New Build Smithfield, VA

#1
First time pool for our family and the installation has been the biggest headache of me life. The construction quality is good but the attendance of the crew has been terrible. They dug the hole on January 17th-18th and finally put the walls up a month later, and finally poured the footer along the bottom yesterday.

I own a hardscape installation company and have renovated many pools and naturally pools have water in them when I am working around them. This company has been telling me all along that they will put the liner in last so I can install the bullnose on top of the concrete they are going to pour over the over-dig. Yesterday I received a call saying that they couldn't backfill the walls without water in the pool because it will push the walls out. The walls are a only alpha product and are the Fuzion 5010 system. I think that they are wanting to hurry along now that the equipment is on site and they have to pay for the materials soon. I am really disappointed that I am unable to put my coping on from inside the pool because I was hoping it would be easier. What are your opinions on backfilling without water in pool on this type of system. Also I was convinced that 57 stone would be the best option for backfilling but they are insisted that field sand is better because all the voids in 57 stone will retain water against the pool and could mildew. I just want to do the right thing.

On another note I signed a contract for a Pentair ultra temp 140k btu electric heater and noticed a Hayward 140k btu heater had been delivered. All other equipment is Pentair and they have not mentioned the substitution but I think the Hayward is a cheaper unit and they are trying to pull a fast one. Would I be better off with the Pentair because of warranty and reliability of Hayward?

Thanks in advance,

Quentin






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duraleigh

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#2
Also I was convinced that 57 stone would be the best option for backfilling but they are insisted that field sand is better because all the voids in 57 stone will retain water against the pool and could mildew.
57 stone is perfect for backfilling and I think I would insist on it. It actually is quite permeable and will retain no water. Sand can "wash out" in certain circumstances and 57 stone needs no compaction and will not wash. A good builder would choose #57, in my opinion.


140k Electric heater??? I am guessing just a little but that seem woefully inadequate for what appears a fairly large pool (post your gallons). A 300-400k gas heater is a more common choice but I need to let others comment on that.
 

kimkats

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Jul 10, 2012
36,659
Tallahassee, FL
#3
My gut says water first to hold the walls when the backfill is added. The braces are set to the outside so the water will push against the braces. Where if you put in the backfill first there is nothing to "brace" the walls on the inside of the pool if there is no water.

I hear what you are saying about the coping. We can help you come up with a way to make it easier to do from inside the pool when the time comes.

Kim:kim:
 

Nectarologist

Well-known member
Apr 3, 2015
495
New York
#4
They should fill with water first then backfill. I have a vinyl liner pool too and the liner was put in/filled w water, then backfilled, then coping (set atop a concert collar & pool frame). It was backfilled with dirt so I waited a season to let it settle. Maybe some builders backfill then liner/water but I'd much rather add water first for the reason Kim mentioned. Reach out to the pool manufacturer for advice on a proper install and insist the builder install that way. I'd worry that they would backfill then not return to put the liner in for a while. If it rains that would be even more pressure pushing into the pool w/o water in it. If you have sand or rock you won't need for it to compact.

This will done with soon enough and it's going to be great!!!
 
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#5
Ok thanks for all of the replies. We will go ahead and put the water in first. I know the heater should probably be gas but I'm worried about the huge gas bills and only looking for a few degrees to take the chill off, it's a 30k gallon pool. Does anyone have any opinion of Hayward versus pentair?


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OP
OP
T
Mar 18, 2017
8
Smithfield, VA
#6
I came home today and noticed that they switched from blue glue to clear glue with no visible sign of primer. I have emailed them and asked to re-do all of the joints made today. Am I being unreasonable? it's also attached to the light niches with no primer
.



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OP
OP
T
Mar 18, 2017
8
Smithfield, VA
#7
I came home today and noticed that they switched from blue glue to clear glue with no visible sign of primer. I have emailed them and asked to re-do all of the joints made today. Am I being unreasonable? it's also attached to the light niches with no primer
.



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Just received an email stating that I needed to read the can as it doesn't require primer. I replied with the label and it says specifically to apply a primer nothing about it being optional. Clear glue is much different than blue glue. This project is a disaster.


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Veccster

Bronze Supporter
Aug 30, 2016
353
Pittsburgh PA
#8
No idea if it's right or wrong but our builder back filled with stone and poured coping. Then laid liner and filled.


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kimkats

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Jul 10, 2012
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Tallahassee, FL
#9
I have a sad for you! Is there any way you can be there when they do the new work to make sure they DO us primer on the fix?

Kim(no cheering on this one)
 
OP
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#10
That's the problem, they show up at random times for a few hours here and there. But my wife is going to call me if the show up so we can have a Come to Jesus meeting.


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Foosman

Bronze Supporter
Jul 21, 2016
358
Austin, TX
#11
Just received an email stating that I needed to read the can as it doesn't require primer. I replied with the label and it says specifically to apply a primer nothing about it being optional. Clear glue is much different than blue glue. This project is a disaster.


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Are you sure they didn't use primer? They also make a clear primer, which is what my plumber used.


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OP
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#12
Are you sure they didn't use primer? They also make a clear primer, which is what my plumber used.


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Well the owner says no the sub says yes but the trash pile had 3 cans of blue glue, a can of clear glue, and a tiny can of purple primer. So they are redoing the joints after I went to the wholesaler, I own a irrigation company. and bought the fittings. I just want the job done right and what's another 100 bucks at this point.



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#13
This is liner number two and I haven't confirmed with the builder but I think it's too big. The last liner was inverted and didn't work at all. I think this liner was for a 8' hopper because I found a piece of paper in the yard that said 8' depth. I'm scared to call the guy and put salt in the womb.



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Foosman

Bronze Supporter
Jul 21, 2016
358
Austin, TX
#14
Well the owner says no the sub says yes but the trash pile had 3 cans of blue glue, a can of clear glue, and a tiny can of purple primer. So they are redoing the joints after I went to the wholesaler, I own a irrigation company. and bought the fittings. I just want the job done right and what's another 100 bucks at this point.



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I don't blame you regarding the primer. Out of curiosity I did some digging to see if different PVC cements need primer. I was shocked to find the following:
Do You Need PVC Primer?
 

kimkats

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Jul 10, 2012
36,659
Tallahassee, FL
#15
I have a 8' sad for you :(

I hope you kept that piece of paper. Is this a custom liner or is he ordering the wrong one or is the liner company sending the wrong one. It really sounds like the liner company is the one messing up :(

I will be thinking about you when you have to call him :angel:

Kim (no cheering on this one)
 
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#16
I have a 8' sad for you :(

I hope you kept that piece of paper. Is this a custom liner or is he ordering the wrong one or is the liner company sending the wrong one. It really sounds like the liner company is the one messing up :(

I will be thinking about you when you have to call him :angel:

Kim (no cheering on this one)
It's a GLI liner custom liner he claims cost him over 2k last time they ordered it wrong. It's definitely his company that keeps ordering it wrong.


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Veccster

Bronze Supporter
Aug 30, 2016
353
Pittsburgh PA
#17
We got a gli liner that was wrong too. They put steps on wrong side. Didn't cost the builder anything....manufacturing mistake.

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