Please help me diagnose this extremely frustrating leak

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poolnovice1

Bronze Supporter
May 11, 2018
177
Houston, TX
For the past week I've been losing about an 3/4" to 1" of water daily.

Here are some things I have noticed:
1. Water has been coming out through the overflow pipe that goes to the front street curb. I tested the water coming out in the street and it has chlorine so it is pool water. The pool water level is about 2" below the overflow grate, so I have no idea how pool water is getting into the overflow pipe. Note that my filter backwash/waste line is connected to the sewer, not the overflow pipe.

2. I lose water with both the pump on and off.

3. When the filter is off, the spa level is dropping about 1/4" an hour.

Potential possibilities:
1. I have a bad check valve. This would seem to fit the bill if the spa drains into the pool overnight and causes the pool level to go up and empty out into the overflow pipe. But I am getting water loss with the pump both on and off. I've had the pump running for 24 hours and I've still lost water; I can see water very, very slowly trickling out at the front curb even now.

2. I have a suction side or return leak in the spa. However, that would not explain how I am getting water in the overflow pipe.

Any other suggestions? I wonder if it's possible that I have a spa leak and the water is finding its way into the overflow drain via a crack in the overflow pipe. This is strange and nothing seems to be adding up.
 
Gonna be tough to diagnose with some orientation. Can you post a few pictures of your equipment so that collectively they show everything. Take pics of the pool and spa. If you can show the pad in relation to the pool. This is gonna help us help you...

Tom Cruise Help GIF by MOODMAN
 
PN1,

My pool overflow pipe is connected into all my deck drains, so it is possible that your overflow pipe is connected to something else.

In any case, here is what I suggest after our current winter freezing issue is over.

Since you are not using your pool, just let the Pool and Spa drain down and find where it stops.

It would be interesting to know where the spa drain-down stops. And if the pool continues to drain down after the spa is empty.

I guess my point is to try and fix any pool leak, before you try and fix any spa draining back into the pool issues.

Thanks,

Jim R.
 
Jimrahbe said:
PN1,

My pool overflow pipe is connected into all my deck drains, so it is possible that your overflow pipe is connected to something else.

In any case, here is what I suggest after our current winter freezing issue is over.

Since you are not using your pool, just let the Pool and Spa drain down and find where it stops.

It would be interesting to know where the spa drain-down stops. And if the pool continues to drain down after the spa is empty.

I guess my point is to try and fix any pool leak, before you try and fix any spa draining back into the pool issues.

Thanks,

Jim R.
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Yes, it is also connected to the deck drains and 2 roof downspouts. I've checked that those are not the culprits because I tested the water at the opening and it is chlorinated. And besides that the pool is losing quite a bit of water. I had this problem before and it turned it was an outdoor kitchen sink that was leaking. In that case the water was not chlorinated and my pool was not losing water.

I will try shutting off the system and let it drain down until it stops. Or possibly I'll lose patience and call a leak detection company.
 
Update:

I have turned off the pump for approximately 19 hours.

I observed the following results:
- Spa has drained several inches
- Pool has neither lost nor gained any water. It was 1.5" below the overflow grate yesterday and I measured the same level today.
- Water observed at front curb (coming out from overflow pipe)

I had a pool tech confirm that the spa check valve (which is about a year old) is fine. Plus since the pool level has not changed, so I don't believe that could be it anyway. He also confirmed that the filter waste line is connected to the sewer.

So it looks like I'm dealing with a suction or pressure side leak in the spa. Should I try plugging the spa return jets next? The big mystery is still how pool water is getting into the overflow pipe.
 

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PN1,

The next step it to plug the spa jets and the floor drain. And another open pipes, if there are any.

Fill up the spa and see if it drains down.

If it drains, then you most likely have a bad light enclosure. If it does not drain, then you know the light is good.

Then remove the plug in the floor drain and see what happens. If it does not drain, you can assume the drain is ok.

The problem then is that all the jets are tied together and behind concrete. :(

Thanks,

Jim R.
 
Jimrahbe said:
PN1,

The next step it to plug the spa jets and the floor drain. And another open pipes, if there are any.

Fill up the spa and see if it drains down.

If it drains, then you most likely have a bad light enclosure. If it does not drain, then you know the light is good.

Then remove the plug in the floor drain and see what happens. If it does not drain, you can assume the drain is ok.

The problem then is that all the jets are tied together and behind concrete. :(

Thanks,

Jim R.
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Is it worth dye testing instead of plugging everything?
 
PN1,

I have never had the dye test work for me. You can't have any water movement to get it to work and just getting the dye to where you want causes all kinds of movement.

Could be just me, but I have had zero luck with dye tests.

I suspect it would work ok if you have a huge leak.

Thanks,

Jim R.
 

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I jumped in the spa (jeez, it's freezing). I thought I would take a look at the light enclosure and found that it just slipped right off. It is cracked but interestingly, I could not find the broken piece. The pool lights do not work anyway, so I'm wondering if there's a way to plug them all.

Could this be the source of the leak?
 

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PN1,

I have no experience with that style of light, so not sure how it seals. On my pool light, the light niche is flooded, and the seal is in the back where the wires go into the conduit.

Let's see if @1poolman1 has any inputs, or what some of our other members have to say.

Thanks,

Jim R.
 
Jimrahbe said:
PN1,

I have no experience with that style of light, so not sure how it seals. On my pool light, the light niche is flooded, and the seal is in the back where the wires go into the conduit.

Let's see if @1poolman1 has any inputs, or what some of our other members have to say.

Thanks,

Jim R.
Click to expand...
Here are more pictures of this light if anyone is familiar with these and knows what kind they are.
 

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Jimrahbe said:
PN1,

With the lens off, I would try the dye test. Can't hurt and you might get lucky.

Thanks,

Jim R.
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I did. I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong but I can't seem to get it to work for me. I'll try it again as the water drains lower.

The spa water level is currently half an inch above the return jets. We'll see what happens in the next 24 hours and whether the spa continues to drain past the returns.
 
Jimrahbe said:
PN1,

I have no experience with that style of light, so not sure how it seals. On my pool light, the light niche is flooded, and the seal is in the back where the wires go into the conduit.

Let's see if @1poolman1 has any inputs, or what some of our other members have to say.

Thanks,

Jim R.
Click to expand...
Appears to be the lens for an old fiber-optics light system. Looks like a FiberStars Broadcast lens, but any of their lenses will fit the opening. Most of the time the threads were proprietary, but some were just 1.5" FIP.
 
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