Pentair Intellicenter Help needed

Thanks for that, Jim. So Compool -> EasyTouch -> IntelliCenter is a no-go. I’d need a full new IntelliCenter install.

I’ll probably have a few more questions regarding the use of my existing equipment with a new IC system.

So, my next step of the evaluation brings me to the 10 breaker spaces in the IntelliCenter, which seems to be not enough for my installation. I currently (no pun intended) have 5 240V 20A double-pole breakers for the filter pump, waterfall pump, two Spa jet pumps, and a floor cleaner pump. In addition, there's a 120V 20A GFCI for the pool and Spa lights, 2 120V 20A breakers for landscape lights and a 120V 15A breaker for a utility outlet on the landscape. The main system power and also my non-Pentair chlorinator seem to be powered off the filter pump breaker as well.

These breakers are fit into 8 1-inch spaces in my old Compool load center. The 240V dp's are ganged 1/2-inch breakers, allowing the 5 of them to take just 5 of the 8 spaces. The GFCI is in the 6th, and the 3 120V 1/2-inch breakers occupy 1-1/2 of the remaining 2 spaces.

For IntelliCenter, 10 spaces seems enough (for me), but only if it accepts 240V dp breakers taking only a single 1-inch space. If not, I need a separate expansion breaker box?

Edit: Am I correct that what I'm describing here is simply quadplex breakers such as Siemens QT Quadplex, offering two 240V twin poles in a double space, which seem to be supported according to the IntelliCenter panel label?

Well, I put myself on the waitlist two weeks ago, got an email today, and I now have an IntelliCenter i8PS Kit (521904) on order. I'll run through my install process here over the course of the next few months. First steps are to increase the height of my mounting post (a pair of railroad ties), and to map out each of the nine conduits entering my current Compool/EasyTouch load center. I'll be checking for conduit entry locations compared to the IntelliCenter knockouts, and also length of the wires coming in.

Once the Bad Boy arrives, I'll get circuit breakers and start the internal wiring.

I'm sure I'll have a number of questions, and will also look to provide any lessons learned that may help others here.

IntelliCenter arrived a week or so ago. Unboxing pictures here. Questions will follow.

On to the design questions - I greatly appreciate any and all comments. The first thing I'm trying to sort out is conduit attachment. Attached is a picture of the bottom of my existing Compool/EasyTouch load center. There are 8 hard PVC conduits, 1 NM Flex, and individual wires coming into two other knockouts. Alignment to the new IntelliCenter load center is pretty bad. In particular, the 60 amp power feed from the house comes in via 1" pipe to the exact center, where the L1 and L2 connections are located very low in the load center. These 8 AWG wires are quite short as a result. In addition, the old load center has the ground bar on the bottom of the case (in front of the knockouts), so most of the grounds are cut very short.


Q1: Unless by some miracle there's slack in the main power feed cable, I will need to either pull a new line (which I really want to avoid), or splice within the load center. The Polaris taps seem well-suited for this. Thoughts?

Q2: While I can pigtail the grounds as needed to reach the IntelliCenter's central ground bar, it sure would be cleaner to add a new ground bar at the bottom of the back panel of the load center. I believe this was discussed and rejected by someone else on another thread. My thought is to drill and tap two holes, add nuts to the mounting screws if necessary, and then run a ground wire between the two bars. Other than this work (including drilling my new beloved IntelliCenter), are there reasons that this is a no-no?
Q3: Given the conduit locations compared to the IntelliCenter knockouts, I expect I'll need to shift at least several of them around. There's about 14" from the ground to the load center bottom (I plan to keep this height pretty much the same with the IntelliCenter). My thought is to cut down the conduits to a few inches above ground and add plastic Flex conduit for the rest of the run up to the new load center. I'd expect this to give me all the "wiggle room" needed even for any conduits that need to displace a few inches. Again, any thoughts on this idea?

FSDpool said:

They don't have to line up exactly. Electricians use electrical gutters or raceways connecting panels and devices all the time.

Can't tell how much room you have to work with height-wise from your pic but you could trace out the old holes on the bottom of the existing panel and sit a small water resistant panel neatly on your existing conduits, and then run the necessary conduits between your gutter and new IC

Search Google images for "Electrical gutter raceway" to see if you get any ideas - you could also post a wider angle shot of the equipment

https://www.grainger.com/product/WIEGMANN-Wiring-Trough-Screws-6HYE6

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Thanks for the idea. I don't have a lot of room to work with as the bottom of the load center will be only about 14" off the ground. For a variety of reasons, I don't really want to mount the new load center much higher than the existing (I assume it would have to be about a foot higher to accommodate a gutter in between). But, it's an interesting idea - I'll have to give it some thought. Thanks.

ajw22 said:

I just completed a similar project replacing an Aqualink panel with the IntelliCenter. You can read my thread on it at…

Replacing an Aqualink with an IntelliCenter

This thread is for me to work out what I do in upgrading my 20 year old pool equipment. Jandy RS8 automation, 1.5HP SS Pentair pump, Pentair Mastertemp 400 NG heater, IC40 SWG, typical pool/spa combo with spa spillover, Pentair JVA actuators on suctions & return Jandy valves, 1HP pump for spa...

www.troublefreepool.com

I encountered the problems you see of conduit alignment, ground wires not long enough to reach the ground bar, other wires not long enough, etc. Some of the issues turned out to be easier to resolve once I could try different approaches in positioning the panel and conduit.

I used Wago 221 series in-line splices that allowed many splices without cluttering the box….

Inline splicing connector with lever (221-2401) | WAGO USA

Inline splicing connector with lever; for all conductor types; 12 AWG (max.); 2-conductor; transparent housing; white cover (4066966120271) Online at WAGO USA!

www.wago.com

Below is the way my install turned out.

Note that to cut the conduit you are going to need to pull the wires out before you cut. You run too high of a risk of nicking the wires if cutting the conduit with the wires in it. You also cannot glue connectors onto the conduit with wires in it.

And if you are able to pull the wires out to cut the conduit and glue flex onto it then you can run new longer wires. I was prepared to do that but it turned out not to be necessary.

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Thanks. I will definitely be making use of the Wago inline splices (which I saw in your thread). I’m still mapping out my conduit situation, but it doesn’t look promising without at least some re-work.

Q4: I have to go back to my earlier question regarding breaker space. I have 5 pumps, and while 4-pole breakers would work (that’s the setup in my existing load center), these don’t seem to exist with GFCI. Given 5 pumps, if I use GFCI breakers (which I believe to be required now), that would use up all 10 spaces in the IntelliCenter. Do I really need to add yet another large sub panel box in my installation to accommodate GFCI breakers? I can’t seem to find 240v GFCI receptacles (my pumps plug into outlets next to the load center). The only thing I was able to locate is a Hubbell blank front hard wired GFCI for $400 apiece! I’m a little surprised that having 5 pumps would be so excessive as to not work without so much added hardware and expense. Any ideas?

ajw22 said:

Please list what your five pumps do?

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Filter, waterfall, 2 for spa jets, floor cleaner

ajw22 said:

Put the cleaner pump sharing a breaker with one of the spa jet pumps. I doubt you will run the cleaner while using the spa. Or put the cleaner and the waterfall pumps on the same CB.

That then let’s you have four 20 amp 240V GFCI breakers and two 20 amp 120 V breakers. One 120V breaker to power the IntelliCenter and one for the pool lights.

The pool light CB is either a GFCI with the lights wired to the panel or a non-GFCI if powering a GFCI convenience outlet and the lights connected through the LOAD side of the outlet.

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Yeah, it looks like the only way to avoid a large sub-panel is to play this game. Problem is I have a few more circuits in addition to the above. The pool lights do need a GFCI breaker (so that's one full 1" space) as they are hard-wired. We also have landscape lighting going through the pool panel (currently using two 1/2 space 20 amp breakers plus one additional 1/2 space breaker just for a patio GFCI outlet). The standalone chlorinator is currently tied into the filter pump breaker - I'd put this with the IntelliCenter breaker, or with the filter pump as it is 110/240 selectable). And I have to pair up the heater onto one of the breakers as well.

ajw22 said:

What are the specific model pumps you have?

Can you put the two spa pumps on one 30 amp GFCI CB?

It can all be done with some some creativity.

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Filter: Hayward SP700
Spa Jets: Hayward SP3020 (hard to read the label) with Century UST1202 motors - label pics below
Waterfall: Hayward SP2610 with Century UST1152 motor
Cleaner: MagnaTek Centurion B668
Pumps:


Jets:


Waterfall:

Cleaner:

Here's my current thinking on dealing with breaker space. I thought (briefly) about replacing our main panel 60amp breaker that feeds the pool center with a 60 amp GFCI (readily available). While this would be the simplest, and I assume would provide GF protection for everything, I fear this would also have the potential to provide a lot of annoyance trips. Among other things, the house main panel is probably at least 100 feet from the pool center, and while I'm not sure if this is impactful, I just don't want to deal with even semi-frequent trips.

I also don't want to overdo it in trying to pair up pumps on single breakers - especially the ones that are often enough in operation simultaneously (filter, waterfall, 2 spa jets).

This leads me to a sub panel setup at the pool. I only need a few additional spaces, so I'm considering a small-ish 4-space outdoor panel. This would leave a few available spaces for the future. The proposed configuration:
IntelliCenter:

1. 120v - IntelliCenter power, patio outlet (which is a regular 120v GFCI WR outlet). This can take a full space, or be 1/2 a tandem 1-pole if needed.
2. 240v GFCI - Filter Pump, Heater, AutoPilot SWG
3. 2nd pole of #2 breaker
4. 120v GFCI - In-Pool Lights
5. 120v (single or 1-pole tandem) - Landscape lights (120v) and transformers for 6 low-voltage landscape lights
6. open
7. 240v GFCI - Waterfall and Cleaner Pumps
8. 2nd pole of #7 breaker
9. 240v 40-60 amp - feed to sub-panel. Could use a GFCI here to cover the entire sub-panel
10. 2nd pole of #9 breaker

Main Lug Sub-Panel:

1. 240v 2-pole Quad - Spa Jets 1, and Spa Jets 2
2. 2nd pole of #1 breaker
3. open (or use as Jets 2 breaker if placing GFCI breakers in the sub-panel instead of IntelliCenter feed)
4. open (or 2nd pole of #3 GFCI breaker

I note that this configuration would require running the feed from IntelliCenter to the sub-panel, and also running the loads back to IntelliCenter for connection to the relays. Any thoughts on the above plan? While I'm certainly not looking to add hardware, I am definitely looking for as reliable a setup as possible.