White flakes in pool; repeated build-up on SWG

Dec 7, 2022
22
Denver, CO
Pool Size
10880
Surface
Plaster
Chlorine
Salt Water Generator
SWG Type
Pentair Intellichlor IC-20
Hello-
I am having an issue with white and blueish flakes showing up in the bottom of the pool and hot tub at the returns and have traced the issue back to the SWG. See pics (I suspect the blue-ish tint is from my clear blue?). There is a lot of context further below but here is my current water chemistry-
All per Tyler 2005 test kit
FC- 4 (a little high b/c we have a security cover and didn't use the pool for over a week)
CC- <1
Salt PPM- 3050 (this is per the Pentair app; I suspect it is reading low as last time I had the water tested it came back about 200ppm higher than this app; I have the green light "good" salt level at the SWG unit)
Ph- 7.6
Alkalinity- 120
CYW- unclear. The Tyler 2005 test kit seems to be lacking in this one's accuracy. The black dot gets blurry about 50 but never fully disappears. Last time I had the water tested this was 50.
Calcium hardness- 300
Temp- been in the high 70's the last month

The [long] history-
Pool was installed and turned on in May 2022. All last summer, no issues and minimal maintenance was required beyond some acid here and there. The pool was closed for the winter and hot tub kept open. Because I was a new pool owner with no experience, and limited instructions from the installer, I let the FC get very high in the hot tub over the winter because we didn't use the hot tub, nor open the cover for a couple weeks at a time. I figured this out when a pair of shorts actually faded! I tested the free chlorine and it was darker than 10. After that, I rotated the SWG between off and 7% and checked the FC nearly daily and would leave the cover open on sunny days if it started to get above 5. PIA, but the best I could do.

Opened the pool this May and from day 1 seemed to have little to no chlorine production. Also had the white specs from day one but I ignored that and focused on the lack of FC. Last year I kept the SWG at 20% and for our use that was sufficient. This summery I kept cranking it up until we had it at 100% for a few days and started to get a slight FC reading. Then the algae moved in. (Side note- we had a very wet and stormy back half of May and all of June in Denver. With the security cover it made it very cumbersome to open the pool and test the chemicals but I tried to stay on it at least 3x/week.) The rest of the chronology goes something like this-
- Treated the algae outbreak with 1 lb of shock, GLB algecide and lots of scrubbing with a wire brush. Lots of of dead algae the next day that I vacuumed out (didn't vacuum to backwash)
- FC reading the next day was about 8. The day after that, virtually zero again.
- Checked the SWG for build up and it was clean.
- Used chlorine tablets for the next few weeks to try and keep the FC up.
- Had another algae outbreak...etc. etc. Battled with the algae for a few weeks. Ultimately got rid of it with lots of shock, some more algecide, lots of scrubbing and also cleaned out the cartridge filter.
- Still couldn't get consistent FC readings. Pool guy and gal came by and said my CYA was likely off so added 1 gallon of liquid conditioner (something from Amazon). Added another lb of shock (I'd say in total, this summer I put about 7lbs of HTH cal hypo powder shock in). That helped for a week or so then started losing FC readings again (all the while my SWG was at 50% or higher)
- Had water tested and salt was low so added nearly 40 lbs.
- About here I checked the SWG and found quite a bit of build up on it. Gave it an acid was with 5:1 mixture.
- Had a pool guy out a couple weeks later who really cleaned out the filter cartridges (he said they were "sludgy") acid washed the SWG because it had build up and left me a nice bill. Checked the sale with strips and get a reading of about 3,500
- That was about mid-August and since then we've had good FC production and no algae.
- But, the flaking is bad as ever and I've scraped the SWG with a popsicle stick twice in the last 3 weeks. No doubt I'll have to do it again this weekend.

Not sure if I have a chemical or mechanical issue. If my description above doesn't provide a clear answer, which I doubt it does, I'd be curious to know the common causes for this issue and I can start trouble shooting. Thank you in advance!!

PS- my weekly maintenance:
- 2 oz GLB super blue
- 8 oz GLB natural clear
- 4 oz GLB sequa sol
- For the next few weeks after the last algae outbreak ,1.5 oz of Clorox algeside but stopped about 3 weeks ago
 

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Hello-
I am having an issue with white and blueish flakes showing up in the bottom of the pool and hot tub at the returns and have traced the issue back to the SWG. See pics (I suspect the blue-ish tint is from my clear blue?). There is a lot of context further below but here is my current water chemistry-
All per Tyler 2005 test kit
FC- 4 (a little high b/c we have a security cover and didn't use the pool for over a week)
CC- <1
Salt PPM- 3050 (this is per the Pentair app; I suspect it is reading low as last time I had the water tested it came back about 200ppm higher than this app; I have the green light "good" salt level at the SWG unit)
Ph- 7.6
Alkalinity- 120
CYW- unclear. The Tyler 2005 test kit seems to be lacking in this one's accuracy. The black dot gets blurry about 50 but never fully disappears. Last time I had the water tested this was 50.
Calcium hardness- 300
Temp- been in the high 70's the last month

The [long] history-
Pool was installed and turned on in May 2022. All last summer, no issues and minimal maintenance was required beyond some acid here and there. The pool was closed for the winter and hot tub kept open. Because I was a new pool owner with no experience, and limited instructions from the installer, I let the FC get very high in the hot tub over the winter because we didn't use the hot tub, nor open the cover for a couple weeks at a time. I figured this out when a pair of shorts actually faded! I tested the free chlorine and it was darker than 10. After that, I rotated the SWG between off and 7% and checked the FC nearly daily and would leave the cover open on sunny days if it started to get above 5. PIA, but the best I could do.

Opened the pool this May and from day 1 seemed to have little to no chlorine production. Also had the white specs from day one but I ignored that and focused on the lack of FC. Last year I kept the SWG at 20% and for our use that was sufficient. This summery I kept cranking it up until we had it at 100% for a few days and started to get a slight FC reading. Then the algae moved in. (Side note- we had a very wet and stormy back half of May and all of June in Denver. With the security cover it made it very cumbersome to open the pool and test the chemicals but I tried to stay on it at least 3x/week.) The rest of the chronology goes something like this-
- Treated the algae outbreak with 1 lb of shock, GLB algecide and lots of scrubbing with a wire brush. Lots of of dead algae the next day that I vacuumed out (didn't vacuum to backwash)
- FC reading the next day was about 8. The day after that, virtually zero again.
- Checked the SWG for build up and it was clean.
- Used chlorine tablets for the next few weeks to try and keep the FC up.
- Had another algae outbreak...etc. etc. Battled with the algae for a few weeks. Ultimately got rid of it with lots of shock, some more algecide, lots of scrubbing and also cleaned out the cartridge filter.
- Still couldn't get consistent FC readings. Pool guy and gal came by and said my CYA was likely off so added 1 gallon of liquid conditioner (something from Amazon). Added another lb of shock (I'd say in total, this summer I put about 7lbs of HTH cal hypo powder shock in). That helped for a week or so then started losing FC readings again (all the while my SWG was at 50% or higher)
- Had water tested and salt was low so added nearly 40 lbs.
- About here I checked the SWG and found quite a bit of build up on it. Gave it an acid was with 5:1 mixture.
- Had a pool guy out a couple weeks later who really cleaned out the filter cartridges (he said they were "sludgy") acid washed the SWG because it had build up and left me a nice bill. Checked the sale with strips and get a reading of about 3,500
- That was about mid-August and since then we've had good FC production and no algae.
- But, the flaking is bad as ever and I've scraped the SWG with a popsicle stick twice in the last 3 weeks. No doubt I'll have to do it again this weekend.

Not sure if I have a chemical or mechanical issue. If my description above doesn't provide a clear answer, which I doubt it does, I'd be curious to know the common causes for this issue and I can start trouble shooting. Thank you in advance!!

PS- my weekly maintenance:
- 2 oz GLB super blue
- 8 oz GLB natural clear
- 4 oz GLB sequa sol
- For the next few weeks after the last algae outbreak ,1.5 oz of Clorox algeside but stopped about 3 weeks ago
Hey there and wlecome!

It is a little tough to follow along but here’s a few observations.

1. It would be very good to update your Taylor kit to a 2006 by getting a K1515 FAS-DPD test to measure chlorine more accurately. Once you have stabilizer in the water, you needed to maintain the chlorine in a ratio with CYA according to this chart. (Your chlorine is too low)


2. The scaling is caused by the CSI being too much on the positive side. If you have a phone, you can download the “pool math” app and turn on CSI tracking and it’ll help you manage the water to stay in the slightly negative zone. Typically calcium hardness and pH being high are big contributors.

3. All the algaecides with the names “blu, blue, etc” are adding copper to the water. Copper builds up and will stain the pools (and blond hair), so you don’t want it in the water.


4. We don’t trust pool store testing at all, ever. It sounds like you’re already on board testing yourself which is good but thought I’d throw that out there.

Can you post a full set of water test results from your Taylor kit and we can advise? I predict there will be a bunch of people wanting to help here shortly.
 
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Hey, much like Bperry was saying you would want to balance the pool as well for the Pool Saturation Index (LSI) to keep the pool from being in a scale forming state. Maintaining proper ph and alkalinity can help prevent the scaling. It is important to test often to keep those balanced to keep the scale away. :swim::swim::swim::swim:
 
You have water chemistry issues.

As recommended above you need to add the FAS/DPD chlorine test to be able to accurately measure your FC and CC - FAS/DPD Chlorine Test Kit

You also need the Taylor K-1766 Salt Test to accurately measure your salt level - Salt

You need to use PoolMath to calculate your CSI and manage it which is why your SWG is scaling and throwing off flakes.

I suggest you read...


and decide if you want to follow TFPC Methods.

Algaecides do not clear algae. Once you have algae algaecides will not solve your problem. It takes sufficient chlorine over a period of time to eliminate algae from your pool. Clear water can have algae and if you just get your water clear the algae will return. We have the...


We can help you if you get the proper test kits, stop adding algaecides and magic potions into your pool, and adopt TFPC Methods.
 
Thank you all for your responses! I've ordered the additional FAS-DPD test kit as well as a salt test kit. So for now, the results below are tested by the Tyler 2005 test kit, except where noted. I've also entered these into the pool math app and it's saying my CSI is 0.21

FC- 6.0 (a little high as we're not using the pool much these days; I've turned the SWG down to 10% from 17%)
CC- 0
pH- 7.8
TA- 120
CH- 300
CYA- unknown. If I fill the small tube in the test kit it starts to get blurry but still visible. So I'm guessing it's <30 ppm. I entered 30ppm into Pool Math for now. Should I go ahead and add a gallon+ of liquid conditioner? Note that we'll be closing the pool this week and will only have our 800 gallon hot tub open for the winter so I'd like to get this in the pool ASAP if needed.
Salt- 2900 per the Pentair app. Hence I've ordered the more accurate test kit but doubt I'll have it before the pool is closed this Tuesday.
Temp- 77' F

Any guidance is appreciated!
 
What problem are you looking to solve?

Tinkering with your CYA will not solve your SWG scaling.

You need to get your CSI negative. The best way to do that is lower your TA to around 60. That would get your CSI to -0.13

What is the TA and pH of your fill water? Keeping your TA that low may be a challenge if you have high TA fill water.

 
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Thank you all for your responses! I've ordered the additional FAS-DPD test kit as well as a salt test kit. So for now, the results below are tested by the Tyler 2005 test kit, except where noted. I've also entered these into the pool math app and it's saying my CSI is 0.21

FC- 6.0 (a little high as we're not using the pool much these days; I've turned the SWG down to 10% from 17%)
CC- 0
pH- 7.8
TA- 120
CH- 300
CYA- unknown. If I fill the small tube in the test kit it starts to get blurry but still visible. So I'm guessing it's <30 ppm. I entered 30ppm into Pool Math for now. Should I go ahead and add a gallon+ of liquid conditioner? Note that we'll be closing the pool this week and will only have our 800 gallon hot tub open for the winter so I'd like to get this in the pool ASAP if needed.
Salt- 2900 per the Pentair app. Hence I've ordered the more accurate test kit but doubt I'll have it before the pool is closed this Tuesday.
Temp- 77' F

Any guidance is appreciated!
I wouldn’t waste money on CYA if you’re closing next week. The liquid conditioner is also way more expensive than the granules and harder to use.
 
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