Timer Choice

Jump to latest Follow Reply
U

ukchris

0
Jul 7, 2017
39
NH
I’m about to have a heater installed, before doing so it seems it makes sense to add a timer for my pump and chain the heater off it. I looked at WiFi switches but there seems to be a lot of reliability questions and quite frankly I’m not sure I need to functionality.

It seems Intermatic are the way to go, from what I’ve read it seems I need a 101 or a 104 depending on whether the filter is 110v or 220c = does that sound right? I’m going to check the model number of the pump to verify but wanted to ask if I’m likely to need anything in addition to just the unit in order to also add in the heater (propane) control.

This is the one I’m looking at:

Intermatic T104 208-277-Volt DPST 24 Hour Mechanical Time Switch https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000BQOX88/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_tai_i_QZ8eBbAN52FQC

(110 and 220 options on the page)
 
ukchris said:
I’m about to have a heater installed, before doing so it seems it makes sense to add a timer for my pump and chain the heater off it. I looked at WiFi switches but there seems to be a lot of reliability questions and quite frankly I’m not sure I need to functionality.

It seems Intermatic are the way to go, from what I’ve read it seems I need a 101 or a 104 depending on whether the filter is 110v or 220c = does that sound right? I’m going to check the model number of the pump to verify but wanted to ask if I’m likely to need anything in addition to just the unit in order to also add in the heater (propane) control.

This is the one I’m looking at:

Intermatic T104 208-277-Volt DPST 24 Hour Mechanical Time Switch https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000BQOX88/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_tai_i_QZ8eBbAN52FQC

(110 and 220 options on the page)
Click to expand...
Hi. You'll also need a "fireman's switch" unless your heater specifically says it's not needed. I know there is at least one Hayward heater that does not require this (and maybe others, not sure).
 
Redelephants said:
I use this WiFi timer....

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00ZYLTJ1...t=&hvlocphy=9011578&hvtargid=pla-323303021652
Click to expand...

I was reading about that one but was a little concerned about some of the mixed reviews, how has it worked for you? I’m certainly a big fan of home automation (Alexa, Nest, Wemo etc) but was a little put off, I was also debating whether I really need smart control - although as the price is very similar I’m certainly tempted.

- - - Updated - - -

Nectarologist said:
Hi. You'll also need a "fireman's switch" unless your heater specifically says it's not needed. I know there is at least one Hayward heater that does not require this (and maybe others, not sure).
Click to expand...

Does that imply a kill switch? Right now my pump is wired through a switch that is mounted on the wall - I think of it just as the on/off but essentially it isolates the pump, is a “fireman’s switch” different?

Edit : Just read up a little more, so the fireman’s switch is a delay unit to turn of the heater before the pump, correct? Seems sensible, not sure if the heater requires or supports one but will check - likely with the pool guy I plan to have install it.

- - - Updated - - -

I’ve done a little more research, the pump shows as a Hayward C48K2N143B, according to the label it supports 115/230v so I took the cover off and the “black plug” shows it is set for 230v - so clearly I need a timer that supports this, I was assuming I’d just insert it between the main switch that currently turns it on/off and the pump - make sense?

The heater is also supposed to be switchable 115/230 so I was assuming I just needed a timer that supports two outputs.
 
ukchris said:
I was reading about that one but was a little concerned about some of the mixed reviews, how has it worked for you? I’m certainly a big fan of home automation (Alexa, Nest, Wemo etc) but was a little put off, I was also debating whether I really need smart control - although as the price is very similar I’m certainly tempted.

- - - Updated - - -



Does that imply a kill switch? Right now my pump is wired through a switch that is mounted on the wall - I think of it just as the on/off but essentially it isolates the pump, is a “fireman’s switch” different?

Edit : Just read up a little more, so the fireman’s switch is a delay unit to turn of the heater before the pump, correct? Seems sensible, not sure if the heater requires or supports one but will check - likely with the pool guy I plan to have install it.

- - - Updated - - -

I’ve done a little more research, the pump shows as a Hayward C48K2N143B, according to the label it supports 115/230v so I took the cover off and the “black plug” shows it is set for 230v - so clearly I need a timer that supports this, I was assuming I’d just insert it between the main switch that currently turns it on/off and the pump - make sense?

The heater is also supposed to be switchable 115/230 so I was assuming I just needed a timer that supports two outputs.
Click to expand...

It works flawless and has been for almost two years.
 
Hi. Yes that's correct the fireman's switch cuts power to the heater at a set time before the pump turns off (typically a half hour I believe). It's added on to the timer clock. I have a raypak and it's required otherwise there could be build up of excessive heat. The switch allows the heat to dissipate properly.
 
Regarding the Wion switch did you install it yourself? Mine should arrive today so I'm starting planning, the instructions online show configurations as shown below. As my pump is set up for 230v and I want to add the heater I'm assuming I need the configuration in the bottom right. What I need to determine is how the feeds are configured, I grew up on 240v but as everything here is (primarily) 110v I think there's some sort of "joining" two 110v feeds to make this up.

As of now the feed from the panel goes to a wall mounted outlet, I'm pretty sure there are two feeds, one branches to provide 110v to the outlet then both continue to a wall mounted switch to turn the pump on/off, from the switch they continue to the actual pump.

For now I'm expecting I'll put the Wion switch between the switch and pump then run the secondary feed from it to the heater - i.e. the bottom right diagram. What I need to determine is where it "becomes" 220v instead of 2 x 110v, if that is at the pump then the wiring may need to back up somewhat.

Maybe I should get an electrician :) While I'm quite comfortable working with electrical wiring the whole 110/220 think concerns me a little.

wion.jpg
 

Enjoying this content?

Support TFP with a donation.

Give Support
Rancho Cost-a-Lotta said:
THIS LINK shows the use of included jumpers for 240 volt configurations. In your diagram, the lower right shows the jumpers labeled as J1 and J2.
Click to expand...

That's a great diagram, thank you. I think I have it sorted out in my head, I like to think in terms of physical wires as well as the logical diagram - colors also help me! My diagram is attached, basically I need to run from the power switch to the Wion, once there the hot connects to L, COM2 and COM1 (direct to one, solid jumpers to the others). Neutral to "N" and spliced to run to the heater and pump, either connected to "N" if possible or more likely wire nuts. Ground would be spliced to each (pump/heater). This just helps me think about it more clearly in terms of actual wire runs and the required conduit, connectors etc.

wiring.jpg
 
It seems what is missing is a ground screw on the switch/timer unit, I guess they just didn't include it in the "logical" wiring diagram but based on your links it seems there is one in the box.
 
Please understand I don't have enough experience to provide guidance on wiring. If I provide less than accurate advice, I hope I am corrected. I can tell you how my electrical is set up. I have two hots and a ground coming from the panel. The two 110v lines make up the 220v. These lines connect to L and N (Line In). My pump is connected to NO1 and NO2 (Load 1). This leaves NC1 and NC2 available for a second load. I have two grounds connected to the terminal in the box. In your case, you would have three (line in, pump, heater). You will not have independent control of your heater and pump. They will turn off/on at the same time. Below is a photo showing the jumper configuration for 220v.

20180518_074520.jpg
 
One more pic of my installation. Both hot lines in (L and N) are purple. Pump is orange and purple (Load) connected to NO1 and NO2. Be careful with the knockouts. They are set for 1/2" with an outer ring knockout for 3/4". I knocked out both and had to pick up some 3/4" to 1/2" washers.
20180518_173442.jpg

There is a third knockout on the right side of the box.

When you receive your unit, check to make sure the external antenna wire is connected to the back of the circuit board. You will need to remove the module from the box (4 screws). Mine was disconnected when I removed the module.
 
Last edited:
Rancho Cost-a-Lotta said:
Please understand I don't have enough experience to provide guidance on wiring. If I provide less than accurate advice, I hope I am corrected. I can tell you how my electrical is set up. I have two hots and a ground coming from the panel. The two 110v lines make up the 220v. These lines connect to L and N (Line In). My pump is connected to NO1 and NO2 (Load 1). This leaves NC1 and NC2 available for a second load. I have two grounds connected to the terminal in the box. In your case, you would have three (line in, pump, heater). You will not have independent control of your heater and pump. They will turn off/on at the same time. Below is a photo showing the jumper configuration for 220v.

View attachment 79689
Click to expand...

Thank you so much for this, one question though, your purples confuse me a little, are you saying you have two 110v live feeds connected, one to L and one to N? I though N was for the neutral wire. Looking at your photo it looks as though you have two conduit connections, I assume one is the feed coming in and the other goes to the load (pump/heater whatever). Not sure I get why you have a purple to N, I was expecting two purple wires going to L?
 
I think it's starting to make sense (to me). Looks like you have two separate purple load wires coming in and the ground, the purples are connected to L and N, the third purple is the feed going out from NO1. Jumpers L to COM2 (black) and N to COM1 (white) then the second feed (orange) going out to the pump. Essentially you have (I think) two purple loads coming in and a purple and orange load going out.

I think what I am seeing is different as I will have two separate loads going out. Main think I need to do is pop the cover off my switch and take a peek at hopw it is wired, basically whether it is a single 220v feed (hot, neutral ground) or a paired 110v feed like yours.
 
ukchris said:
I think it's starting to make sense (to me). Looks like you have two separate purple load wires coming in and the ground, the purples are connected to L and N, the third purple is the feed going out from NO1. Jumpers L to COM2 (black) and N to COM1 (white) then the second feed (orange) going out to the pump. Essentially you have (I think) two purple loads coming in and a purple and orange load going out.

Correct.

The other question is whether you should be concerned about your heater shutting down at the same time as your pump. You heater will have no power to evacuate residual heat or exhaust. You may have already, but check your heater manual.
Click to expand...
 
UK,

I feel like seeing myself in your shoes but that was many years ago. Been there, done that! I grew up on a 240V feed and when I first exposed myself into something new to me, my head spun wildly. Say what?..why?, how did that happen???

You are confusing yourself with the electrical colour coding you grew up with against the schematic diagram. My personal advice, set aside the color coding for now. Focus primarily on the circuit diagram, follow the path and visualize how it should work as presented. When everything is said and done, use the applicable IEC electrical color code.
check this out--> https://p3connectors.com/2018/04/30/electrical-wiring-colours-standards/
 

Enjoying this content?

Support TFP with a donation.

Give Support
You must log in or register to reply here.
Thread Status
Hello , This thread has been inactive for over 60 days. New postings here are unlikely to be seen or responded to by other members. For better visibility, consider Starting A New Thread.
Top Bottom
Back
Jump to latest Follow Reply