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Thread: New Build Smithfield, VA

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    New Build Smithfield, VA

    First time pool for our family and the installation has been the biggest headache of me life. The construction quality is good but the attendance of the crew has been terrible. They dug the hole on January 17th-18th and finally put the walls up a month later, and finally poured the footer along the bottom yesterday.

    I own a hardscape installation company and have renovated many pools and naturally pools have water in them when I am working around them. This company has been telling me all along that they will put the liner in last so I can install the bullnose on top of the concrete they are going to pour over the over-dig. Yesterday I received a call saying that they couldn't backfill the walls without water in the pool because it will push the walls out. The walls are a only alpha product and are the Fuzion 5010 system. I think that they are wanting to hurry along now that the equipment is on site and they have to pay for the materials soon. I am really disappointed that I am unable to put my coping on from inside the pool because I was hoping it would be easier. What are your opinions on backfilling without water in pool on this type of system. Also I was convinced that 57 stone would be the best option for backfilling but they are insisted that field sand is better because all the voids in 57 stone will retain water against the pool and could mildew. I just want to do the right thing.

    On another note I signed a contract for a Pentair ultra temp 140k btu electric heater and noticed a Hayward 140k btu heater had been delivered. All other equipment is Pentair and they have not mentioned the substitution but I think the Hayward is a cheaper unit and they are trying to pull a fast one. Would I be better off with the Pentair because of warranty and reliability of Hayward?

    Thanks in advance,

    Quentin






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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    Also I was convinced that 57 stone would be the best option for backfilling but they are insisted that field sand is better because all the voids in 57 stone will retain water against the pool and could mildew.
    57 stone is perfect for backfilling and I think I would insist on it. It actually is quite permeable and will retain no water. Sand can "wash out" in certain circumstances and 57 stone needs no compaction and will not wash. A good builder would choose #57, in my opinion.


    140k Electric heater??? I am guessing just a little but that seem woefully inadequate for what appears a fairly large pool (post your gallons). A 300-400k gas heater is a more common choice but I need to let others comment on that.
    Dave S.
    42k vinyl and concrete pool, 1.5hp pump, 140gpm filter
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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    My gut says water first to hold the walls when the backfill is added. The braces are set to the outside so the water will push against the braces. Where if you put in the backfill first there is nothing to "brace" the walls on the inside of the pool if there is no water.

    I hear what you are saying about the coping. We can help you come up with a way to make it easier to do from inside the pool when the time comes.

    Kim
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    They should fill with water first then backfill. I have a vinyl liner pool too and the liner was put in/filled w water, then backfilled, then coping (set atop a concert collar & pool frame). It was backfilled with dirt so I waited a season to let it settle. Maybe some builders backfill then liner/water but I'd much rather add water first for the reason Kim mentioned. Reach out to the pool manufacturer for advice on a proper install and insist the builder install that way. I'd worry that they would backfill then not return to put the liner in for a while. If it rains that would be even more pressure pushing into the pool w/o water in it. If you have sand or rock you won't need for it to compact.

    This will done with soon enough and it's going to be great!!!
    Inground, vinyl liner, 16 x 32 (approx. 21k gallons), roman end w/ bench, 2 Jandy LED lights
    Pump: Jandy Flopro, 1.5 hp Heater: Raypak, 266k btu (P-R266-A-EN-C; nat gas) Filter: Jandy C340 (cartridge filter) Robot: Doheny's Dolphin Discovery SWCG: Circupool RJ45

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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    Ok thanks for all of the replies. We will go ahead and put the water in first. I know the heater should probably be gas but I'm worried about the huge gas bills and only looking for a few degrees to take the chill off, it's a 30k gallon pool. Does anyone have any opinion of Hayward versus pentair?



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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    I came home today and noticed that they switched from blue glue to clear glue with no visible sign of primer. I have emailed them and asked to re-do all of the joints made today. Am I being unreasonable? it's also attached to the light niches with no primer .



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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    Quote Originally Posted by the757quentin View Post
    I came home today and noticed that they switched from blue glue to clear glue with no visible sign of primer. I have emailed them and asked to re-do all of the joints made today. Am I being unreasonable? it's also attached to the light niches with no primer .


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Just received an email stating that I needed to read the can as it doesn't require primer. I replied with the label and it says specifically to apply a primer nothing about it being optional. Clear glue is much different than blue glue. This project is a disaster.



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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    No idea if it's right or wrong but our builder back filled with stone and poured coping. Then laid liner and filled.

    18'x36' vinyl - 24k gal - Intelliflo 3hp VSP - Pentair C&C 420 cartridge filter - IC40 Salt - EasyTouch 8 - ScreenLogic - Raypak 406btu NG heater - Intellibrite 5G ligths - 4 deck jets - sheer descent - X-Stream Slide 2 - TF100 kit - opened spring 2017

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    I have a sad for you! Is there any way you can be there when they do the new work to make sure they DO us primer on the fix?

    Kim(no cheering on this one)
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    That's the problem, they show up at random times for a few hours here and there. But my wife is going to call me if the show up so we can have a Come to Jesus meeting.



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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    Quote Originally Posted by the757quentin View Post
    Just received an email stating that I needed to read the can as it doesn't require primer. I replied with the label and it says specifically to apply a primer nothing about it being optional. Clear glue is much different than blue glue. This project is a disaster.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Are you sure they didn't use primer? They also make a clear primer, which is what my plumber used.


    Build thread - 15'x30' rectangular gunite pool; 17,400 gal; 5'x8' spa raised 12" w/ 8' spillover; 10'x6' Baja shelf; Two 18" tall columns w/ 27" water bowls; Light travertine coping w/ Light 2x4' split travertine ledgestone; Jules Rustic Blue tile; Pentair IC60 SWG; Pentair IntelliFlo 2 VST; Pentair SuperFlo 1HP; Pentair CC520 Cartridge filter; Pentair Easy Touch 8 w/ ScreenLogic2; Four Pentair GloBrite; Raypak 406 heater.

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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    Quote Originally Posted by Foosman View Post
    Are you sure they didn't use primer? They also make a clear primer, which is what my plumber used.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
    Well the owner says no the sub says yes but the trash pile had 3 cans of blue glue, a can of clear glue, and a tiny can of purple primer. So they are redoing the joints after I went to the wholesaler, I own a irrigation company. and bought the fittings. I just want the job done right and what's another 100 bucks at this point.




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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    This is liner number two and I haven't confirmed with the builder but I think it's too big. The last liner was inverted and didn't work at all. I think this liner was for a 8' hopper because I found a piece of paper in the yard that said 8' depth. I'm scared to call the guy and put salt in the womb.



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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    Quote Originally Posted by the757quentin View Post
    Well the owner says no the sub says yes but the trash pile had 3 cans of blue glue, a can of clear glue, and a tiny can of purple primer. So they are redoing the joints after I went to the wholesaler, I own a irrigation company. and bought the fittings. I just want the job done right and what's another 100 bucks at this point.



    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    I don't blame you regarding the primer. Out of curiosity I did some digging to see if different PVC cements need primer. I was shocked to find the following:
    Do You Need PVC Primer?
    Build thread - 15'x30' rectangular gunite pool; 17,400 gal; 5'x8' spa raised 12" w/ 8' spillover; 10'x6' Baja shelf; Two 18" tall columns w/ 27" water bowls; Light travertine coping w/ Light 2x4' split travertine ledgestone; Jules Rustic Blue tile; Pentair IC60 SWG; Pentair IntelliFlo 2 VST; Pentair SuperFlo 1HP; Pentair CC520 Cartridge filter; Pentair Easy Touch 8 w/ ScreenLogic2; Four Pentair GloBrite; Raypak 406 heater.

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    Mod Squad kimkats's Avatar
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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    I have a 8' sad for you

    I hope you kept that piece of paper. Is this a custom liner or is he ordering the wrong one or is the liner company sending the wrong one. It really sounds like the liner company is the one messing up

    I will be thinking about you when you have to call him

    Kim (no cheering on this one)
    TFP Moderator 33x52 round AG 25,600 gals Sand Filter 1.5hp Pump - 2 Speed, SLAM, Pool School, Recommended Levels, Recommended Chemicals, Pool Math, Chlorine/CYA Chart, TF-100 Test Kit

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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    Quote Originally Posted by kimkats View Post
    I have a 8' sad for you

    I hope you kept that piece of paper. Is this a custom liner or is he ordering the wrong one or is the liner company sending the wrong one. It really sounds like the liner company is the one messing up

    I will be thinking about you when you have to call him

    Kim (no cheering on this one)
    It's a GLI liner custom liner he claims cost him over 2k last time they ordered it wrong. It's definitely his company that keeps ordering it wrong.



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    Re: New Build Smithfield, VA

    We got a gli liner that was wrong too. They put steps on wrong side. Didn't cost the builder anything....manufacturing mistake.

    18'x36' vinyl - 24k gal - Intelliflo 3hp VSP - Pentair C&C 420 cartridge filter - IC40 Salt - EasyTouch 8 - ScreenLogic - Raypak 406btu NG heater - Intellibrite 5G ligths - 4 deck jets - sheer descent - X-Stream Slide 2 - TF100 kit - opened spring 2017

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