. Is that common? If we do that I'd need to put a valve actuator on the line so I can control it.

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    Mod Squad Jimrahbe's Avatar
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    Re: Question on pool Skupper waterfall

    Scott,

    I have a waterfall wall with three "Rockport" waterfalls.. They have the skipper look, so I assume they are the same basic thing.

    I only have one pump and an actuator controlled valve turns the waterfall on and off.

    I have the 3 HP IntelliFlo variable speed pump. If I had a single speed pump, I would not want the waterfall to be on the main circulation system.

    I say this because when I run normally, the pump runs at 1,200 RPM and uses very little electricity. But to run the waterfall takes a bunch more power and I have to ramp the pump up to 2,900 RPM and of course it uses more electricity.

    Thanks,

    Jim R.
    Finished in 2015 - 17K Gal, IG, 20' x 25' Almost Rectangular Pool, Pebble finish, three rockport water falls. Pentair Equipment: EasyTouch 4, IC40 SWG, 3 HP VS Pump, CCP520 Cartridge Filter.
    TF100 with SpeedStir and SampleSizer, ColorQ Pro 7, Dolphin Premier Robot Cleaner, added Screen Logic 2, added small 3 person Caldera Spa.

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Re: Question on pool Skupper waterfall

    Get a separate waterfall pump. They are designed to move large volumes of water (80-120GPM) at low head. Pool pumps generate too much head on the discharge side for an open-ended water feature.

    My waterfall is in a separate plumbing loop and I am very happy it is as I would hate to have to constantly adjust speeds to get things working right.


    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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    Re: Question on pool Skupper waterfall

    Thanks Jim and Matt, sounds like differing opinions. Our contractor steered us away from a Sheered Ascent? waterfall due to the need for a pump. I have the same pump as Jim but I almost would rather have a seperate pump. My pad is tight but I plan to ditch my polaris for a robot so I have a spot/plumbing (return side) for a pump.

    - - - Updated - - -

    i really need to read up on "head" it obviously isn't what I am used to getting....

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    Mod Squad Jimrahbe's Avatar
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    Re: Question on pool Skupper waterfall

    Scott,

    Not really two different opinions...

    I was just trying to say that a single VS would work, and Matt is saying that a dedicated pump is better.

    Another advantage to a dedicated pump it that it can be plumbed to bypass the filter. So where I have to increase my speed, and get a subsequent filter pressure increase, if I had a separate waterfall pump, I would not have that problem.

    The good news for me it that I don't run my waterfall but a few minutes a day, to keep the lines chlorinated and whenever I want to show off for any guests...

    Oh!!! And good call on ditching your pressure side cleaner... See Matt's review of his new robot... https://www.troublefreepool.com/thre...-just-happened

    Thanks,

    Jim R.
    Finished in 2015 - 17K Gal, IG, 20' x 25' Almost Rectangular Pool, Pebble finish, three rockport water falls. Pentair Equipment: EasyTouch 4, IC40 SWG, 3 HP VS Pump, CCP520 Cartridge Filter.
    TF100 with SpeedStir and SampleSizer, ColorQ Pro 7, Dolphin Premier Robot Cleaner, added Screen Logic 2, added small 3 person Caldera Spa.

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    JoyfulNoise's Avatar
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    Re: Question on pool Skupper waterfall

    Jim,

    You're too kind...really, you can use adult language when referring to me, almost everyone does

    Scott,

    My opinion is just that, an opinion. Sorry if I came off sounding like know-it-all. My opinion about water features is this (and it's not based on any in-depth, hydraulic knowledge) - If it's a high head (high pressure) water feature like a bubbler, then it's ok to tie that into the pool's main filtration system. If it's a low head, high volume feature, like scuppers and waterfalls, then you're better off with a separate plumbing loop that doesn't involve a filter. Pool pumps can use a lot of power to move a moderate amount of water BUT waterfall pumps are designed to move LOTS of water with as little power as possible. So, as far as I see it, it saves you energy costs to use a pump that is appropriate for the application even if that means the build complexity is a little higher.

    Sadly, most PB's don't understand hydraulics even to that rudimentary degree....my certainly did not because he put a 3HP Pentair WhisperFlo pump on my waterfall ... a total waste of pump energy....
    Matt
    16k IG PebbleTec pool, 650gal spa, spillway and waterfall, 3HP IntelliFlo VS / 1.5HP WhisperFlo, Pentair QuadDE-100 filter, IC40 SWCG, MasterTemp 400k BTU/hr NG heater, KreepyKrauly suction-side cleaner Dolphin S300i robot, EasyTouch controls, city water, K-1001, K-2006 and K-1766 test kits, Mannitol test for borates

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