Maintaining BOR

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Chrissu

Chrissu

Bronze Supporter
Nov 12, 2023
91
Tampa, FL
Pool Size
10000
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
CircuPool RJ-60 Plus
Last month I added Boric acid for the first time. I brought the level to 50ppm using pool calculator.com. I’m aware that BOR doesn't break down but it does dilute. We’ve had a lot of rain recently and the salt level dropped from 3800 to 3600. I bought some test strips to measure BOR but I could not make sense of the subtle color changes. How do others keep BOR at ideal levels over the long term? Meaning season after season for example?
 
I only test it at the beginning of each season. I replenish to 50 & let it ride.
I usually drain water to below my skimmer for winter & i also lose water to backwashing during the season. It’s been my experience that I end up around 30-40 after refilling in the spring. Ymmv depending on the rain you get. The strips are a little tough to decipher but they are generally close enough for me.
Anywhere between 30 & 50 is ideal to reap the benefits of borates.
Remember there is a 200ppm +/- variability on the k1766 salt test.
The difference between 3800 & 3600 is 5.4% so if the salt test is dead on & an indicator of dilution your 50ppm of borates is now 47.3ppm. Honestly it doesn’t need to be measured that closely.
You do need to know about what you’re level is for calculating acid properly but calling it 50 is close enough. If you’re worried or noticing ph drops more than calculated lower the value to 40 or 45.
PS - use
PoolMath - the app or the webpage is fine.
Tfp doesn’t manage the pool calculator so not sure how updated it is nor can we assist if you have issues with it.
 
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Punt the test strips.

This post will give you instructions on how to roll your own Borates drop test. Very accurate. I would posit that a smart stir is a requirement for this test.

New borate drop test at piscines-apollo vs. test strip

Thanks, SunnyBlues. You have been reading and learning a LONG time to remember all those experts. Thanks for your testimonial.
www.troublefreepool.com www.troublefreepool.com
 
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Chrissu said:
Last month I added Boric acid for the first time. I brought the level to 50ppm using pool calculator.com. I’m aware that BOR doesn't break down but it does dilute. We’ve had a lot of rain recently and the salt level dropped from 3800 to 3600. I bought some test strips to measure BOR but I could not make sense of the subtle color changes. How do others keep BOR at ideal levels over the long term? Meaning season after season for example?
Click to expand...
The test strips go bad quite fast. Don’t waste time with them.
 
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Mdragger88 said:
I only test it at the beginning of each season. I replenish to 50 & let it ride.
I usually drain water to below my skimmer for winter & i also lose water to backwashing during the season. It’s been my experience that I end up around 30-40 after refilling in the spring. Ymmv depending on the rain you get. The strips are a little tough to decipher but they are generally close enough for me.
Anywhere between 30 & 50 is ideal to reap the benefits of borates.
Remember there is a 200ppm +/- variability on the k1766 salt test.
The difference between 3800 & 3600 is 5.4% so if the salt test is dead on & an indicator of dilution your 50ppm of borates is now 47.3ppm. Honestly it doesn’t need to be measured that closely.
You do need to know about what you’re level is for calculating acid properly but calling it 50 is close enough. If you’re worried or noticing ph drops more than calculated lower the value to 40 or 45.
PS - use
PoolMath - the app or the webpage is fine.
Tfp doesn’t manage the pool calculator so not sure how updated it is nor can we assist if you have issues with it.
Click to expand...
I see what you mean about poolmath having its own BOR calculator. Thanks for the tip! This will be helpful in the future, no doubt. In the example below I set the level to 40 only so I can see how much BOR it recommends. No doubt it’s still 50 already. IMG_0040.png
 
Chrissu said:
I see what you mean about poolmath having its own BOR calculator. Thanks for the tip! This will be helpful in the future, no doubt. In the example below I set the level to 40 only so I can see how much BOR it recommends. No doubt it’s still 50 already. View attachment 545539
Click to expand...
Its imperative that you have your borate level logged so it is taken into consideration when poolmath calculates your acid additions.
As well as calculating your csi.
Be sure all these are turned on in the settings ⚙️ & hit the check mark ✔️
IMG_8597.jpeg
 
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PoolStored said:
Punt the test strips.

This post will give you instructions on how to roll your own Borates drop test. Very accurate. I would posit that a smart stir is a requirement for this test.

New borate drop test at piscines-apollo vs. test strip

Thanks, SunnyBlues. You have been reading and learning a LONG time to remember all those experts. Thanks for your testimonial.
www.troublefreepool.com www.troublefreepool.com
Click to expand...
Thanks for the link to that borates drop test. I will be sure to use it down the road.

When you say use a smart stir, are you talking about the battery operated stirring tool included in the tfp test kit or something else?
 
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Mdragger88 said:
Its imperative that you have your borate level logged so it is taken into consideration when poolmath calculates your acid additions.
As well as calculating your csi.
Be sure all these are turned on in the settings ⚙️ & hit the check mark ✔️
View attachment 545541
Click to expand...

Mdragger88 said:
I turned it on and logged the level at 50 a few weeks ago when I found the setting. I know now that poolmath also does the calculation. I really like the poolmath app. Between that and the tfp test kit, chemical maintenance is now a breeze.
Click to expand...

Thanks
 
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Chrissu said:
Thanks
Click to expand...
I think so too!
Speaking of poolmath- I looked at your logs & noticed you added baking soda when your ta was 60.
That was unnecessary.
Any ta 50 or above is fine.
By adding bs you increased the ta which in turn causes ph to rise more quickly leading to more frequent acid additions - this puts you on an unnecessary merry go round of up down up down & additions.
If the the ta is 50 or above leave it alone.
If the ph is anywhere in the 7’s leave it be.
You may find that your ph hangs out in the high 7’s for a while & that’s fine.
When it rises to 8 lower it back down to mid 7’s. The lower you take it the faster it will climb.
 
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Mdragger88 said:
I think so too!
Speaking of poolmath- I looked at your logs & noticed you added baking soda when your ta was 60.
That was unnecessary.
Any ta 50 or above is fine.
By adding bs you increased the ta which in turn causes ph to rise more quickly leading to more frequent acid additions - this puts you on an unnecessary merry go round of up down up down & additions.
If the the ta is 50 or above leave it alone.
If the ph is anywhere in the 7’s leave it be.
You may find that your ph hangs out in the high 7’s for a while & that’s fine.
When it rises to 8 lower it back down to mid 7’s. The lower you take it the faster it will climb.
Click to expand...
Hmm. I added the amount of baking soda that poolmath recommends as ideal. I appreciate the info and will maintain for an adjusted ideal TA of 50-60ish going forward.

By any chance do you know who maintains the poolmath source code? The author has already written in the ability to customize the ideal level for BOR but TA is hard coded. It would be nice if the ideal range for all the measurements were customizable. I code for a living at Microsoft so can’t help but to ask. My guess is that this is a feature request that has been asked for several times already.
 
Open pool math. Go into settings in the upper right corner. Scroll to the bottom and click advanced settings. Then turn ideals off. :)

Ideals is simply how most pools respond. It doesn't know your location/climate or your fill water parameters. If yours falls outside the norm, you need to listen to the pool. It will not listen to you and you'll be chasing your tail.
 
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Newdude said:
Open pool math. Go into settings in the upper right corner. Scroll to the bottom and click advanced settings. Then turn ideals off. :)

Ideals is simply how most pools respond. It doesn't know your location/climate or your fill water parameters. If yours falls outside the norm, you need to listen to the pool. It will not listen to you and you'll be chasing your tail.
Click to expand...
Appreciate the suggestion but that setting only controls whether you see an alert across the top of the page. For example:
IMG_0046.jpeg


What I’m referring to is the recommended and ideal values displayed when you go into TA. These values are presented here always. This is one of those things where you get used to how the app behaves and you don’t give it a second thought. For new users, it’s a different story. Honestly, this is about the only feature enhancement I can think of for this little app. It’s already quite good.

IMG_0047.jpeg
 
You'll know your own ideals soon enough. Then the calculator can say whatever it wants and you'll LOL about it the way the rest of us do. 😁
 
Yeah, no worries. The tech in me Is curious if one of the mods is the owner of the app. If outsourced then I get how expensive it can be to add a new feature. If this is unknown, that’s ok.
 
JoyfulNoise said:
Send feature requests to [email protected]

The Ideal/Suggested ranges are based on the pool surface types and method of chlorination. They are based on TFP standards.
Click to expand...
Exactly. That’s all the more reason to get away from hard coded recommendations that are not always recommended on this site by mods. Customizability of this nature will be a win for all.

The version history listed on the App Store shows 6 years of release information with the most recent update being a year ago.

Just trying to help with a fresh perspective from a new guy. Sometimes that helps.
 
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